Making the movie "Memphis Belle" ~ 1989

[PeterA]

Sorry to disappoint all you 'movie-lovers', but having seen the original documentary by William Wylder I couldn't bring myself to watch the modern dramatised version. The irony is the Memphis Belle was NOT the first B-17 to complete 25 missions.

You mustn't let true historic facts get in the way of a good Hollywood film script.

On the 65th anniversary of the actual 'Great Escape' from Stalag Luft III, this in today's 'The Times' of London.

PeterA

[JDK]

Hmmm.

David Putnam wanted to make a film about Bomber Command. Simplistically, he couldn't get funding, the idea of a film 'that took place mainly at night' was a problem for some(!) and then he hooked up with Catherine Wyler, and the rest was fiction... sorry, I mean history.

There is a good chunk of real Bomber Command in Memphis Belle (1989) if you know where to look.

Funny how the offended Brits never push The Sound Barrier as their version of re-written history when we get all glass-houses and stones about these things. Enigma played fast and loose with some real nationalities involved too, but that was the Poles, so even further down the financial pecking order.

IMHO, if you get your history through film - even ostensible documentaries - you'll get the 'history' you deserve.

[Glyn]

The original (real) Memphis Belle was the first to complete the 25 missions and go home.


Split hairs if you must. My statement was factually correct.

The detail of the true story is well documented for those who can research.

And of course we can all research, and come to our own conclusions.
One doesn't have to be a journo to do that, thank goodness.


Just my view.

[JDK]

Sorry Glyn, I didn't suggest your statement wasn't factually correct - the correct statement I put forward related to the Memphis Belle was including the rest of the sentence usually left off, because of sloppy journalism.

Whatever.

[Jerry O'Neill]

Sorry to disappoint all you 'movie-lovers', but having seen the original documentary by William Wylder I couldn't bring myself to watch the modern dramatised version. The irony is the Memphis Belle was NOT the first B-17 to complete 25 missions.

You mustn't let true historic facts get in the way of a good Hollywood film script.

On the 65th anniversary of the actual 'Great Escape' from Stalag Luft III, this in today's 'The Times' of London.

PeterA

I can see his point to a degree, but two of the "Americans" he mentions in his editorial actually play a Pole and an Australian. So now we're down to two. The McQueen stuff is true, but it was sure exciting. Can the writer even imagine how upset Americans would be if the lead role and several subordinate roles in "Band Of Brothers" were played by English actors!
OH, WAIT! THEY WERE!!!!:lol:

"Objective Burma" was an entirely fictitious story, most likely designed to bring that part of the war to Americans. He must remember that we were fighting a war then and if the British wanted to make their own "Objective Burma' then the could have done so.

"Saving Private Ryan" is another totally fictitious story, so in reality, what does it matter who they were up against. You could pull apart almost every film ever made in this way. "Where Eagles Dare"? They explain why Clint is there, but under this author's microscope, that film is a shambles!

"U-571" is a total rip off of history, but it is fictitious also.

These films were all designed to make money first, entertain, and maybe tell some history. And granted, there have been some real "bombs" dropped by Hollywood over the years that didn't tell and accurate story, were boring, and didn't make any money!

I love movies, and I'm in a fringe area of the business, but even the truly accurate films have some latitude with the facts so that the story can be followed, understood and be able to create an emotional bond between the characters and the audience, all within 90 to 120 minutes.

My two cents, but it makes for a great discussion!
Blue skies,
Jerry

Last edited by Jerry O'Neill on Wed Mar 25, 2009 10:35 am, edited 1 time in total.

[PeterA]

Still.

PeterA

[Glyn]

Good post Jerry. Most of us have a sense of proportion, and can also see the humour. It helps to be able to laugh at oneself. British actors NEED the Hollywood dream factory. They are often there to play the 'baddies' when some precious thespian fears his adoring fans will not appreciate him being beastly. Notice in 'Masada' all the 'horrible' Romans were played by Brits and the 'wunnerful wunnerful' Jews were played by Americans? You want to watch these Brits as they will stop at nothing. The quintessential Englishman Hugh Laurie is a case in point. He has become House and telegenically(?) sports a Yasser Arafat stubble as well as an American accent. Look back to the time when he played the part of Bertie Wooster - and weep for him!

