Warbird Information Exchange

With all the recent talk about the EC-121 flying to its new home at the Yanks Air Museum, the question came up about whether it will ever fly again. Do we know for a fact it will never fly again? Does Yanks fly any of their collection on any type of regular basis? I thought I recall a few years back their B-25 was still flying. Is that still the case?

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Ain't no sunshine when she's gone!

Frank Wright is coming on Warbird Radio LIVE in the morning to talk about the Yanks EC-121. When we spoke this afternoon he mentioned they'd like to keep it flying. I'm sure he'll discuss it in the morning.

Matt

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The Lockheed 12 was an occasional flyer about 5 years ago, other than that I'm not aware of anything there flying in a while.

Although they claim that everything is flyable, this is far from the case. I don't think they even run the engines as they complete restorations.

I can't say what is and isn't flyable at Yanks, but I can say that when Chris "Mustangdriver" Henry and I were there during our aviation museum roadtrip last August, the place was immaculate. The planes were kept very clean and everything looked to be in tip top condition. There was even an employee checking on tire pressures and wiping up oil spots. Obviously Planes of Fame is a MUST SEE stop at Chino, but if you are there, I highly encourage you to stop in at Yanks as well.

Zack

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Curator - EAA Aviation Museum, Oshkosh, WI
"Let No Story Go Untold!"
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Yeah, Yanks is indeed immaculate, just as you'd expect a mausoleum to be.

Planes of Fame is a little cluttered, dark in places, smelly and oily, and one of my top half-dozen favourite places on the planet!

I will always stand by my opinion that a static aircraft is not dead. Their collection is awesome.

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Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Manager

After having driven past Yanks for YEARS on my way to POF, I finally stopped in last year. I sure was missing out....


Yes, many of their planes are not flown, but my perception is that they are all in great condition, and they are kept in such a condition that only an annual would be needed to put them back in the air. In addition, their collection has many examples of very, very rare aircraft. It's not like they have a stable full of P-51's, P-40's and other birds that there are many examples of floating around. Hurting some of these birds would be a far greater loss than sticking yet another Mustang into the ground.

Other the other hand, while POF flys and wears out their planes, that means someday, only places like Yanks will have solid examples of the Types left. Plus....I don't see random aircraft disappearing from the collection as they are sold off (....just where did that ME 262 run off to...?).

The Me 262 from the POF collection is now with the Flying Heritage Collection.

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Ain't no sunshine when she's gone!

Exactly how does one "wear out" an airplane? There are still DC-3's flying that have to be 70+ years old, B-17's hat are 60+ years old, even some Jennys that are close to 90 years old. Sure, they have to be rebuilt from time to time, but if you think about it, static displays can "wear out" also. How much money did the Collings Foundation put in the B-24 to get it airworthy since it had been sitting so long. As I recall they had to do some major structural repair to the wing since it had sagged, for lack of a better word, from sitting so long. How about the famous, or infamous, Bejing P-61. There have been statements that if it was attempted to be moved it would fall apart. There was a recent article about an early B-52 that has to be scrapped on site since it is unsafe to move do to danger of falling apart.
As for putting another "Mustang into the ground", that is a bit of a harsh statement since that usually means that you also put a human being or two, if a passenger is on board, into the ground also. To me that is a worse loss.

My point in it is that there is room for both flying and static display museums. I don't agree with folks that say allwarbirds should be grounded anymore than I do with folks that say they should all fly. That is something I have said from day one of me being here. I don't know why there is an attitude of "If it doesn't fly it is a dead airplane"
As far as losing people in a crash, of course that is the number one concern. We can never get those loved ones back. That is not to be taken lightly. But you also can not pretend that there is 0 risk in losing a historic airframe. Sometimes they can't be rebuilt is my point.
I also can never figure out why when someone talks about an aircraft preserved on static display in a museum, that folks jump to a pole dancer or The P-61 in China. Those in my opinion are not examples of aircraft in museums, static display, or preserved in many cases. You honestly can not compare Yanks Air Museum and the China P-61. You can't compare the B-29 at the new England Air Museum with the one in Georgia in a field.
The term Dead airplane is insulting to the folks that work very hard on aircraft in museums like the NMUSAF, NMNA, NASM, and so many other fantastic museums.
From my visit in Chino I enjoyed both Yanks and Planes of Fame, and am thankful that both types of museums exist.

