Warbird Information Exchange

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“Knowing what’s right, doesn’t mean much unless you do what’s right.”

Fairchild AT-21 "Gunner"

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It was a good idea, it just didn't work.

Check out the Two B-24's on the right

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Kind Regards,
Gary Lewis
J.A.F.O.

The photo in the post immediately above is NOT the RAF review in 1968....
I think gary 1954 didn't mean for that title from the first photo to be included with that shot.

RE te Nazi C-47...probably painted for a film. It doesn't look like any German schemes I've seen on captured DC-3s. Judging by the RAF camo B-24s, right after the war...or perhaps during the war.

The first photo of the RAF 50th anniversary has neat stuff...the transports in the upper left...Belfast, Beverly, Brittania, Comet, Hastings, Hercules, VC-10...
The WWII aircraft in the background...Lanc, Mossie, Wellington, Spitfires. A Beaufighter in the forground. To the right, a Defiant, Spit and Hurricane.
Also see they Lysander in the center? (right behind the Javelin and two-seat Lightning). And notice the R-4 helicopter to the far left. The flying helicopter is a turbine Whirlwind (license built H-19).
Most of the rare WWII types are not in the RAF Museum...or perhaps the BoB Memorial Flight.

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Remember the vets, the wonderful planes they flew and their sacrifices for a future many of them did not live to see.
Note political free signature.
I figure if you wanted my opinion on items unrelated to this forum, you'd ask for it.

Your headon shot of Farnbrough? has the Armstrong/Whitworth AW 55 APOLLO in the left foreground, Designed to BRABAZON Committee Type II specs like the VISCOUNT, the Apollo was a 26-31 seat medium range airliner that suffered from a poor choice of powerplants. The MAMBA turboprop engines were troublesome and very unreliable. Two built, both used as testbeds for other projects and eventually reduced to Bully Beef tins, the VISCOUNT went on to sucess.

The first shot is some sort of Anniversary gathering and I'm guessing 1961-65ish since the newest thing I see is the DH 125 in the center. What a mix!!! BRITTANIA, COMET, BELFAST VC-10, C-130(?), BEVERLY, GNAT, Jet PROVOST, PROVOST, WELLINGTON, Sea Hornet (?), LANCASTER, CANBERRA, ROC, SPITS (2) BEAUFIGHTER, TEMPEST, METEOR, VARSITY, BLOODHOUND SAM's, JAVELIN, plus lots of other stuff!!!

I'm sort of guessing the shot with all the DAY GLO jets must be the test fleet for GE @ sometime as the CARAVELLE is equipped with aft fan engines and GE is the only outfit I know of who produced aft fan engines for the XB-70 and the CONVAIR 990. And that B-66 has some serious engines hangin'-

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Don't make me go get my flying monkeys-

3rd photo is one of the lst Tiger Meets at Bitburg AF, Germany.

There is one left in the world and WIX member Cvairworks is its keeper.

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He bowls overhand...He is the most interesting man in the world.
"In Peace Japan Breeds War", Eckstein, Harper and Bros., 3rd ed. 1943(1927, 1928,1942)
"Leave it to ol' Slim. I got ideas...and they're all vile, baby." South Dakota Slim
"Ahh..."The Deuce", 28,000 pounds of motherly love." quote from some Mojave Grunt
DBF

The XC-99 makes everything else on that ramp look like toys!

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Dean Hemphill, K5DH
Port Charlotte, Florida

Inspector - I would say that is a pretty good guess, although I would have to guess earliest it can be is 65 since the Belfast first flight was Jan 64, and it didn't enter RAF service until Jan 66, and also what looks to be a "Beagle CC1 Basset" on the left didn't come into RAF service until 1965, although its first flight was in 1961.

"On 14 June 1968 a royal review was conducted at RAF Abingdon by Queen Elizabeth II to mark the 50th anniversary of the RAF."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RAF_Abingdon

Which matches the headline above the pic originally at the top.

