B-17 "Miss Glamour Pants" 351st Bomb Group

[sarahroot]

or even if he remembers him at all. i dont even know what he looks like.

[mustangdriver]

PM Sent

[mustangdriver]

Here is their crew photo.

Attachments

[sarahroot]

thats cool which one is your friend?

[Snake45]

Okay, just ran all the SNs through the list in the book. You had a handful that weren't listed.

Of the ones I found, the vast majority survived the war and returned to the US. A few were marked as MIA with a date.

Not every AC listed in the book had a pilot associated with it. Of your list, I only found four pilot names, all Lieutenants: Loehndorf, Pattison, Marschek, and Ash. I looked for these names in the crew photos and didn't find any of them.

The book has 42-97349 as Silver Meteor (not Silver Dollar).

[sarahroot]

well thank you anyways. im greatful for your help. im not gonna give up on my search. i knew how hard it was gonna be to trace back the Nehr side of my family. and thank you for the correction. i was going off of a website that stated there could be some mistakes. if you come across anything else please let me know. thank you again for taking the time to help research for me.

[Snake45]

I make no claim for "correctness" of the info in the book, I'm just passing along what's in there. It's entirely possible that you're right and it's wrong.

[sarahroot]

lol either way its cool.

[r1830]

Double post

Last edited by r1830 on Mon Mar 10, 2025 2:29 am, edited 1 time in total.

[r1830]

