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Classic Wings Magazine WWII Naval Aviation Research Pacific Luftwaffe Resource Center
When Hollywood Ruled The Skies - Volumes 1 through 4 by Bruce Oriss


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2009 6:57 am 
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IndyJen wrote:
I don't want to be too long-winded or profligate with the pictures, but as long as people want to hear about it, I'll keep 'em coming ...

Great stuff, and it's even comprehensible to a professional aviation journalist, so you really are keeping it simple. Hell, you'll have pilots understanding it all next! :lol:

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2009 7:39 pm 
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Oh, James, that's pretty scary right there. Once you've got pilots thinking they understand, next thing you know, they're climbing all over your airplane with wrenches in their hands!

Which, actually, nearly all of our pilots on Hot Stuff pitch in with the maintenance very strenuously. One of them is a chief mechanic.

What can you do with guys like that, other than think they're all the bee's knees?

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2009 6:25 am 
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This has been a good week in Indiana, if you like snow. We had a dump of about a foot of the stuff Tuesday night/wednesday morning, and it's not going anywhere--the high temps won't get above freezing until Sunday, according to the forecast.

Here's what it looks like out at Mount Comfort Airport (pic courtesy of PJ, who stopped out there yesterday afternoon):

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There's an animated training film from WW2 ("Private Snafu"), which was drawn by Theodore Geisel (""Dr. Suess"). It's about operations in the Aleutians, and it features a walrus who is a caricature of Jimmy Durante. Any time the narrator complains about the conditions ("Deplorable conditions!") the walrus pops up to point out, "and yet, dem are the conditions dat prevail--hah cha cha cha!"

Dem's the conditions that prevail.

We still figure on hanging the prop tomorrow, among other things. And when we're done, we'll raise a glass to the poor sods in the Aleutians, sixty-four years ago ...

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2009 7:11 pm 
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Well, wasn't this week a disappointment?

Maybe not for you, but out at Mount Comfort on the Harpoon ramp, the forecast sure scored a great big duck egg for accuracy. Instead of mid-to-upper '30's, we arrived to find still a foot of snow on the ground, both of our usual access gates snowed in and frozen, and an entire eight degrees of fahrenheit to work outdoors in.

Man. Maaan.

I know; I know. I made the big talk about the "conditions that prevail," and emulating our heroes from back in the day in the Aleutians, but c'mon. Back in the days, the heroes were twenty years old. Boys and girls, ol' IndyJen has seen Fifty come and go, and some of the others in our little group make her look like a spring chicken. That cold gets cold!

Still, we might have given it the old college try, but for a mis-marked paint can. A little touch-up on the prop blades earlier in the week, and when we arrived, why look at the flat black spots on the satin-black rest of the blade (our blades are flat-color only on the aft face). Aw! The ensuing repaint meant that we didn't want to be picking that thing up that day, and then it was easy to consider that the bitter cold might, you know, make those seals not seal up good, and who knows what other bad things ... you know, the prudent thing might be to just let that thing go for another, warmer, day.

So, no prop-hanging pics this week, WIXers. But this coming Saturday, all will be in readiness, and we'll get 'er done this time for sure.

We did manage to do a few things, even so, but it was a sluggish day out there. Sometimes, people just need a break, perhaps. We've been hitting it at a pretty fierce tempo, what with prepping the engine and all. Guess that's the best excuse we can come up with, anyhow.

This week's Plan B activities included some work in the cockpit.

Machine Shop Gaylon has been working on some new floorboards. The old left-side floor, a piece of plywood that replaced the 1/2-inch armor plate that was there in wartime, was in sorry shape. Much too thin to support the rudder gust lock, it was cracked and no use anymore. Gaylon is working up a full-thickness wood-and-aluminum composite sandwich that will be heavy-duty but light. He and PJ got up there to size it up, figure out the placement of fasteners and locate any interferences. We expect that to mebbe be going in this coming weekend, and it'll be nice, to have a working gust lock for the rudder again.

