The Myth of the Crushed Ball Turret Gunner

[quemerford]

I'd hate for this thread to be misinterpreted as "don't believe what veterans tell you": it's certainly none of that. But conversely, one shouldn't believe what anyone tells you if there's no proof. A good story is just a good story unless it can be documented with facts.

[Noha307]

https://www.pbs.org/video/full-focus-the-303rd/

Listen to his story at 25:12.

Just some old guy who probably doesn't remember the details accurately after all these years? No date, time, serial number, group, squadron, name, aircrew casualty report, so it never happened?

First, let me say thanks for bringing this up. I really appreciate it. If anyone else has any further interviews, records, etc. that could offer more clues, I would love to see them.

Think about it this way: There are plenty of things that happened in the past that we will never know about. Many soldiers, sailors, and airmen have died circumstances that will forever remain unknown. However, our job as historians is, as one of my college history professors put it, "to go where the truth lies". So unless we can prove it, it would be irresponsible to continue to repeat it as undisputed fact in museum tours and on signs. The best way we can address it is by stating that "there is no verifiable proof of it ever having occurred."

Please note, none of this is to insult the sacrifices of veterans like Col. Schulstad. I cannot explain the source of his claim and, as you noted, it is unfortunately sufficiently vague as to require an inordinate amount of research to prove or disprove. (Col. Schulstad also flew 44 missions, meaning there is even more material that would have searched through than the average airman. It's also worth noting that he didn't stop serving his country after the war, co-founding an organization for professionals that helped individuals with substance abuse.[1]) So, outside of more information, what are we left with? On the one side, we have multiple cases where this story has been repeated and disproven and on the other we have a single witness testimony. As the burden of proof lies with the person making the claim and no further evidence is readily available to substantiate said claim, I am forced to conclude that his story is, in all likelihood, incorrect.

As a final note, if we also presume that both Col. Schulstad and Andy Rooney are not mistaken, they cannot be referring to the same incident, as the stories would have taken place at different airfields - the former with the 303rd Bomb Group at Molesworth and the latter with the 91st Bomb Group at Bassingbourne. If there were two cases, this only increases the odds that some verifiable evidence would have come to light by now. So, ironically, it could be argued that each distinct unverifiable claim actually makes the story less likely to be true. (c.f. Fermi paradox)

[quemerford]

For the sake of accuracy it's Bassingbourn. No idea why the 'e' is absent but that's the way it is.

[Noha307]

This morning I read a pair of posts (1, 2) by a silent film expert about the trope of the girl tied to the railroad tracks and the short version is it is largely comparable to the crushed ball turret gunner story: no one can find verifiable evidence that it ever actually occurred, but it has been perpetuated by later popular culture. (To be clear, the author notes it did occur at least twice in parody films, but never in that format in a serious studio film.) One section in particular seemed especially similar:

Know this: In all my years of watching silent films (and I have seen hundreds in every imaginable genre) I have never once seen this cliche in the wild, so to speak. Not once. It’s so rare that when I challenged a large group of silent film buffs to name one occurrence in a serious, mainstream silent feature, no one could do it. Think about that. Thousands of silent films viewed between us and no one could name a single feature.

I’m still waiting…

Plus, even if one or two occurrences were to surface, there are still thousands of silent movies that do no such thing. So the cliche can hardly be called “iconic” which is how some critics have described it.

(Source: Fritzi Kramer, “Silent Movie Myth: Tied to the Railroad Tracks,” Movies Silently, March 12, 2013.)

So, I guess just a little reminder that this sort of thing is by no means isolated to aviation or the military.

As a final footnote, if anyone is interested in more on oft-repeated - although not necessarily unverified - anecdotes, I will shamelessly plug the Origins of Aviation Cliches thread.

[Noha307]

So I was checking my YouTube subscriptions today and was pleasantly surprised to learn that the channel WWII US Bombers cited my article in his video:


He added some excellent thoughts as well. In particular, his point that it would take a failure of both landing gear, and not just one, was well taken.