Thu Sep 23, 2004 9:17 am
From the get go, please understand that I do not intend to offend anyone with my personal opinion on the subject, nor do I wish to engage in arguments pro or con.
I believe that while markings are important, more important are the machines, and more even so, those who flew and who serviced them, who made their flight possible.
I personally don't care if the aircraft displayed has letters that are 1/8 of an inch shorter than what they should be, or if the shade of paint is three degrees (or whatever you use to measure shading) lighter or darker than the original.
These machines were built with one purpose in mind; it is left to us, afterwards, to ponder, write, like or dislike the way they look nowadays.
As much as I love the Mustang, I hate those shiny paint jobs which would have never made it into combat.
I hate the idea of competing on trophies for restoration work; this is one of the reasons IMHO that has driven the prices of aircraft way out of sight.
I travel many times, hundreds of miles to go see a specific airplane, a museum, a display. I relish the journey, and I enjoy the sight of the airplane.
But, it doesn't faze me, if there are only 33 rivets where there should be 34, or if the tire thread is not what it should be.
We are passionate about our interests, and as an amateur historian, I also like to see -within limits and reason- accurate data and markings, but not to the point where we become a royal pain in the ass, and demand that others paint, or represent their properties, the way WE want them to be painted or represented.
Please give me 15 seconds to seek cover, and then the barrage may begin.
Saludos!
Tulio
I believe that while markings are important, more important are the machines, and more even so, those who flew and who serviced them, who made their flight possible.
I personally don't care if the aircraft displayed has letters that are 1/8 of an inch shorter than what they should be, or if the shade of paint is three degrees (or whatever you use to measure shading) lighter or darker than the original.
These machines were built with one purpose in mind; it is left to us, afterwards, to ponder, write, like or dislike the way they look nowadays.
As much as I love the Mustang, I hate those shiny paint jobs which would have never made it into combat.
I hate the idea of competing on trophies for restoration work; this is one of the reasons IMHO that has driven the prices of aircraft way out of sight.
I travel many times, hundreds of miles to go see a specific airplane, a museum, a display. I relish the journey, and I enjoy the sight of the airplane.
But, it doesn't faze me, if there are only 33 rivets where there should be 34, or if the tire thread is not what it should be.
We are passionate about our interests, and as an amateur historian, I also like to see -within limits and reason- accurate data and markings, but not to the point where we become a royal pain in the ass, and demand that others paint, or represent their properties, the way WE want them to be painted or represented.
Please give me 15 seconds to seek cover, and then the barrage may begin.
Saludos!
Tulio
Thu Sep 23, 2004 10:17 am
I'm starting to become a big fan of the ANG and Naval Reserve paint schemes. I have the Squadron/Signal Hellcat book, and there are some fantastic USNR schemes in there. One of my favorites is a Hellcat that has "Advanced Trainer" on it. Very simple and very cool looking.
Thu Sep 23, 2004 10:21 am
When the aircraft has some historical significance, like the CF-104 in Ottawa that was used to break a record, then leave it or paint it as such.
If the aircraft is just one normal, say Spit, with no importance whatsoever, paint it in the colours of someone important!
If the aircraft is just one normal, say Spit, with no importance whatsoever, paint it in the colours of someone important!
Mustangs
Thu Sep 23, 2004 10:37 am
I always thought they should do some more PTO markings on Mustangs, there are some really nice ones out there.
brian
brian
Thu Sep 23, 2004 12:45 pm
THIS IS A GREAT TOPIC!! I WOULD LOVE TO SEE A LITTLE MORE EFFORT ON THE WARBIRD OWNERS/OPERATORS PART BY PAINTING WARBIRDS IN A REALISTIC PAINT JOB,WHAT COMES TO MIND ARE THE MANY A/C OPERATED BY THE C.A.F. HOW MANY COOL B-29 PAINT JOBS ARE DOCUMENTED OUT THERE?IVE NEVER SEEN ONE NAMED FI FI,IT WAS THE NAME OF ONE OF THE COL.WIFES!WHEN I HEAR THE NAME FI FI IT REMINDS ME OF A FRENCH POODLE NOT A HISTORIC WARBIRD!THE RED TAIL MUSTANG WAS ABOUT AS PHONY AS IT GETS NO TUSKEEGEE PLANE EVER LOOKED LIKE THAT!!THERE ARE ENOUGH PHOTOS THAT DOCUMENT ORIGINAL PAINT JOBS THAT THERE IS NO GOOD EXCUSE NOT TO PAINT THEM AS ORIGINAL AS POSSIBLE!!THEIR B-26 WAS ANOTHER GOOD EXAMPLE WHO WAS CAROLYN?WHY WERE THE STARS AND BARS PAINTED BABY BLUE?WITH ALL OF THE HISTORIANS OUT THERE ORIGINAL OR EVEN THE FACTORY MARKINGS WOULD LOOK WAY MORE CORRECT THAT SOME HOKEY POKEY DREAMED UP STUFF NAMED AFTER THE GUYS WIFE THAT PUT UP THE CASH FOR THE RESTORATION!HOW MANY MUSTANGS,SPITFIRES,CORSAIRS ECT THAT HAVE A VERY CLOSE ORIGINAL PAINT JOB BUT THEN THEY HAVE THE OWNERS INITIALS AS THE SQUADRON CODE OR TAIL MARKINGS?IF AN A/C HAS NO HISTORY I SEE NO PROBLEM PAINTING IT UP AS A MORE FAMOUS PLANE,AS LONG AS THEY MAKE A REAL EFFORT AT PUTTING ON THE CORRECT MARKINGS AND COLORS!!YES I KNOW THAT THE GUY SPENDING THE MONEY CAN PAINT IT HOW EVER HE WANTS ,BUT IN TODAYS AWARD WINNING RESTORATIONS THE BAR IS ALWAYS BEING RAISED TO