Two of our pilots, Glen the Extremely Tall and Scotty, worked on putting together the mag switches for reinstallation, against the coming day when we'll be running this new engine.

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There they are at the bench, and here's a shot of the thing going back into the engine-controls pedestal:

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The little tags had fallen off the p-leads after a couple months of frigid temps, so Glen had to do a little ohmmeter detective work to work out which was which. No problem for him, and that's all taken care of now.

Meanwhile, a little cleanup of the installed prop was going on, because conditions did improve some as the day progressed--there was a window of opportunity where the temps got up above intolerable, before the big winds started blowing.

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Yep, there's IndyJen, moaning about being Too Old For This Crap, but those prop bolts need to be inspected, so what can you do?

Back inside the plane, we had some structural things to attend to, and a bit of sheet-metal work was needed. Johnny Gearpin is our man for that:

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The structure back by the tunnel windows isn't the beefiest, and sixty years of landings were starting some cracks in the bulkhead just forward of the glass. We had some very nice patches worked up by a sheetmetal whiz--whose name I am completely at a loss for, all of a sudden, but I'll fix that in a later post, 'cause credit where it's due--and J. Gearpin took on the job of shooting the rivets. We're good to go back there now.

Image

That's a look at what we were living with. A little plowing the day before, and some hand-shoveling by PJ early in the day, and by the end, the sun had actually given us a bit of bare ramp. We were a day early, basically: the next day, temps were in the 40s, and it felt practically springlike.

This coming Saturday, we'll have that prop on there for sure, and it'll be time to get cracking on the engine-compartment hookups as well. It's been a long time since we heard that engine roar, but it won't be long now.

Till next time,

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 08, 2009 9:15 am 
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Hey WIX people, here's a riddle for you:

Q: What's big and blue, and has two engines and two props?

A: As of yesterday afternoon, Hot Stuff.

Yes, the big thaw is upon us. Two big snowstorms in two weeks, and frigid temperatures that would freeze the bits right off yourself, but Friday there began the warm-up, and it continued yesterday. A good day for working outside. Given that, and given that everything's been prepared and ready to go, let's hang that prop, shall we?

There's a very nice photo essay in the Diamond Lil thread on How to Remove a Hamilton Standard Hydromatic Prop--a very excellent source for refreshing one's memory on the sequence of events--but I never did find one for the reverse procedure. So I thought that this might be a good opportunity to do such an essay for Putting the Prop Back On. We've done this a number of times now, but hopefully, it will be long enough before we have to do it again, that we'll need a memory-refresher!

To start with, let's have a look at all the parts, laid out where we can have a good look at them ...

Image

On the left is the dome, which contains the piston and drive gear. Because we (per the book) manually twisted the prop blades before removal, the drive gear is against the feathering stop (88 degrees). This gives us a datum for setting things up for reinstallation.

Under the dome is its rubber seal, which fits around the base, and the dome-to-hub shim. The shim, selected via an enormously complicated mathematical formula, matches the hub to the dome with optimum gear lash. You only need to do the math if you've changed components. We're just putting the original stuff back together, so we just use the same shim as before.

Inside the shim is the breather nut and its gasket. This item plugs the dome. For installation, a handle is screwed into its location in the dome.

Above the shim, from left to right: rear cone, which seats and centers the prop hub on the shaft; three-piece spider/shaft seal assembly; three-piece prop nut and split forward cone (secures the prop and centers it on the shaft, like the rear cone), and below it the prop-nut snap ring; and on the right, the distributor valve, its snap ring, and distributor valve gasket.

Let's hang a prop, then!

Having borrowed the forklift from our friendly and supportive FBO, Indy Aero, the first thing to do is to get the prop in the air with the forward side facing the forklift.

Image

That, of course, is the exact opposite of what I just described. We're about to turn her around to face the right way. Everything in this process needs to be done nice and slow and carefully, 'cause props aren't free by any means, neither to buy nor to repair. So, no banging of the prop blades into anything, and no dropping it, for sure!

