Warbird Information Exchange

I have had the exact same reaction several times.

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Ain't no sunshine when she's gone!

A number of years ago at the EAA Airventure at Oshkosh, I was sitiing in on a seminar given by Scott Crossfield who was among other things an X-15 pilot. During his talk he made a statement which I thought was extremely strange. He said "destroy all warbirds". When asked by a member of the audience about that statement, he said its a waste of money to keep so many warbirds around.

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Ain't no sunshine when she's gone!

Was he a combat vet, Pat?

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Defending Stearmans on WIX since Jeff started badmouthing them back in 2005.

Scott Crossfield was a U.S. naval aviator in WWII but was assigned as an instructor and did not see combat before the war ended, to the best of my knowledge.

On the general subject of this thread, I've had many veterans approach a warbird that I was flying at an air show or other event and express joy at seeing it still fly. These old planes really are "time machines" for those who flew in them and the memories can be good or very bad. Just watch them sit in them and "go back". One of my best experiences with this was when I flew the CAF Curtiss SB2C Helldiver to a Helldiver reunion and after several pilots and gunners had sat in their old seats, one widow of a Helldiver pilot asked if she could sit in the cockpit. Naturally we made that happen and after a couple of minutes looking around the cockpit, she turned to me and basically said "Thank you so much! Now I know what my husband was talking about." So, while some may have problems with our "time machines", I think it would be wrong not to keep on flying them as a tribute to those who served in, built or maintained them and their loved ones. That said, I certainly respect those veterans that have the bad memories. My 2 cents.

Randy

As Randy just said, respect the guys who don't want to remember war. How many on this forum have met vets who teared up because we care enough to preserve warbirds?

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"I love the smell of 100LL in the morning."

Like the others have said, some guys handle stress differently. I'm sure there are more than a few ex-infantry guys who don't hunt or have firearms for the same reason.

Or perhaps the man in question simply isn't a history fan.
Remember, some folks just like new stuff, they figure "why have old homes, furniture, cars..."...while others make them their lives.

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Remember the vets, the wonderful planes they flew and their sacrifices for a future many of them did not live to see.
Note political free signature.
I figure if you wanted my opinion on items unrelated to this forum, you'd ask for it.

My father was on the ground crew of a B24. He would never talk about it and told me that he had no pictures. After his death, I found a picture of him in front of "his" B24, which I enlarged and have hanging at my desk at work (complete with the coffee stain that was on the original). I later found out she was lost over Germany with the loss of the 2nd crew.



He is the guy on the left. He was a founding member of a VFW Post and an American Legion Post. At his funeral, I found out he would talk about the war with other vets,

His brother was a Navy Corsair pilot. To this day, I cannot get him to talk about his service.

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May all your bent wings be F2G Corsairs!

My father spent 6 years in WW2 in the RAAF. When I was younger and getting interested in warbirds etc I often asked him why they didn't seem to keep even "famous" aircraft in many instances. His answer was that the war was over. These aircraft etc were tools. we've downed tools and getting on with our lives.

Years later he was very proud when I purchased a B-25 and other stuff and followed every move until his death. My father-in-law was USAAF B-17 combat guy. I asked him about his views and he said, look we were just interested in doing our job and staying alive. In his 80's I re-introduced him to YAF B-17 and he was crying. He was happy with the efforts of the few who saved/restored/fly/maintain/sponsor/fund and support the current warbird fleet.

Some folks of course simply want to forget. That is their right.

I think it has to be hard for those who've seen the worst, to watch folks 'glorifying' it. In my mind there is a huge difference in 'remembering' the sacrifice, then in glorifying it and I think it gets crossed often

It makes perfect sense to me that some vets, in particular those who've seen war up close and personal, would not want to have it put back in front of them. Seems to me most of them wanted to move forward and get on with their lives.

And as others have mentioned, no one deals with their experiences exactly the same.

I'm glad you have brought up this "other side of the coin" to ponder. It's easy to get caught up in the splendor of these machines and think that everyone just has to love them. But the reality is they represent some very horrible decisions people were forced to make, such as taking the lives of other men and women. And the horror of being shot at yourself, and losing friends. I believe it is just as important to hear the stories of those who do not like our preservation of them as those who praise it. I also think it is important to share their opinions as much as those who are pleased by these restorations.

