Warbird Information Exchange

currently reading book "blossoms in the wind" 'human legacies of the kamikaze". a 1st hand account of the ww2 suicide program from the japanese perspective of the experience with interviews from kamikaze pilots who experienced the training but never completed their missions, or by a stroke of luck just survived. a must read!!!! i assure you!! mention is made that when the sub uss archerfish sunk the shinano off of wakayama prefecture japan november 1944 she had taken on top secret cargo of 50 okas ( or baka, japanese for "stupid" in u.s. terminology during the war) suicide rocket planes along with seldom known about shin'yo suicide motor boats that amounted to 6 in quantity. would be cool today if those could be recovered, provided they aren't carrying ordinance, but the harsh salt water environment has probably more than taken it's toll. but on the other hand multi century old ship wrecks have been found in decent shape. you would think dr ballard who found titanic & bismarck would mount an expedition to find the shinano & the super battleship yamato. both vessels had their keels laid at the same time, with the shinano originally supposed to be a super battleship as well, but was converted to a super carrier that thank god never was operational. reading the book also gives perspective in relation to today's dilemma regarding al quaida / taliban suicide bombers. both the japanese & muslim fanatics have done it for martyrdom, but the only difference being the japanese did it for their country as well. another interesting bit of trivia....... these 2 japanese ships were the biggest in the world up to the advent of the u.s. super carriers built in the mid 1950's.

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tom d. friedman - hey!!! those fokkers were messerschmitts!! * without ammunition, the usaf would be just another flying club!!! * better to have piece of mind than piece of tail!!

Tom the Yamato has already been located and studied:



http://www.history.navy.mil/photos/sh-f ... yamato.htm

i've never seen nor heard of any tv documentary footage

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tom d. friedman - hey!!! those fokkers were messerschmitts!! * without ammunition, the usaf would be just another flying club!!! * better to have piece of mind than piece of tail!!

what of shinano???? any sunken film footage??

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tom d. friedman - hey!!! those fokkers were messerschmitts!! * without ammunition, the usaf would be just another flying club!!! * better to have piece of mind than piece of tail!!

Here you go, Tom (For Yamato, that is).

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/supership/

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It was a good idea, it just didn't work.

Thanks Dan. Equally interesting is the sister super battleship to the Yamato, the Musashi.

http://www.history.navy.mil/photos/sh-f ... usashi.htm

thanks for the thread posts guys, but i'd love to see current wreck footage if it exists, which i doubt. dr ballard!!! are you a lurker i hope???

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tom d. friedman - hey!!! those fokkers were messerschmitts!! * without ammunition, the usaf would be just another flying club!!! * better to have piece of mind than piece of tail!!

Tom, You did see the underwater footage of the Yamato at the link I gave, right? If not, click on the DVD preview.

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It was a good idea, it just didn't work.

Right Dan. I think it was a Japanese film crew that explored the wreck site if I remember.

yep, thanks!! need more. i might have to spring for the dvd!!

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tom d. friedman - hey!!! those fokkers were messerschmitts!! * without ammunition, the usaf would be just another flying club!!! * better to have piece of mind than piece of tail!!

Not to be critical, but the Shinano did not have her keel laid at the same time as the Yamato...The Yamato was built in Kure, the Musashi in Nagasaki about 6 months after the start date for Yamato, and the Shinano about 6 months after that (sorry, don't remember where she was built...but not at either Kure or Nagasaki...maybe in Yokosuka?).

I believe that there are also some underwater photos of the Musashi.

John

hi john, while the info is not etched in stone the book states that they were sister ships upon keel laying, what the hell!!! worse mistakes have been made in print!!!

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tom d. friedman - hey!!! those fokkers were messerschmitts!! * without ammunition, the usaf would be just another flying club!!! * better to have piece of mind than piece of tail!!

I've always read that Musashi and Yamato were in the same class too. I wouldn't have thought they would have to have come from the same shipyard to be sisterships.

Cheers. Richard

Tom,

My source for that information was a book called "Battleship Musashi: The making and sinking of the world's biggest battleship". In this book, the history of building the Yamato and Musashi are discussed, along with passing reference to the Shinano. Yes, they were sister ships, the Musashi having some refinements that the Yamato didn't have (which is why the Musashi was Combined Fleet's flagship between the time of her sea trials and her sinking...Yamato had the job both before and after Musashi did).

As I said, I wasn't trying to be overly critical...sorry if I was. And your initial point is very valid...it would be really neat to see if any of Shinano's cargo has survived 60 years underwater.

John

john, no need to apologize!!! if that's my biggest problem in life then i'm happy & lucky! aviation history controversy is part of what makes this site fun!! i've put my foot in my mouth many times on this forum, & i can predict more coming!! best to you, tom

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tom d. friedman - hey!!! those fokkers were messerschmitts!! * without ammunition, the usaf would be just another flying club!!! * better to have piece of mind than piece of tail!!