Image

While these preparations are going on, we removed the barrier paper from the prop shaft and cleaned off all the oil with MEK. The shaft has to be clean and dry when you slip the rear cone into place--you can see it there, at the aft end of the shaft. Once the cone's there, then you lube up the shaft splines again, and the prop-nut threads. No oil under the cone, however; the book's very specific about that.

We've also already clocked the prop shaft so that the master spline (twice as big as the other spline teeth) is at the six o'clock position. This correlates to where the mating spline groove in the prop hub will be when we pick it up.

Image

So, with everything ready, we lift up the prop and walk it slowly and carefully over to the plane, and get 'er lined up, and head up to the prop shaft. The prop shaft has fine threads on the end, just waiting to be boogered up, so once we're up there, we're moving things fractions of an inch at a time.

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Now we can see the splines all lining up, and down just a little, and it starts on there. Once it starts to slide on, lower the forklift to slack the hoisting straps a tiny bit, and two people can easily wiggle it on down the shaft until it meets up with the rear cone.

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Then it's remove the straps, and back the forklift out of there, and IndyJen can cease stressing over "omigawd, what if we drop the prop or bang it into the plane or ...", which is her way. Once it's on the shaft, it's not going anywhere, and now we can commence assembling the little parts from the first picture.

Image

First thing to go in is the spider/shaft seal, a 3-piece garlock seal consisting of a washer, an outer phenolic u-channel, and an inner metal v-channel. They go in in that order, with the open side facing forward.

This, actually, is one of the places we've identified in the otherwise excellent PV-2 erection manual where there's a critical error. The PV-2 manual shows this seal installed with the open side aft, which won't give you much of a seal at all. Our several Hamilton Standard prop manuals all agree that this would be exactly backward. We go with the the prop manufacturer on this one.

Anyhow, you put the washer in place, down in there, and then carefully and gently use a couple tiny-blade screwdrivers to push the other two components, nested together, into place.

With the seal in place, it's time to put in the prop nut.

Image

The prop nut and the two forward cone pieces fit together, and have to be installed together as a unit. Now, here's a tricky bit: when you finally put the dome on, at the end of this process, the blades have to be set to their feathered position (remember? the dome gear is pegged against the feathering stop?). Experience has taught us, however, that if the blades are feathered now, when we're trying to put in the nut, the gear geometry will just not let the cone get past, although you can get oh so close. Until this lesson was finally learned, oh, the frustration and profanity! But that was a long time ago. We know perfectly well to leave 'em in low pitch for now, so it starts right on there.

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Screw it on by hand for a few turns to make sure all is well, and then you can get out the combination prop wrench, which is a gadgeteer's delight. For the prop nut, you use the big socket along with the funny-shaped combo wrench. Screw it all the way down until it seats, and then employ the carefully calibrated book torque to finish ("get a fat man and a three-foot bar ...")

No, really. The book torque for this is a 180-pound weight on the end of a three-foot bar. So we slip a bar of the appropriate length into the socket on the end of the wrench, select the appropriate mechanic, and ...

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That's the basic torque. Then you get a big hammer.

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See the holes in the prop shaft, and the corresponding slots in the prop nut? One hole and one slot must line up. You can only tighten to make this happen; never loosen. Using the same combo wrench/big bar combination as before, put pressure on the bar and rap smartly (on the bar, not on the wrench itself, which is a casting) until you're there.

Then you can install the prop-nut snap ring. This snap ring, along with safetying the nut, lets you take the prop off again--when you back off the prop nut, it will come up against this snap ring, and jack the hub off its seat.

Now it's time to install the distributor valve. First its gasket:

Image

This item sits down in the bottom of the prop shaft cavity. Once it's in there, oil up the threads of the distributor valve, and carefully start it by hand. The threads are fine, and shallow, and easy to booger up. Boogering up the threads is not recommended. Be careful!

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The book wants you to turn it in three or four turns before putting the wrench to work. We take this to be an "at least" value, and turn it in by hand until it bottoms. Then you get out the combination wrench again, and use the open-end place that corresponds to the flats on the valve:

Image

Turn it down until it's ready for the actual torque, which is done similarly to the prop nut. This time, we want 100 pounds on a one-foot bar for the base torque.

