Wed Dec 06, 2006 2:46 pm
Temora has currently over 3 in house rebuild jobs going so they can do very well.
They perform full maintence across their whole fleet
I still think Temora is best suited to opetate the Whipserdeath bird
They perform full maintence across their whole fleet
I still think Temora is best suited to opetate the Whipserdeath bird
Wed Dec 06, 2006 2:56 pm
As much as I respect Stephen Grey and the folks at TFC, it would seem to me that his approach to building a "collection" is a bit selfish. Obviously, they're his "toys" and he can do as he bloody well pleases with them.
BUT, it would seem to me that a greater variety of aircraft would inspire more contributions. There are, obviously, people who absolutely go ga-ga over the Spits/Mustangs/Hurricanes/Corsairs, etc, but there are those, I'm sure, that are, (like myself) Lightning/Beaufighter/Mossie fans and would probably donate a bit more to see one of those types flying. (WOW, that's a helluva sentence
)
Whether or not Stephen can fly it himself I don't think should be the determining factor in TFC's effort to rebuild a/c. But, like I said, they're his toys.
Mudge the disappointed
ps. Sounds to me like we're just gonna' have to agree to disagree on who's the "best suited". OK?
BUT, it would seem to me that a greater variety of aircraft would inspire more contributions. There are, obviously, people who absolutely go ga-ga over the Spits/Mustangs/Hurricanes/Corsairs, etc, but there are those, I'm sure, that are, (like myself) Lightning/Beaufighter/Mossie fans and would probably donate a bit more to see one of those types flying. (WOW, that's a helluva sentence
)
Whether or not Stephen can fly it himself I don't think should be the determining factor in TFC's effort to rebuild a/c. But, like I said, they're his toys.
Mudge the disappointed
ps. Sounds to me like we're just gonna' have to agree to disagree on who's the "best suited". OK?
Wed Dec 06, 2006 3:08 pm
Mudge wrote:As much as I respect Stephen Grey and the folks at TFC, it would seem to me that his approach to building a "collection" is a bit selfish. Obviously, they're his "toys" and he can do as he bloody well pleases with them.
BUT, it would seem to me that a greater variety of aircraft would inspire more contributions.
So how many airworthy examples of the following are there in Europe? Bearcats, Hellcats, Wildcats, Tigercats? P-40Bs (or any P-40s, for that matter)? Gladiators? Fiat CR.42s? P-51Cs? P-47s?
Most of these are unique outside the US, some unique worldwide.
"A greater variety of aircraft" - a very odd statement Mudge, if I may say so. TFC's collection has to be the most diverse outside the US, even with the recent disposals.
Wed Dec 06, 2006 3:41 pm
Mike...I guess I didn't get my point across too well. Sorry, mate.
What I meant was, if TFC keeps getting rid of a/c simply because Stephen can't fly them, what are they going to be down to in 10 years? It would seem to me that they'll only have single engine a/c of the type he can fly. Admittedly, that's not bad but, IMHO it would be better for TFC (the organization as a whole) if they had unique a/c that he wasn't able to fly but that could be flown by a "hired gun".
Mudge the insistent
I repeat...Yeah, they're his toys.
What I meant was, if TFC keeps getting rid of a/c simply because Stephen can't fly them, what are they going to be down to in 10 years? It would seem to me that they'll only have single engine a/c of the type he can fly. Admittedly, that's not bad but, IMHO it would be better for TFC (the organization as a whole) if they had unique a/c that he wasn't able to fly but that could be flown by a "hired gun".
Mudge the insistent
I repeat...Yeah, they're his toys.
Wed Dec 06, 2006 3:46 pm
Im full time staff member at TFC, if it does turn to singles I don't care. Where else can you see such a collection ( Hawk 75 , P-39 , P-51C ) fantastic stuff, don't knock it, enjoy it while its here!
Wed Dec 06, 2006 4:01 pm
As for the Beaufighter, the UASF museum just rolled their's out of restoration last month. It looks great, and it is painted in USAAF colors. THe paint scheme picked out is tht of an aircraft that was flown by a museum volunteer.
Wed Dec 06, 2006 4:06 pm
There are other considerations.
Insurance and fuel costs (over $8 per gallon for Avgas) in Europe are huge compared with the US, and rising exponentially. The costs of operating a twin are approx double those of a single. Not to mention huge restoration costs for twins. Why do you think more Mosquitos and Beaufighters aren't flying nowadays? Even active P-38s only number 2 or 3 worldwide, the same with active Tigercats.
The number of major airshows continues to fall (as in the US), and the budget that show organisers have for 'bought in' display items generally continues to dwindle in real terms.
So rising operating costs and reduced airshow bookings means that something has to give. In my mind, concentrating on singles in preference to hugely expensive twins is a good compromise.
