Warbird Information Exchange

DISCLAIMER: The views expressed on this site are the responsibility of the poster and do not reflect the views of the management.
It is currently Sun May 11, 2025 6:28 pm

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Classic Wings Magazine WWII Naval Aviation Research Pacific Luftwaffe Resource Center
When Hollywood Ruled The Skies - Volumes 1 through 4 by Bruce Oriss


Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 96 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7  Next
Author Message
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2009 6:25 am 
Offline
1000+ Posts!
1000+ Posts!
User avatar

Joined: Sat May 01, 2004 1:54 am
Posts: 1073
Location: UK
Glyn wrote:
Sorry to disappoint all you 'movie-lovers', but having seen the original documentary by William Wylder I couldn't bring myself to watch the modern dramatised version. The irony is the Memphis Belle was NOT the first B-17 to complete 25 missions.


You mustn't let true historic facts get in the way of a good Hollywood film script.

On the 65th anniversary of the actual 'Great Escape' from Stalag Luft III, this in today's 'The Times' of London.

PeterA

Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2009 6:34 am 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Tue May 11, 2004 5:42 pm
Posts: 6884
Location: The Goldfields, Victoria, Australia
Hmmm.

David Putnam wanted to make a film about Bomber Command. Simplistically, he couldn't get funding, the idea of a film 'that took place mainly at night' was a problem for some(!) and then he hooked up with Catherine Wyler, and the rest was fiction... sorry, I mean history. ;)

There is a good chunk of real Bomber Command in Memphis Belle (1989) if you know where to look.

Funny how the offended Brits never push The Sound Barrier as their version of re-written history when we get all glass-houses and stones about these things. Enigma played fast and loose with some real nationalities involved too, but that was the Poles, so even further down the financial pecking order.

IMHO, if you get your history through film - even ostensible documentaries - you'll get the 'history' you deserve.

_________________
James K

"Switch on the underwater landing lights"
Emilio Largo, Thunderball.

www.VintageAeroWriter.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2009 9:03 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2005 12:23 am
Posts: 321
JDK wrote:

The original (real) Memphis Belle was the first to complete the 25 missions and go home.


Split hairs if you must. My statement was factually correct.

The detail of the true story is well documented for those who can research.

And of course we can all research, and come to our own conclusions.
One doesn't have to be a journo to do that, thank goodness.


Just my view.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2009 9:40 am 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Tue May 11, 2004 5:42 pm
Posts: 6884
Location: The Goldfields, Victoria, Australia
Sorry Glyn, I didn't suggest your statement wasn't factually correct - the correct statement I put forward related to the Memphis Belle was including the rest of the sentence usually left off, because of sloppy journalism.

Whatever.

_________________
James K

"Switch on the underwater landing lights"
Emilio Largo, Thunderball.

www.VintageAeroWriter.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2009 9:40 am 
Offline
3000+ Post Club
3000+ Post Club
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 27, 2005 10:51 pm
Posts: 4666
Location: Cheshire, CT
PeterA wrote:
Glyn wrote:
Sorry to disappoint all you 'movie-lovers', but having seen the original documentary by William Wylder I couldn't bring myself to watch the modern dramatised version. The irony is the Memphis Belle was NOT the first B-17 to complete 25 missions.


You mustn't let true historic facts get in the way of a good Hollywood film script.

On the 65th anniversary of the actual 'Great Escape' from Stalag Luft III, this in today's 'The Times' of London.

PeterA

Image


I can see his point to a degree, but two of the "Americans" he mentions in his editorial actually play a Pole and an Australian. So now we're down to two. The McQueen stuff is true, but it was sure exciting. Can the writer even imagine how upset Americans would be if the lead role and several subordinate roles in "Band Of Brothers" were played by English actors! :shock:
OH, WAIT! THEY WERE!!!!:lol:

"Objective Burma" was an entirely fictitious story, most likely designed to bring that part of the war to Americans. He must remember that we were fighting a war then and if the British wanted to make their own "Objective Burma' then the could have done so.