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Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Manager

I've had the pleasure of touring both Planes of Fame and Yanks (one of the greatest aviation-related days of my life!). I thoroughly enjoyed both museums. They both have some fantastic stuff on display. Everywhere you look, there's something cool!

The experience, however, was very different between the two museums.

I felt much more "at home" at POF. Yanks had sort of a cold, sterile feel to it, whereas POF felt more "alive" and inviting. The personnel at POF were warm and friendly, whereas the people at Yanks seemed cold and somewhat aloof. I was wearing my VFM dress uniform shirt and ID badge that day. When I identified myself to the folks working in the POF restoration hangar and told them that I was (at the time) one of the maintainers of B-17 Chuckie, they welcomed me into the resto hangar, which is normally off-limits to guests, and gave me a fantastic behind-the-scenes tour. They showed me all around the place, talked about all of the projects they had underway, and treated me like a friend and fellow "warbird guy". When I asked about where to go to get a decent burger, one guy offered to share his lunch with me! (I respectfully declined, and did eventually go get a burger). At Yanks, they do allow guests to walk through the restoration hangar, but you must stay behind the ropes and guests were asked not to "bother" the restoration workers. The workmen that day were clearly not interested in answering questions or interacting with guests (my personal observation, YMMV). They didn't give a tinker's darn that I worked on warbirds myself. It was obvious that I was just another f---ing tourist.

Now, don't get me wrong. As I stated above, I enjoyed both facilities. I have the utmost respect for both organizations. Their collections are truly world-class. I recommend to friends that if they are going to be in the LA area, they should head out to Chino and visit both facilities. I'd love to go back there myself one day.

I was just really, really, REALLY surprised at the difference in attitude between the two.

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Dean Hemphill, K5DH
Port Charlotte, Florida

As a member who mostly reads and seldom replies to the threads on this forum, I have seen (and no doubt will see) this debate arise countless times. My $.02, which is about exactly how much it's worth, is that no surviving airframe is "dead." It is all too easy for us with little experience but starry eyes to make the argument that everything should fly or even that all static aircraft should be indoors. Until we have been in the shoes of those making these decisions or paying the operating, maintenance, and/or other costs, it is a moot point. I think the big issue in the case of Yanks and other, similar outfits is that they have a collection of rare aircraft which have been painstakingly restored to "airworthy" standards, but are not flown. Any time the effort is made to make an aircraft operational (even if just for a ferry flight), it always seems much more significant to me when said aircraft is parked or preserved in a static museum...just because the imagination cannot help but picture the plane in flight, particularly if it last flew in your lifetime. A few good examples include the B-29 restored for ferry to the IWM in England in 1980 video here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qPgz3P8q1VM Or the lengthy restoration of a C-124 so it could be flown to its final resting place: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2K44L3KmoBU (watch closely in the beginning of the video for all the B-29s!) And finally, there's the B-47 on display at Castle Air Museum. According to the museum's own website, the plane was restored to the tune of 36,000 man hours so that it could make the final flight of a B-47 in 1986. Unfortunately, I could not find video of this one...http://www.castleairmuseum.org/boeing_b47e.html None of these aircraft are "dead," per say, and we are fortunate that they have been preserved, but at the same time, none of them were ever de-milled, gutted, or vandalized, and it seems more a shame to see them parked knowing that they went from dormant to briefly operational and back to dormant. Again, just my $.02...

Matt

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I'm looking for that buried Corsair(s) that I can dig up, pressure wash, and fly!

Been going to Chino for 20 years, never been in Yanks as the place always looks like it's locked up when I go past. Do they actually have regular open hours?

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This should answer your question www.yanksair.com/visit

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Ain't no sunshine when she's gone!

I will say after checking out their website, the place looks well lit which is a big plus.

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Ain't no sunshine when she's gone!