surviving Pearl Harbor aircraft

[old iron]

What became of the crew of midget sub I-18tou? I heard somewhere that there was a survivor who reached shore and melted into the population but turned up after the war.

[battle]

Also add to the list of ' surviving ' ships the USS Pennsylvania at bikini atoll , also is there not a Kate under water off Oahu have seen pics of it somewhere.

cheers dave

[David_Aiken]

I heard somewhere that there was a survivor who reached shore and melted into the population but turned up after the war.

Ahhhh, yes, the December 1967, Our Navy magazine, "A Voice from the Bottom of the Sea" by Ellsworth Boyd, fueled the 'survivor' fiction with a Japanese-American bartender's story. How he was on board Ensign Sakamaki's midget and almost "melted into the population", as you put it, and became a POW. However, there is a graphic photo of Sakamaki's 'weight and balance' pardner after his body was recovered in ADVANCE FORCE by William G "Burl" Burlingame.

HTH,
David Aiken

[David_Aiken]

What became of the crew of midget sub I-18tou?

It took many years of digging...yet found the men who pieced Sakamaki's sub together with parts of the "Monaghan" midget (some say this is the midget sub from I-18)...these men removed the deceased crew so they could work without the stench. The crew were buried in the Nuuanu Cemetery, also called Oahu Cemetery...and returned to Japan during the disinterrments post war.

HTH,
David Aiken

[David_Aiken]

is there not a Kate under water off Oahu have seen pics of it somewhere.

cheers dave

Aloha "Battle" Dave,
All five lost B5N KATEs are cited by pilot, crash, and order of crash in "Torpedoing Pearl Harbor", MILITARY HISTORY, Dec 2001. All crashed in the harbor or on land bordering the harbor.
HTH,
David Aiken

[Warbirdnerd]

It looks like the JRS-1 is getting closer to completion...
From their facebook page.

[SaxMan]

I went and looked it up: The Kingfisher at U-H wasn't acquired by the Navy until March 1942, so it was not there at the time of the Pearl Harbor attack, so it can be scratched from the list. I'll need to get out to U-H to get a closer look at the JRS.

[rothjonb]

Hello all, I am new to all this, but I thought I would add/clarify one that is on Noha307's list.

My understanding is that David Aiken has updated his list of civilian aircraft that were flying that morning to confirm that R Tyce was flying the Waco, while M Posten was flying the Cub.

The Waco survives and is in my possession. I have reviewed the aircraft maintenance and flight logs that cover December 1941 and I concur with David and the previous owner's view that this was the plane that Robert was flying. I have well over a hundred R Tyce signatures in the logs and a summary from the operations log showing 9:35 flight hours from December 1 to 7. The final entry, presumably from December 8, states simply "Aircraft Dismantled".

The aircraft is 1933 Waco UIC, registration NC13408. It is airworthy and recently completed a break-in flight from Southern California to the Gulf Coast, near New Orleans, after a very long and protracted restoration. 17.5 hours flight time for the trip, with no anomalies.

With regards,
Jon Roth
CFI and FAA Inspection Authorization

[David_Aiken]

="rothjonb"David Aiken has updated his list of civilian aircraft that were flying that morning to confirm that R Tyce was flying the Waco, while M Posten was flying the Cub.

The aircraft is 1933 Waco UIC, registration NC13408. It is airworthy and recently completed a break-in flight from Southern California to the Gulf Coast, near New Orleans, after a very long and protracted restoration. 17.5 hours flight time for the trip, with no anomalies.

With regards,
Jon Roth
CFI and FAA Inspection Authorization

Aloha Jon,
Yes, Tyce was flying the Waco...however, I now have the existant logs for M. F. Poston...and there is a large brick wall. His logs end in Nov 1941. Perhaps the next log went down with the plane.