"Saving Private Ryan" is another totally fictitious story, so in reality, what does it matter who they were up against. You could pull apart almost every film ever made in this way. "Where Eagles Dare"? They explain why Clint is there, but under this author's microscope, that film is a shambles!

"U-571" is a total rip off of history, but it is fictitious also.

These films were all designed to make money first, entertain, and maybe tell some history. And granted, there have been some real "bombs" dropped by Hollywood over the years that didn't tell and accurate story, were boring, and didn't make any money!

I love movies, and I'm in a fringe area of the business, but even the truly accurate films have some latitude with the facts so that the story can be followed, understood and be able to create an emotional bond between the characters and the audience, all within 90 to 120 minutes.

My two cents, but it makes for a great discussion!
Blue skies,
Jerry

_________________
"Always remember that, when you enter the ocean or the forest, you are no longer at the top of the food chain."


Last edited by Jerry O'Neill on Wed Mar 25, 2009 10:35 am, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2009 10:08 am 
Offline
1000+ Posts!
1000+ Posts!
User avatar

Joined: Sat May 01, 2004 1:54 am
Posts: 1073
Location: UK
Still.

PeterA

Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2009 10:17 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2005 12:23 am
Posts: 321
Good post Jerry. :) Most of us have a sense of proportion, and can also see the humour. It helps to be able to laugh at oneself. British actors NEED the Hollywood dream factory. They are often there to play the 'baddies' when some precious thespian fears his adoring fans will not appreciate him being beastly. Notice in 'Masada' all the 'horrible' Romans were played by Brits and the 'wunnerful wunnerful' Jews were played by Americans? You want to watch these Brits as they will stop at nothing. The quintessential Englishman Hugh Laurie is a case in point. He has become House and telegenically(?) sports a Yasser Arafat stubble as well as an American accent. Look back to the time when he played the part of Bertie Wooster - and weep for him!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2009 10:34 am 
Offline
3000+ Post Club
3000+ Post Club
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 27, 2005 10:51 pm
Posts: 4666
Location: Cheshire, CT
Glyn wrote:
Good post Jerry. :) Most of us have a sense of proportion, and can also see the humour. It helps to be able to laugh at oneself. British actors NEED the Hollywood dream factory. They are often there to play the 'baddies' when some precious thespian fears his adoring fans will not appreciate him being beastly. Notice in 'Masada' all the 'horrible' Romans were played by Brits and the 'wunnerful wunnerful' Jews were played by Americans? You want to watch these Brits as they will stop at nothing. The quintessential Englishman Hugh Laurie is a case in point. He has become House and telegenically(?) sports a Yasser Arafat stubble as well as an American accent. Look back to the time when he played the part of Bertie Wooster - and weep for him!


Thanks for the comment. And thanks for taking in the vein it was intended for!
I think the British "baddie" has been around for a long time. Just look at Ben-Hur and everything in between!
What amazes some people when I talk about the DVD's that I actually own is that the only TV series collections I have are British produced shows. (Folye's War, All Creatures, Monty Python, Faulty Towers, etc.)
My wife and I love them! I'm just hoping for an "Extras" DVD set for Father's Day!
Jerry

_________________
"Always remember that, when you enter the ocean or the forest, you are no longer at the top of the food chain."


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2009 10:45 am 
Offline
3000+ Post Club
3000+ Post Club
User avatar

Joined: Thu May 18, 2006 3:08 pm
Posts: 4542
Location: chicago
JDK wrote:


The mismatch is 'obvious' because the authentic schemes give it away - the B-17s have star in a ball markings, the Mustangs star and bar...
.


darn, I didn't even catch that. :oops: :oops: It was such a brief moment on the screen though.