I believe the business of restoring and preserving these machines is two-fold. On one hand you're preserving a specific story from a military perspective, but you're also telling a story of innovation and technology. After walking through an entire hangar worth of warbirds going through their annual inspections, it is absolutely astonishing what advances in technology took place during such a short period of time. You're also telling the story of the designers, engineers, assemblers, etc. not "just" the men on the front lines.

Every single restored aircraft out there is its own documentary screaming to be produced. I wish more folks could do this.

That's my $.02

I agree - and that's part of the reason to keep these airplanes around, and preserved, and displayed both in the air or on the ground; because it's important that we never forget what happened in our past. It's important that we remember it, and it's important that those people and stories who are our past, both good and bad, happy and sad, heroic and tragic, be remembered. The B-25 that limped home with a dead tail gunner cut in half by cannon fire - that's a horrible memory for anyone who was part of that story to have to remember, and I can completely understand their desire to want to forget it, but at the same time I think it's very, very wrong for us to allow that story and that sacrifice to be forgotten. It's a complex issue, and you have to respect everyone's opinion on it because just about everyone is coming at it from their own unique perspective.

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Defending Stearmans on WIX since Jeff started badmouthing them back in 2005.

Some outstanding observations in this thread, which is nice to see. For those who might wonder why a veteran would say such a thing, I would strongly recommend you find a copy of Bert Stiles' "Serenade To The Big Bird", and read it. There is nothing like it anywhere else... I've never found another source which so strongly communicates the gut-tightening fear coupled with the total mental and physical exhaustion that results from daily long-range missions to bomb the snot out of people you don't even know, while watching friends get blown to bits or burnt to a crisp before your eyes.

If anything, I'm surprised more bomber crewmen don't have this visceral reaction upon seeing their old planes again... I suppose a large part of it has to do with how bad their experience was during the war. For instance, I'm willing to bet if we were able to take a poll, not many guys from the 100th BG who flew to Berlin would be anxious to see a B-17 again.

At the risk of sounding like a broken record, though, anyone who has the faintest interest in WWII aviation history should try to get a copy of "Serenade". It's a surprisingly brief book, you can read it in a day or two, but I promise it will move you.

Lynn

In ten years of flying an airplane which participated in a war that to this day produces some of the most vile comments, I have only had one bad comment. After flying in the Vietnam Demo, two men met me as I left the sterile area with one yelling at me that my plane killed his best friend. He was quite upset and would not stop. I chose not to respond and escalate the tempers. His friend later found me and apologized. The friend explained the other man’s friend or brother (not knowing which) was an observer in an O-2 when they were shot down and killed. For some reason, the man blamed the pilot and the plane, not the enemy for the shoot down.

Over the years, the comments from the Vets who were there have ranged from “Good Job”, “Good Looking Airplane” to trembling with tears explaining how the demo took them right back to their experiences in country.

All and all the last comment I receive is “Thank You for telling our history.”

In years past when I flew WWII planes, the only bad comment I received was from my own Mom who thought we were “glorifying war” but she had her own difficulty dealing with my Dad having been a military pilot.

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Well I would say that is how he feels, and that he has a right to his opinion. I still thank him for his service. I have had the privilege to work on several WWII aircraft, and the honor to be on hand when veterans would be present. Some of them on tours and others working right next to me trying to restore an aircraft. Each time I saw it as a chance to learn.
I can tell you this, last year myself along with a group of friends took a static and faded C-47 and cleaned it up and painted it in a veteran's markings(Jim Haus's C-47 named "Do It"). We then got him to see it, and had his whole family down to climb in and sit in it. His son(also a WIX member) even helped work on the plane with us. Mr Haus passed away a few weeks after the dedication, and his son Bob told us, "You helped make a WWII veteran's final days among his happiest". I tell this story not to sound like we are patting ourselves on the back. But because of just how special this event was. If our Warbird Rescue project does nothing else ever, I would still consider it a success.
I talked to Bud Anderson last week on our show and asked him how it felt to see a restored aircraft in his markings. He said, "It's such a special feeling. Guys would give up body parts to have their aircraft recreated on a restored airplane."

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Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Manager

About 30 years ago one of my clients was a WWII Mustang pilot; I found this out during casual conversation. He said when he parked his plane prior to discharge he had no desire to get back in one and had walked away from aviation and flying.

Earlier this year the local newspaper had an article about him taking a flight in a B-17 and his positive reaction that experience.