There's still the rarity factor there, many of the types are unique outside the US. Current rebuilds include the Beaufighter (still making progress, outer wings now on), Spitfire XVIII, P-47G and Gladiator, plus TF-51 and P-40B off-site, with the Fiat CR.42 and Sea Fury waiting to be finished off, along with ongoing maintenance on the (still substantial) airworthy fleet. Plenty to keep them occupied for a while yet.
Insurance and fuel costs (over $8 per gallon for Avgas) in Europe are huge compared with the US, and rising exponentially. The costs of operating a twin are approx double those of a single. Not to mention huge restoration costs for twins. Why do you think more Mosquitos and Beaufighters aren't flying nowadays? Even active P-38s only number 2 or 3 worldwide, the same with active Tigercats.
The number of major airshows continues to fall (as in the US), and the budget that show organisers have for 'bought in' display items generally continues to dwindle in real terms.
So rising operating costs and reduced airshow bookings means that something has to give. In my mind, concentrating on singles in preference to hugely expensive twins is a good compromise.
There's still the rarity factor there, many of the types are unique outside the US. Current rebuilds include the Beaufighter (still making progress, outer wings now on), Spitfire XVIII, P-47G and Gladiator, plus TF-51 and P-40B off-site, with the Fiat CR.42 and Sea Fury waiting to be finished off, along with ongoing maintenance on the (still substantial) airworthy fleet. Plenty to keep them occupied for a while yet.
Wed Dec 06, 2006 4:15 pm
I'm usually fairly able to make a point. Guess I've failed totally here.
I'm not knocking TFC
I have thoroughly enjoyed "Flying Legends" for the last 5 years. IMHO the best show in the world.
I was merely making an attempt at some, what I had hoped was, constructive criticism.
OK...Youse troops win.
Mudge the pointless
I'm not knocking TFC
I have thoroughly enjoyed "Flying Legends" for the last 5 years. IMHO the best show in the world.
I was merely making an attempt at some, what I had hoped was, constructive criticism.
OK...Youse troops win.
Mudge the pointless
Wed Dec 06, 2006 6:30 pm
Alright Mudge! This is your final warning. Stop picking on Stephen Grey and the TFC or else the Brits are going to go Royal Mail on you! 
TFC
Wed Dec 06, 2006 6:57 pm
Mudge, maybe because Stephen is a friend I think you missed on this one. Don't they have a Lysander for rare type, and whiy do you think he can only fly a single engine or single seater? It would be great to have Mosi fly but even Kermit hasn't restored his. It's probably quite a job. Are you able to volunter at any museums? What is IMHO?
Re: TFC
Wed Dec 06, 2006 7:14 pm
Bill Greenwood wrote: whiy do you think he can only fly a single engine or single seater?
I heard it was a medical issue that restricted him to single engine aircraft.
Wed Dec 06, 2006 7:15 pm
Mr Mudge:
please take no offense, as this is for discussion only, but I am curious what you mean by "a greater variety of aircraft would inspire more contributions"
because I cannot imagine just how significant a contribution would have to be, to actually impact on the bottom line of TFC.
And I am not sure that having a beaufighter in rebuild would inspire such a massive contribution.
If we add up the value of all of their aircraft, even being very conservative, it`s a phenomenal number! and I cannot perceive any contributions which would in any way enhance this.
I would guess that the money is in the actual airframes to the most part, and selling a beaufighter can keep lots of gas going through the remaining airframes, not to mention spares, and maintenance.
Perhaps I misread your point, can you clarify, in simple terms please!
please take no offense, as this is for discussion only, but I am curious what you mean by "a greater variety of aircraft would inspire more contributions"
because I cannot imagine just how significant a contribution would have to be, to actually impact on the bottom line of TFC.
And I am not sure that having a beaufighter in rebuild would inspire such a massive contribution.
If we add up the value of all of their aircraft, even being very conservative, it`s a phenomenal number! and I cannot perceive any contributions which would in any way enhance this.
I would guess that the money is in the actual airframes to the most part, and selling a beaufighter can keep lots of gas going through the remaining airframes, not to mention spares, and maintenance.
Perhaps I misread your point, can you clarify, in simple terms please!
Re: TFC
Wed Dec 06, 2006 8:09 pm
Bill Greenwood wrote: What is IMHO?
IMHO = In My Humble Opinion
Re: TFC
Wed Dec 06, 2006 8:17 pm
Bill Greenwood wrote:Don't they have a Lysander for rare type,
Sorry, Bill, wrong call. No they don't. ARC operated one (now static with Kermit) and Shuttleworth have one (wheels under rebuild) but TFC hasn't ever shown an interest.
Wed Dec 06, 2006 8:50 pm
OK...medical problem I can understand. My apologies if this is the case.
And no, I can't explain it in simpler terms.
At this point, whatever I expand on will be offensive to someone.
Mudge the chastised
And no, I can't explain it in simpler terms.
At this point, whatever I expand on will be offensive to someone.
Mudge the chastised