_________________
.
.
Sure, Charles Lindbergh flew the plane... but Tom Rutledge built the engine!

Visit Django Studios online or Facebook!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2009 11:03 am 
Offline
3000+ Post Club
3000+ Post Club
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2006 12:56 pm
Posts: 3442
Location: North of Texas, South of Kansas
Django wrote:
JDK wrote:


The mismatch is 'obvious' because the authentic schemes give it away - the B-17s have star in a ball markings, the Mustangs star and bar...
.


darn, I didn't even catch that. :oops: :oops: It was such a brief moment on the screen though.


The C-47 in the photo Peter just posted has the later star-and-bars also.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2009 11:18 am 
Offline
2000+ Post Club
2000+ Post Club

Joined: Tue Jun 14, 2005 10:16 am
Posts: 2304
Glyn wrote:
Sorry to disappoint all you 'movie-lovers', but having seen the original documentary by William Wylder I couldn't bring myself to watch the modern dramatised version. The irony is the Memphis Belle was NOT the first B-17 to complete 25 missions.

Do you also avoid airshows because the warbirds aren't flown by WWII combat vets? :roll:

_________________
Those who possess real knowledge are rare.

Those who can set that knowledge into motion in the physical world are rarer still.

The few who possess real knowledge and can set it into motion of their own hands are the rarest of all.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2009 11:28 am 
Offline
3000+ Post Club
3000+ Post Club

Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2005 7:26 pm
Posts: 4969
Location: PA
ZRX61 wrote:
Glyn wrote:
Sorry to disappoint all you 'movie-lovers', but having seen the original documentary by William Wylder I couldn't bring myself to watch the modern dramatised version. The irony is the Memphis Belle was NOT the first B-17 to complete 25 missions.

Do you also avoid airshows because the warbirds aren't flown by WWII combat vets? :roll:


(trying to make light of the upcoming brawl :hide: ),No but that would be awesome. I have actually seen a few WWII warbirds flown by wwii vets. Now that is indeed special and very cool. :D

_________________
Shop the Airplane Bunker At
www.warbirdbunker.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:04 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2005 12:23 am
Posts: 321
ZRX61 wrote:
Do you also avoid airshows because the warbirds aren't flown by WWII combat vets? :roll:


No, my electronic alpha-numeric friend. I avoid them these days for a number of reasons (expense, crowds, traffic congestion and the same old types being flown ad infinitum). Oh, plus the fact that I used to take part in displays and I'm so glad I no longer have to do so. :D I must admit that I can't recall the last time I saw genuine WW2 aviators strut their stuff. Probably in the 1950s. :oops:


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2009 2:20 pm 
Offline
1000+ Posts!
1000+ Posts!
User avatar

Joined: Sat May 01, 2004 1:54 am
Posts: 1073
Location: UK
Fortress Fan wrote:
Quote:
Yes but not as good as that one. I wanted to get all three in shot.

Peter, I think this photo was a time before the filming as the other 2 B-17s are Mary Alice, and Thunderbird, Both of which did not take part in the film.
Good photo anyway


I am indebted to Tony Clarke for steering me toward June 1987 for the threesome B-17 shot at Duxford, a clear two years ahead of 'Belle' filming.

Age takes its toll. :oops:

Another still.

PeterA

Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2009 3:52 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2006 6:37 am
Posts: 830
Location: Chrishall Grange ~ England
Quote:
June 1987 for the threesome B-17 shot at Duxford


Its STILL a stunning picture Peter and thank you for sharing it !

I've always wondered what did "they" do with all the movie footage taken that didn't go into the finished film.

I seem to recall that the P-51's did a lot of flying on the visits I made to Duxford and yet they account for only at best 5 minutes of the action.

_________________
Blue Skies .....

Peter

Consolidated by US state ~ see if there's a heavy bomber tour stop coming to an airport near you ...... http://www.bomberflight.info

Warbirdapps on facebook ~ every day a new image from my personal journey thru the world of warbirds ..... https://www.facebook.com/Warbirdapps


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 96 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot], Google Adsense [Bot] and 315 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group