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James K

"Switch on the underwater landing lights"
Emilio Largo, Thunderball.

www.VintageAeroWriter.com

The types are easy: DC-3s, Lockheed 14s and two Consolidated Liberators.

That photo is VERY interesting, and I don't think it's for a film or postwar.

The aerials and D/F loop setup, plus the short cowls on the Nazi-marked DC-3 make me think it's a captured or ex-neutral example from a pre-war European airline, in genuine German use. (Note it's the only one without an astrodome, making it probably delivered to user pre-war.) There were certainly other dark camouflaged German operated DC-3s wit the swastika on the tail (Ref HH Stapfler's 'Strangers in a Strange Land') and it also doesn't suffer from the common among film and propaganda examples of the 'rotated swastika' problem. Swastikas were 'disappeared' quickly in allied hands, so I don't think it's captured. But it still doesn't quite add up, so I could be very wrong...

The two Liberators to the right look like an RAF Coastal example, and a night bomber, going by the markings. Also they're the only 'military' aircraft there. The farther left DC-3 is in British wartime civil colours with the registration on the rear fuselage underlined by the red/white/blue stripe and with two-tone upper camouflage.

Note the silver(?) DC-3 has the airliner door and a port baggage compartment door open. Not a C-47 family member, again pointing to a civil owner originally, not a diverted military example.

Likewise, all the other aircraft (mostly Lockheed 14s) there were in use by wartime European airlines, and the mix of markings look like first generation airline schemes, rather than secondary or film efforts.

Location, given a German and British DC-3 on the same airfield, has (I hope!) to be a neutral airfield on the Atlantic or North Sea; which makes it Sweden, or more likely Portugal. Switzerland or Spain for a long guess. All that mean the Libs have to be transports / airliners, NOT military examples, but the roundel contradicts that. Very interesting, and I'm far from certain!

Regards,

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James K

"Switch on the underwater landing lights"
Emilio Largo, Thunderball.

www.VintageAeroWriter.com

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“Knowing what’s right, doesn’t mean much unless you do what’s right.”

That's DC-3-194-G D-ATJG. Previously PH-ASM 'Mees' (Titmouse) in KLM service, it was captured by the Germans after the fall of the Netherlands and after brief service with the Luftwaffe flew with Lufthansa for most of the war.

However it gets more interesting. It was damaged by an accident at Oslo in 1941, and after much negotiation, rebuilt by (neutral) Swissair for Lufthansa, but without any parts or drawing from Douglas or the US due to the US embargo to neutral countries. It then served "...until late 1944 or 1945 flying Lufthansa's Spanish route." So it could be the same, in better camouflage later in the war. The rear fuselage band scheme is post-rebuild.

Earlier still, while still in (then neutral) Dutch ownership, on 26 September 1939, PH-ASM was attacked by a German floatplane, and two passengers were killed and 80 bulletholes put into it. The pilot managed to get it to Schipol (Amsterdam). And interestingly, he was the redoubtable J.J. Moll, one of the pilots of the KLM DC-2 that came second in the 1934 Mildenhall to Melbourne air race!

In the summer of 1940, with the captured Czech and Dutch DC-2s and DC-3s, "Lufthansa was the largest operator of Douglas transports outsider the United States."

All the above thanks to H H Stapfer's 'Strangers in a Strange Land', Squadron Signal, 1988.

Regards,

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James K

"Switch on the underwater landing lights"
Emilio Largo, Thunderball.

www.VintageAeroWriter.com

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“Knowing what’s right, doesn’t mean much unless you do what’s right.”

I meant to say thanks for posting those up. The colour jet array's just a neat pic, while I'm still curious as to the location of that DC-3 et al shot.

Good brainteasers.

So yes, carry on, as the Navy says.

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James K

"Switch on the underwater landing lights"
Emilio Largo, Thunderball.

www.VintageAeroWriter.com