As K-T Flying Service was the Piper Sales Representative on Oahu, and it was thought that all the K-T planes airborne were Piper Cubs...now the study of M.F. Poston's logs suggest that he was PERHAPS flying a plane from Andrew Flying Service...

The study continues,
Cheers,
David Aiken
PearlHarborHistory AT Hotmail dot Com

[rothjonb]

Thanks for this. I will contact you to discuss further. Planning article in major AvRag on Pear Harbor attacks on civilian aircraft.

I suppose there is no place for speculation here, but....

I also have a copy of Poston's logs prior to Dec 41. I note that he flew a wide variety of aircraft (Luscome, Cadet, Taylorcraft, Ryan, Fairchild). Not all of these were Andrew Flying Service. I note that he ultimately flew the Hawaiian Airlines Ltd's Fleet 7. He flew it multiple times from July to September 1941 (NC776V, registration cancelled 1948). He never flew a cub.

Further I note that K-T owned the only other (3) Fleets on the Islands (ref: Larkins Inventory) - N455K (recently expired registration), N642M (no longer on registry), N678M (active and current registration).

So, what if due to availability or a referral for training with Robert, or an opportunity to help ferry a plane (a K-T Fleet) back to home base, he was flying N642M together with Robert and the Waco that morning? The Ferry flight scenario would also explain and support the 2nd aircraft being the Waco - that is what I would have taken on the day.

Just a thought.
Jon

[b747cf]

This Stearman was reported to be their.



Mark Fidler

[Noha307]

List updated.

Hello all, I am new to all this, but I thought I would add/clarify one that is on Noha307's list.

Cool! Name recognition!

You'll have to pardon me, I don't know anything about the civilian operations involved, so I have to work off of whatever you guys tell me. I'm not really any sort of expert, I just play one on the Internet. In actuality, Jon, you're probably more of an expert than I am. I just happen to be good at laying out and organizing information that people tell me and OCD enough to actually mess with it.

[Rocketeer]

Although in the Philippines, could the B-17D "The Swoose" be considered a survivor of the day's attacks? Wasn't Clark Field attacked within hours following the Pearl Harbor raid?

[David_Aiken]

In December 1991, Stan Cohen's EAST WIND RAIN printed my list of "American Aircraft Airborne During the Pearl Harbor Attack". It listed FOUR Piper Cubs from K-T Flying Service as airborne. This was based on the loss of two Piper Cubs shot down in the first Japanese attack wave and the USS ARGONNE report of the shoot down of M.F. Poston. That ARGONNE report states that M.F. Poston was flying wing with instructor, Robert Tyce, when Poston's plane was hit and Poston bailed out.

K-T Flying Service was the Piper Cub sales representative in Hawaii. The K-T had many Piper Cubs in their stable for students and for sale. All of the NON-Piper Cubs owned by K-T Flying Service survived the attack. Thus the plane Poston was flying must have been a Piper Cub...and perhaps Tyce was also flying a Cub...?

William T "Bill" Larkins was approached by Mrs LeeAn Brown Swanson, in 2007, regarding the history of the ex-K-T Flying Service WACO owned by her family. She was interested in the aircraft's log as having nine hours of flight time in Dec 1941. History tells us that civilian aircraft were grounded after the attack. Thus the flight time must be for 1-7 Dec 1941. After many exchanges of e-mails, Bill and I became assured by that log that Philip Brown's WACO was flying that day. The new owner was also so assured.

THEN Stephen Harding wrote an excellent article, <http://www.historynet.com/first-planes-down-at-pearl.htm> This confirmed that the USS ARGONNE report was a fabrication. His proof included a lengthy yellow pad narrative by Mrs Tyce that detailed Robert and her actions that morning. Tyce NOR the WACO did NOT fly on 7 Dec 1941.

Shoe leather is tastier when first boiled.
Cheers,
David Aiken

[flightsimer]

Swamp ghost was supposed to be over Hawaii along with the other 14 B17's, but it had engine troubles when departing and was left behind with another B-17.