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Once that's accomplished, it's time to get out the hammer again. Remember the alignment we did with the prop shaft and prop nut? The distributor valve also has machine-in slots, one of which must align with the hole/slot we previously matched up. Once again, keep pressure on the bar while smartly rapping it with the hammer, until you have the lineup.

This is why:

Image

See there, at about five o'clock? There's the lock ring, installed. It fits in an external groove in the prop nut, and goes through the previously aligned slot/hole/slot, making sure nothing moves from here on out.

Well, there we go. We're coming up on the end of the process now, and it's time to set the three blades to feathered position. There is a degree scale at the root of each blade. Hopefully you marked the position for each when you pulled the prop off way back when. The blades can be twisted by hand.

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Put the shim in place over the pins in the hub.

Image

Now put the rubber gasket on the base of the dome, and carefully lift it into position. Be careful not to damage the distributor valve when you're putting the heavy thing on there.

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When you pulled the prop, long ago, you made match-marks on the dome and on the hub, so you'd know which way to align them. Get those marks close and then, per the book, rotate the dome counter-clockwise (never clockwise) as needed until the pins in the hub go into the mating holes in the base of the dome. Clunk! It's down on there. Now you can start threading the big ring-nut into the hub, securing the dome.

That ring-nut needs to thread all the way down by hand until no threads are exposed. If it doesn't, the dome gear is not meshed with all three blade gears. What to do at that point? Manipulate the blades until you can "feel" which one is high-sided. It may be all three, or two of them, or just one. Once you get 'em meshed, remove the dome, and check those blade-root scales again.

They must be all the same. Each tooth in the gear is eight degrees of blade travel. If you need to adjust one or two blades, do so, matching up the position of the teeth as best you can, and then try again with the dome installation.

Do this procedure approximately three thousand times, until finally, the ring nut screws all the way down quite easily, and no blades have to be messed with, and they all stay the same.

If you have a bodybuilder in your group, he (or she) is the one to elect for this remove-the-dome/install-the-dome/remove-the-dome-again process. It's a heavy item. Lots of reps. Great for the delts, or the lats, or whatever the heck muscle group. I'm not sure which muscle group, actually. I'll check with Scotty, who was doing this yesterday, and find out where he's hurting today. Feel the burn, Scotty!

Anyhow, once you've solved the gear mesh problem, you can get out the dome-nut wrench.

Image

Once again it's fat-man torque, followed by the hammer to get the lock-screw hole in place. Install and safety that screw, and now you're almost done.

Remove the carrying handle from the dome, and in its place, install the breather nut. It's called a breather nut, because in some Ham-Std installations, there's an engine breather installed. Not in ours, however; that passage is just plugged. A washer and a special gasket make a three-piece installation, which screw into the same place where that handle was.

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Tighten 'er down to a "that feels about right" strain, and once again, line up one of the holes in the nut with one of the slots in the dome, and install the lock ring.

And you're done!

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Now we've got a weekend or two ahead of us, hooking up all the engine lines and cables. We have some new cockpit floorboards to install, and the seats, and then we'll be ready for test/set-up runs.

Before we run the engine, we'll make up our prop-blade-twisting tool (a couple big boards, some padding, a huge c-clamp) and put the blades back to flat pitch. You can twist 'em with your hands with the dome off, but once the dome's on, you need leverage galore.

But in the meantime, she's looking more and more like an airplane that wants to fly, doesn't she?

Image

Good times ahead!

Till next time,

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 08, 2009 10:15 am 
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Jen,

Have you considered pre-oiling the engine first and then using the feather pump to put the prop back into flat pitch at the end? On Ol' 927 and the R4D, we leave the props at flat pitch for removal and installation, but we always run the feather pump to cycle the prop through its full travel after pre-oiling the newly installed engine to ensure we've got good oil up in the dome. That would save you from having to manually set the blades no matter what position you install them in. It's seemed to work well with both aircraft. We did something similar with the CV-240's at Air Tahoma too (although we didn't have engine mounted pre-oil pumps like on the R4D and soon Ol' 927 and used an external pre-oiler or the engine pump to do that process by putting oil in the prop dome and then motoring the engine for a bit with the sump drain out to check for good oil).