here you go hun this is all ive found so far. ive been putting it together as i find stuff. as far as plane names not all of them i could find names for but the ones i did i listed as well. i also edited it and found the pilots names and added them. idk if that helps too or not.
Elwood Nehr 508th Sqdrn. 351st BG. Serial Number 33008205 B-17 Flying Fortresses
(Thu)7-6-44 Sgt. Mission 163, Aircraft <a href="tel:42-97258">42-97258</a> Ralph T. Ballard Jr. Pilot-Silver Meteor, Left Waist Gunner, City-France, Target-V-2 Installation
(Tue)7-18-44 Sgt. Mission 172, Aircraft <a href="tel:43-37512">43-37512</a> Robert G. Hurley Pilot-Trade Winds, Left Waist Gunner, City-Peenemunde, Target-Electolytic Hydrogen Plant
(Fri)7-21-44 Sgt. Mission 175, Aircraft <a href="tel:43-37727">43-37727</a> William Longa Pilot, Left Waist Gunner, City-Schweinfurt, Germany, Target-V.K.F. Ball Bearing Plant
(Fri)8-4-44 Sgt. Mission 183, Aircraft <a href="tel:42-102971">42-102971</a> Ralph T Ballard Jr. Pilot, Left Waist Gunner, City-Anklam, Germany, Target-Airfield
(Sat)8-5-44 Sgt. Mission 184, Aircraft <a href="tel:42-102971">42-102971</a> Ralph T. Ballard Jr. Pilot, Left Waist Gunner, City-Nienburg, Germany, Target-Underground Oil Storage Tanks
(Mon)8-14-44 Sgt. Mission 190, Aircraft <a href="tel:43-37978">43-37978</a> Ralph T. Ballard Jr. Pilot, Left Waist Gunner, City-Haguenau, France, Target-Airfield-Second Target
(Wed)8-16-44 Sgt. Mission 191, Aircraft <a href="tel:43-37850">43-37850</a> Ralph T. Ballard Jr. Pilot-Umbriago, Left Waist Gunner, City-Schkeuckitz, Germany, Target-Aircraft Factory & Airfield
(Fri)8-18-44 Sgt. Mission 192, Aircraft <a href="tel:42-31879">42-31879</a> Ralph T. Ballard Jr. Pilot-The Shark, Left Waist Gunner, City-Namur, Belgium, Target-Bridge
(Wed)8-30-44 Sgt. Mission 198, Aircraft <a href="tel:42-31879">42-31879</a> Ralph T. Ballard Jr. Pilot-The Shark, Left Waist Gunner, City-Kiel, Germany, Target-Submarine Building Yards
(Sat)9-9-44 Sgt. Mission 201, Aircraft <a href="tel:43-31879">43-31879</a> Ralph T. Ballard Jr. Pilot, Left Waist Gunner, City-Ludwigshafen, Germany, Target-Synthetic Oil Plant
(Sun)9-10-44 Sgt. Mission 202, Aircraft <a href="tel:42-31879">42-31879</a> Ralph T. Ballard Jr. Pilot-The Shark, Left Waist Gunner, City-Gagenau, Germany, Target-Daimler-Benz Factory
(Mon)9-11-44 Sgt. Mission 203, Aircraft <a href="tel:43-37900">43-37900</a> Ralph T. Ballard Jr. Pilot, Left Waist Gunner, City-Lutzkendorf, Germany, Target-Refinery
(Sun)9-17-44 Sgt. Mission 205, Aircraft <a href="tel:43-38405">43-38405</a> Ralph T. Ballard Jr. Pilot, Left Waist Gunner, City-Nijmegen, Netherlands, Target-Enemy Positions
(Tue)9-19-44 Sgt. Mission 206, Aircraft <a href="tel:43-38405">43-38405</a> Ralph T. Ballard Jr. Pilot, Left Waist Gunner, City-Soest, Germany, Target-Railroad Marshalling Yards
(Fri)9-22-44 Sgt. Mission 207, Aircraft <a href="tel:43-38405">43-38405</a> Ralph T. Ballard Jr. Pilot, Left Waist Gunner, City-Kassel, Germany, Target-Airfield
(Tue)10-3-44 Sgt. Mission 213, Aircraft <a href="tel:43-37727">43-37727</a> Ralph T. Ballard Jr. Pilot, Left Waist Gunner, City-Nuremburg, Germany, Target-Railroad Marshalling Yards
(Sun)10-15-44 Sgt. Mission 218, Aircraft <a href="tel:43-38405">43-38405</a> Ralph T. Ballard Jr. Pilot, Left Waist Gunner, City-Cologne, Germany, Target-Railroad Marshalling Yards
(Tue)10-17-44 Sgt. Mission 219, Aircraft <a href="tel:42-97349">42-97349</a> Norman A. Trapp Pilot-Silver Dollar, Left Waist Gunner, City-Cologne, Germany, Target-Railroad Marshalling Yards
(Thu)10-19-44 Sgt. Mission 221, Aircraft <a href="tel:42-97349">42-97349</a> Ralph T. Ballard Jr. Pilot-Silver Dollar, Left Waist Gunner, City-Mannhein, Germany, Target-Heinrich Lonz Factory
(Wed)10-25-44 Sgt. Mission 223, Aircraft <a href="tel:43-38666">43-38666</a> Ralph T. Ballard Jr. Pilot, Left Waist Gunner, City-Hamburg, Germany, Target-Rhenania-Ossag Oil Refinery