MAKE THEM AS ORIGINAL AS POSSIBLE AND THIS SHOULD START WITH THE EASY PART THE OUTSIDE !!HOW MANY YOUNG KIDS THINK THAT FI FI IS THE REPRESENTATION OF A HISTORIC COMBAT B-29?OR THE C MODEL MUSTANG WITH THE BOGUS NOSE ART THAT IS SUPPOSE TO REPRESENT THE TUSKEEGEE AIRMEN BUT IS SOMEONES PIPE DREAM RATHER THAN A REAL PAINT JOB?SUCH A LARGE ORGANISATION AS THE C.A.F.SHOULD HAVE THEIR OWN HISTORIAN THAT CAN COME UP WITH REAL PAINT JOBS THAT SUPPORT THE HISTORY OF THE A/C NOT JUST THE GUYS WIFE OR INITIALS THAT SPENT THE MONEY ON THE RESTORATION!!P-40S ARE ANOTHER GREAT EXAMPLE EVERY KID GROWING UP THINKS THAT ALL P-40S CAME FROM THE FACTORY WITH SHARKS TEETH!!SO LETS HOPE THAT THE FUTURE OF WARBIRDS CAN ONLY GET MORE AUTHENTIC WITH EACH RESTORATION AND THAT THIS IDEA OF DREAMED UP NOSE ART,MISMATCHED COLORS ECT WILL GO BY THE WAYSIDE AND A REAL EFFORT TO MAKE THEM AS HISTORICAL AS POSSIBLE!!THANKS MIKE
Thu Sep 23, 2004 1:24 pm
Correct paint jobs are always appreciated, but as I've said before paint it lime green if you want, but please use the correct serial number for the aircraft. Replicating a historic paint job down to the serial can make identifying the aircraft from photos interesting to say the least.
Thu Sep 23, 2004 6:08 pm
Can't help but reply to the remark about FIFI - the CAF named her after the gentleman who donated ALL the $$ and spent a ton of his own time to get her back into the hands of people who love and take care of this plane. Personally, so what if they put his wifes name on the Nose and make the tail with the first letter of his last name. It seems a fitting tribute for anyone who allows a younger generation to actually hear the R-3350 fire up rather than just visit a musuem and wonder.
If I had the $$ and time, I'd buy the B-29 from Aero trader, redo it in a silverplate configuration and name it "Strange Cargo"!!
My 2 cents worth.
If I had the $$ and time, I'd buy the B-29 from Aero trader, redo it in a silverplate configuration and name it "Strange Cargo"!!
My 2 cents worth.
Thu Sep 23, 2004 7:41 pm
dj51d wrote:Correct paint jobs are always appreciated, but as I've said before paint it lime green if you want, but please use the correct serial number for the aircraft. Replicating a historic paint job down to the serial can make identifying the aircraft from photos interesting to say the least.
All I can say is this:
When it's your hard-earned cash that purchased the airplane, you're the one in a position to decide what it looks like and how it's used.
I'm looking at buying a T-6, and the airframe I'm currently considering purchasing happens to be an SNJ-6. If I give it a re-paint, I'll be damned if I'm going to spend $5,000 to $10,000 on an authentic NAVY paintjob -- I'm a US Air Force pilot!!! I'm sure that an SNJ wearing Air Force colors might drive a warbird hound batty, but it's not their airplane is it!
Even Walt Soplata has the right to do whatever he wants with those beautiful airplanes rotting away in his yard. Tragic? Yes. That's what it means to be in a free-market economy, though.
So, warbird spotters and historians...we've just got to deal with it.
Thu Sep 23, 2004 7:58 pm
If the aircraft is a flyer, then it's different.
With a combat history, I would try to paint it as such, but I don't really care, as long as the markings and colours are spot on for what you want.
And weight this, since it comes from a guy who operates a Fw 149D painted like a Fw 190 (but with correct colour matches for RLM 04/70/71/76), a green Harvard with RAF roundels and a blue RCN T-34!
With a combat history, I would try to paint it as such, but I don't really care, as long as the markings and colours are spot on for what you want.
And weight this, since it comes from a guy who operates a Fw 149D painted like a Fw 190 (but with correct colour matches for RLM 04/70/71/76), a green Harvard with RAF roundels and a blue RCN T-34!
Thu Sep 23, 2004 9:13 pm
Randy Haskin wrote:When it's your hard-earned cash that purchased the airplane, you're the one in a position to decide what it looks like and how it's used.
I agree, I'd love to see the correct serial on the plane, but it's not my place to say. I certainly didn't mean to imply that all aircraft must marked with the correct serial number(it's not my plane or my money, I'm just an enthusiast), just that I very much appreciate it when they are,
Cross service painted aircraft are interesting, thankfully the FAA database is a big help in sorting these out, such as this SNJ-4:
Fri Sep 24, 2004 1:13 am
well, at least now you can all see why I was so pleased when one of our local mustangs was rolled out in 3 squadron RAAF colours from the middle east. it is so refreshing to see a camouflaged P-51.
surely since these people are individuals and from the buying and operating of these aircraft I would think enjoy standing out from the crowd then why not stand out even more and have a different paintscheme? something like the canadian scheme on Col Pay's P-40 for example? gorgeous bird and now I believe painted with a, you guessed it, AVG scheme unless I am remembering wrong.
surely since these people are individuals and from the buying and operating of these aircraft I would think enjoy standing out from the crowd then why not stand out even more and have a different paintscheme? something like the canadian scheme on Col Pay's P-40 for example? gorgeous bird and now I believe painted with a, you guessed it, AVG scheme unless I am remembering wrong.