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 08, 2009 12:34 pm 
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Excellent Stuff, IndyJen....Thanks for the detail....I managed to get the flap actuators off the mounting rings, and have one apart...I am missing 3 of the actuators at this time...G.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 08, 2009 12:47 pm 
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IndyJen,

Excellent photos on the engine and prop installation. Thank you for keeping us up to date on the PV-2 progress. :D
We are looking forward to the first engine run when all the detail work is done.

Stay warm.

Larry


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 08, 2009 4:14 pm 
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CAPflyer sez,

Quote:
Have you considered pre-oiling the engine first and then using the feather pump to put the prop back into flat pitch at the end? On Ol' 927 and the R4D, we leave the props at flat pitch for removal and installation, but we always run the feather pump to cycle the prop through its full travel after pre-oiling the newly installed engine to ensure we've got good oil up in the dome. That would save you from having to manually set the blades no matter what position you install them in. It's seemed to work well with both aircraft. We did something similar with the CV-240's at Air Tahoma too (although we didn't have engine mounted pre-oil pumps like on the R4D and soon Ol' 927 and used an external pre-oiler or the engine pump to do that process by putting oil in the prop dome and then motoring the engine for a bit with the sump drain out to check for good oil).


Funny you should ask--I have been stewing on the question of pre-oiling for a while, and have been putting together a post in my head for the maintenance hangar board. We have tried a few methods re pre-oiling, but we're not entirely happy with how it goes as yet, and we'd be happy for ideas from folks who have been doing it themselves.

We put the oil in at the unused oil-pressure instrument port, located on the outboard aft shoulder of the engine. This is normally plugged with a square plug. We remove the plug and attach our jury-rigged pre-oil gadget. We don't have an airframe-mounted preoiler, and we're not going to have such a thing any time soon, but we're doing the best we can.

We started out with a hand pump, but that didn't work worth a darn. Now we have an old hydraulic pump, driven by a drill motor, doing the work, and that goes better. But that oil-pressure instrument port isn't very big, and so it still takes a while.

We went with this because the instrument port is surely connected to the high-pressure gallery, so we're thinking that this is getting the oil to where it needs to be as quick as possible.

AFter we pump in a gallon or so, we pull the prop through a couple turns, so that the scavenge pump can move the oil. We keep it up for four or five gallons' worth.

Removing the pre-oil contraption always makes a bit of a mess, and we're not entirely happy with it at all. A quick disconnect would be an improvement, surely.

Now, the part where you fill the dome with oil and then motor the engine with the sump drain out: that's real interesting to me. I like the idea of using the feathering pump to fill up the dome. We had kicked around the idea of making a pre-oile adapter that would fit the breather nut hole in the dome--bigger passage, move more oil quicker, and save wear and tear on the feathering pump to boot. Do I understand you correctly, that we'd want to pump the dome full of oil, then pull the prop through a few revolutions to drive the scavenge pump and move the oil out again?

That sounds like a pretty cool idea, actually. Quicker to do, and much easier than messing about in the aft section of the engine. After scavenging a bit, we ought to be able to put the breather nut back without making much of a mess at all.

Does that sound about right to you radial engine gurus out there? We need to make sure that oil gets to both main bearings in this process, that's our main concern.

Gary, Cadet77: thanks for the encouraging words. We're closing in on it, and I can hardly wait till I can post up pics from the first engine run. It won't be long now ...

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 08, 2009 4:43 pm 
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Fantastic pictures! Thanks for the updates. I'm enjoying the shots of the snow. We don't get any here in SC and I miss it BAD (I'm from Jersey)!!! I'm one of those nuts who enjoy winter weather and I like working in it. Good luck...