(Sat)10-28-44 Sgt. Mission 225, Aircraft <a href="tel:42-97349">42-97349</a> Ralph T. Ballard Jr. Pilot-Silver Dollar, Left Waist Gunner, City-Munster, Germany, Target-Railroad Marshalling Yards
(Sat)11-4-44 Sgt. Mission 227, Aircraft <a href="tel:43-38410">43-38410</a> Ralph T. Ballard Jr. Pilot, Left Waist Gunner, City-Harburg, Germany, Target-Oil Refinery
(Mon)11-6-44 S/Sgt. Mission 229, Aircraft <a href="tel:42-37956">42-37956</a> Ralph T. Ballard Jr. Pilot, Left Waist Gunner, City-Hamburg, Germany, Target-Railroad Marshalling Yards
(Wed)11-29-44 S/Sgt. Mission 236, Aircraft <a href="tel:43-39799">43-39799</a> Ralph T. Ballard Jr. Pilot, Left Waist Gunner, City-Misburg, Germany, Target-Oil Refinery
(Mon)12-4-44 S/Sgt. Mission 238, Aircraft <a href="tel:42-31711">42-31711</a> Joseph H. Galloway Pilot, Nose Gunner, City-Kassel, Germany, Target-Railroad Marshalling Yards
(Fri)12-15-44 S/Sgt. Mission 243, Aircraft <a href="tel:43-38277">43-38277</a> William B Zimmerman Pilot, Left Waist Gunner, City-Kassel, Germany, Target-Locomotive Workshops
(Mon)12-18-44 S/Sgt. Mission 244, Aircraft 44-8410 Henry F Kale Pilot-Miss Glamor Pants, Nose Gunner, City-Cologne, Germany, Target-Clouds-Bombs Not Dropped
(Tue)12-19-44 S/Sgt. Mission 245, Aircraft <a href="tel:43-37956">43-37956</a> Wilfred A Wiese Pilot, Nose Gunner, City-Kall, Germany, Target-Enemy Positions
(Sun)12-24-44 S/Sgt. Mission 246, Aircraft <a href="tel:43-37956">43-37956</a> Wilfred A Wiese Pilot, Nose Gunner, City-Biblis, Germany, Target-Airfield
(Thu)12-28-44 S/Sgt. Mission 248, Aircraft <a href="tel:42-31711">42-31711</a> Thomas B Lenze Pilot, Nose Gunner, City-Rheinbach, Germany, Target-Railroad Marshalling Yards
(Fri)1-5-45 S/Sgt. Mission 254, Aircraft <a href="tel:43-38753">43-38753</a> John W Crutcher Pilot-Lucky Jewell, Nose Gunner, City-Koblenz, Germany, Target-Railroad Yards-Second Target
(Sun)1-7-45 S/Sgt. Mission 256, Aircraft <a href="tel:43-38799">43-38799</a> Robert S. Parnell Pilot-Heaven Can Wait, Nose Gunner, City-Bitburg, Germany, Target-Communications Centre
(Wed)1-10-45 S/Sgt. Mission 257, Aircraft <a href="tel:43-37956">43-37956</a> Robert S. Parnell Pilot, Nose Gunner, City-Euskirchen, Germany, Target-Air Field
(Mon)1-29-45 S/Sgt. Mission 264, Aircraft <a href="tel:44-38954">44-38954</a> Robert W. Buttel Pilot, Nose Gunner, City-Siegen, Germany, Target-Railroad Marshalling Yards
(Thu)2-1-45 S/Sgt. Mission 265, Aircraft <a href="tel:43-37954">43-37954</a> Robert W. Buttel Pilot, Nose Gunner, City-Ludwigshafen, Germany, Target-Railroad Marshalling Yards
(Sat)2-3-45 S/Sgt. Mission 266, Aircraft <a href="tel:43-38954">43-38954</a> Robert W. Buttel Pilot, Nose Gunner, City-Berlin, Germany, Target-Transportation Area Near Center of City
(Wed)2-7-45 S/Sgt. Mission 268, Aircraft <a href="tel:43-38954">43-38954</a> Robert W. Buttel Pilot, Nose Gunner, City-Lutzkendorf, Germany, Target-Recalled Before Leaving England
(Fri)2-9-45 S/Sgt. Mission 269, Aircraft <a href="tel:43-38954">43-38954</a> Robert W. Buttel Pilot, Nose Gunner, City-Lutzkendorf, Germany, Target-Synthetic Oil Plant

https://youtu.be/OxeeUP0REAs?si=p3WUpvncSwTIhQ6i

B17 Pilot Wilfred A Wiese has a few missions listed above. This is a YouTube interview with him. The whole thing is worth watching. At about the one hour and 18 minute mark he talks specifically about the December 24 mission and landing in the fog on Christmas Eve.

He flew the B17 B29 C46 and several other aircraft


I met Fred about a month ago and we talked for about four hours. I was going go visit him again tomorrow, but unfortunately, he passed away at 102 on March 8 of 2025.

Enjoy your new set of wings and I hope you have a wonderful reunion with all your crew and wingmen.

[Richard W.]

I don't remember seeing "nose gunner" listed as a B-17 crew position before.

I presume he acted as the bomb toggler on the late-war missions flown without bombardiers?