[Jerry O'Neill]

Good post Jerry. Most of us have a sense of proportion, and can also see the humour. It helps to be able to laugh at oneself. British actors NEED the Hollywood dream factory. They are often there to play the 'baddies' when some precious thespian fears his adoring fans will not appreciate him being beastly. Notice in 'Masada' all the 'horrible' Romans were played by Brits and the 'wunnerful wunnerful' Jews were played by Americans? You want to watch these Brits as they will stop at nothing. The quintessential Englishman Hugh Laurie is a case in point. He has become House and telegenically(?) sports a Yasser Arafat stubble as well as an American accent. Look back to the time when he played the part of Bertie Wooster - and weep for him!

Thanks for the comment. And thanks for taking in the vein it was intended for!
I think the British "baddie" has been around for a long time. Just look at Ben-Hur and everything in between!
What amazes some people when I talk about the DVD's that I actually own is that the only TV series collections I have are British produced shows. (Folye's War, All Creatures, Monty Python, Faulty Towers, etc.)
My wife and I love them! I'm just hoping for an "Extras" DVD set for Father's Day!
Jerry

[Django]

The mismatch is 'obvious' because the authentic schemes give it away - the B-17s have star in a ball markings, the Mustangs star and bar...
.

darn, I didn't even catch that. It was such a brief moment on the screen though.

[Second Air Force]

The mismatch is 'obvious' because the authentic schemes give it away - the B-17s have star in a ball markings, the Mustangs star and bar...
.

darn, I didn't even catch that. It was such a brief moment on the screen though.

The C-47 in the photo Peter just posted has the later star-and-bars also.

[ZRX61]

Sorry to disappoint all you 'movie-lovers', but having seen the original documentary by William Wylder I couldn't bring myself to watch the modern dramatised version. The irony is the Memphis Belle was NOT the first B-17 to complete 25 missions.

Do you also avoid airshows because the warbirds aren't flown by WWII combat vets?

[Nathan]

Sorry to disappoint all you 'movie-lovers', but having seen the original documentary by William Wylder I couldn't bring myself to watch the modern dramatised version. The irony is the Memphis Belle was NOT the first B-17 to complete 25 missions.

Do you also avoid airshows because the warbirds aren't flown by WWII combat vets?

(trying to make light of the upcoming brawl ),No but that would be awesome. I have actually seen a few WWII warbirds flown by wwii vets. Now that is indeed special and very cool.

[Glyn]

Do you also avoid airshows because the warbirds aren't flown by WWII combat vets?

No, my electronic alpha-numeric friend. I avoid them these days for a number of reasons (expense, crowds, traffic congestion and the same old types being flown ad infinitum). Oh, plus the fact that I used to take part in displays and I'm so glad I no longer have to do so. I must admit that I can't recall the last time I saw genuine WW2 aviators strut their stuff. Probably in the 1950s.

[PeterA]

Yes but not as good as that one. I wanted to get all three in shot.

Peter, I think this photo was a time before the filming as the other 2 B-17s are Mary Alice, and Thunderbird, Both of which did not take part in the film.
Good photo anyway

I am indebted to Tony Clarke for steering me toward June 1987 for the threesome B-17 shot at Duxford, a clear two years ahead of 'Belle' filming.

Age takes its toll.

Another still.

PeterA

[bomberflight]

June 1987 for the threesome B-17 shot at Duxford

Its STILL a stunning picture Peter and thank you for sharing it !

I've always wondered what did "they" do with all the movie footage taken that didn't go into the finished film.

I seem to recall that the P-51's did a lot of flying on the visits I made to Duxford and yet they account for only at best 5 minutes of the action.