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We have a spot that the external pre-oil pump attaches to on the R1830, but I sadly forgot where it was (Jeff and Rick pointed it out to me and John took pictures of it for the maintenance manual). The Engine Manual has the procedure specified in the Air Force engine manual showing where to plug in. The procedure specified for using the engine pump is to remove the bowl breather nut, pour in oil until the dome is full, and then motor the engine for a specified amount of time. I have not seen the manual for the R2800, but I would believe that there was a similar procedure specified within it as well that would tell how long you needed to motor. This is how they did it at Air Tahoma. This procedure with the engine oil pump draws from the main oil reservoir, so you don't need to do anything but ensure the oil tank is full and replenish it once you finished the pre-oiling procedure.

I have always seen the pre-oiling of a "new" engine done with the main sump drain out, but as I'm not an A&P, I can't tell you why for certain other than the engine builders said to, the manual said to, and the mechanics did it. I deducted that it was to ensure that the oil was indeed being moved in the engine and that all of the engine had some fresh oil in it.

As for the pre-oil pump, all you need is a pump that can move the oil. Most pre-oil pumps I've seen are feather pumps that are either mounted to the airframe or are mounted to a metal plate.

As for running the prop through, if you use the external pre-oiler, it simply ensures that you have oil in the dome for when you start the engine for the first time. On the R4D, the procedure is to pre-oil for 1 minute, run the feather pump until you see prop move, unfeather, and then start the engine. When we did the B-24 the other day, Dave ran the prop all the way to feather and back just to make sure that oil was in the dome prior to motoring the engine.

Maybe John (Chief) or someone who knows the publication number that outlines the pre-oil procedure on a new engine will drop by and give it to you so you can look it up.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 09, 2009 6:33 am 
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Hey CAPflyer,

Thanks for the additional info. The R-2800 manual (1960 version) calls for oil to be put in through the pressure-instrument connection on the engine, which is what we're doing, and it wants the main sump plug pulled just like you're doing it. This puts the oil in through the second branch of the high pressure gallery, which is the branch that the goes to the crankshaft and the main bearings, among other things.

I guess we're on the right track, then, but we still need to improve our methods. It's just way too messy. It's still better to have a mess to clean up than a locked-up engine to change, though.

Your use of the prop dome caught my attention, especially, because one of our guys ("Johnny Gearpin" in my write-ups) used to be with the Reading museum. They connected a hose to the prop dome, and pre-oiled until oil flowed out of the dome. Easier to get to than the sump plug, certainly, and no safety-wiring required after reinstalling the plug, either.

We're big on following The Book, but we're always ready to hear lessons learned from other operators, is the thing. Thanks for sharing, and if your boys have more details on how you're doing this pre-oiling, we'd sure love to hear 'em.

thanks,

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 09, 2009 6:57 am 
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Great post, IndyJen!

I thought you should know that I tried your instructions on my 1/72 plastic model, and it worked fine, except for the MEK bit...

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Jen, I'd go by the book. The R1830 probably has a different connect point than the R2800. I know that on the B-24 wherever we're connecting is a horizontal inlet and it is above the static oil level so you don't get much leakage except out the line from the pre-oil pump when you disconnect.

As for pumping in through the dome, I don't know. The way I understand the system to work on the R2800, I would have second thoughts about doing it as the system really isn't setup to flow oil in any quantity that way. I don't see why it wouldn't work, but to do the entire pre-oil from the dome seems to be kinda questionable to me.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 09, 2009 6:01 pm 
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Joined: Thu Feb 28, 2008 6:46 am
Posts: 267
Location: Indianapolis, Indiana
I think our man was talking about seeing when oil started flowing _out_ of the dome (breather nut hole), using this as an indication that oil had gotten all the way through the system.

But you're right, in that we don't want to go against the book without verifiable proof that there is in fact a better way (keeping in mind that the books we're using are at least fifty years old, so sometimes, there _has_ been a better way developed).

People do seem to have a lot of different ways of coping with the pre-oiling need. One thing is for sure: it's not an optional process, unless you like to do a lot of engine changes. We have had enough of them, for a while at least!

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