Stukas Anyone?

JDK · **Posted:** Sun Oct 09, 2011 12:22 am

Thanks Steve. I enjoyed that first Nemo flick, mainly (as a good Melbourne boy) because it points out Sydney's toilets flush direct to Sydney Harbour. :lol:

I'll have to look out for the squidquel. :wink:

JDK · **Posted:** Sun Oct 09, 2011 12:29 am

Thanks for the video link Steve. It's nasty, and however realistic is is or isn't, it's worth being reminded than most people's experience of war was being in the wrong place and having a good chance of being maimed or killed - usually, essentially pointlessly.

I've been to Leningrad and seen the mass graves. We in the west remain mostly very naive over the cost and the terrible battles on the Eastern Front.

Regards,

DoraNineFan · **Joined:** Fri Aug 12, 2005 3:37 pm **Posts:** 671

In another topic, someone mentioned a Stuka that was buried at Wright Field (or was it O'hare?) after disposal by the AAF and that the burial sites were identified by a veteran. Also, periodic digs have been conducted over the years. Given the rebuild skills available today, even a crushed airframe could possibly be used as a pattern.

How thorough were these digs? And given the rarity of Luftwaffe types, how difficult would it be for more digs to be conducted since they could perhaps provide a Stuka and He119 and perhaps other test aircraft? Surely the property owners would recognize the rarity of the planes.

Steve Nelson · **Posted:** Sun Oct 09, 2011 9:48 pm

I've heard stories that a bunch of captured Axis aircraft were used as landfill at O'hare airport, and are now under the runways.

Supposedly, some of the burnt-out remains of the prototype B-17 are buried on Wright Field. The relatively undamaged tail section was recovered, and used as a testbed for various armament installations.

SN

Sasquatch · **Posted:** Mon Oct 10, 2011 3:00 pm

Steve Nelson wrote:

Here's a pic scanned from the old Aero Publishers monograph on the Stuka. It appears to be the Chicago machine at the time of its capture. The wheel pants have already been removed, but appear to be laying underneath the aicraft. Steve, does your photo show the Stuka as having wheel pants when it was in Canada?

SN

I've seen that photo before when I was at the Chicago Museum of Science and History. The paint certainly looks authentic. Yet, when I stood there looking at the photo, and looking at the plane, I noticed several variations in the camo patterns. Now, I'm guessing they had to repair the plane...probably several times between the time they captured it, and current time.

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_10053 ... m#10053362

So look at these linked photos and the one above, expecially directly below the cockpit, and note the differences in the patterns. What do you guys think about the patterns and how much of it do you think remains authentic?

--Tom

Steve Nelson · **Posted:** Mon Oct 10, 2011 5:14 pm

Well, when you look at the airplane today it's obvious there have been repairs and touch-ups over the years, but it still probably one of the most original Luftwaffe aircraft (and paintjobs) in the world. I'm just glad she wasn't stripped and given some Luftwaffe-ish paint job after the war like so many captured Axis aircraft.

A few pics I shot last year. One of these days I really need to get a real DSLR..my current camera just doesn't cut it in dark museums.

This stencil on the side of the radiator certainly looks like a repaint.

When you look closely at the underside, there are some original stencils that are surrounded by a lighter, greener shade. I used to assume that this was RLM 65, and the stencils were masked off when the underside was painted RLM 78 (the deeper blue used in North Africa.) Now I think it's probably just as likely that the stencils may have been masked during some touch up painting.

There are several areas of damage on the aircraft. Whether it's combat damage, or was acquired during her postwar adventures I don't know. Here's what appears to be shrapnel damage on the upper right wing.

The centerline bomb rack is painted what appears to be zinc chromate green. I'm assuming its a replacement or even reproduction. I don't think the bombs on the outboard racks are even German.

The museum had added some mannequins to the cockpit since my last visit (and moved the aircraft.) You can see some traces of what appears to be zinc chromate primer around the edges of the pilot's canopy, leading me to believe it's been repainted (obviously from the photo of her in Canada, all the glass has been replaced.)

It would be nice to see her taken done from the dusty rafters and given some serious conservation work. But all in all, I'm just glad she's still with us. The fact that she's still wearing at least some of her original paint is just a nice bonus.

SN

gflinch · **Posted:** Mon Oct 10, 2011 5:19 pm

[quote="Steve Nelson"]Well, when you look at the airplane today it's obvious there have been repairs and touch-ups over the years, but it still probably one of the most original Luftwaffe aircraft (and paintjobs) in the world. I'm just glad she wasn't stripped and given some Luftwaffe-ish paint job after the war like so many captured Axis aircraft.

Hey I think you took as many as I did, when I was there back in april this year. Really amazing that there is both the only Ju87 in the US and the only Uboat that you can tour in one place.

I have to say, I am a little dissapointed that the rest of the place is a circus (my opinion). I guess I am just getting older, and with no kids, don't see the point of the rest. I have always expected a museum to be cold/old/and stale, not used to see all the kiddy stuff at museums.

Anyhow, back to reality.
Greg

OOPS Screwed up post, missed deleting the images.

Sasquatch · **Posted:** Mon Oct 10, 2011 6:06 pm

Hey Steve and Gflinch, you guys got some great shots! I think in the crew close-up you can see the faint demarcation line under the cockpits where they faired in the touch-ups. But in all honesty, I do think they did a splendid job matching the original paint and splotching. As an A&P with a few paint jobs under my belt, I gotta say, it's darn tough to match existing paint...even more so when the original is decades old. So I do think they did a great job. But it is fun to compare photos just for the fun of it.

Thanks for posting your recent photos!

--Tom

JDK · **Posted:** Mon Oct 10, 2011 6:41 pm

The story of the paint on the Stuka is here in the archives on WIX. I know, because I asked the museum and posted the response here. So, off to the archives for anyone looking for fun.

gary1954 · **Posted:** Mon Oct 10, 2011 7:35 pm

Cherrybomber13 wrote:

All depends on how much money you want to toss someones way, with the right number of 0000's any thing can be built

seriously that would be a show stopper at oshkosh... imagine the impression you could make diving in with the sirens wailing...

That would be Awesome....Maybe there is one lying in the woods yet undiscovered in Russia of former Russian territories...ya never know.

Maybe the plans for the 87 are available in Germany and a set of pants can be made for this airframe, or maybe the RAF Museum could assist in manufacturing a pair, they do after all have a JU87-Aircraft Serial Number: 494083

gary1954 · **Posted:** Mon Oct 10, 2011 7:41 pm

JDK wrote:

Depending on how you cherry-pick your criteria, the Junkers Ju 87 is the most under-represented of major historic types of W.W.II or (arguably again) all aviation / military history. The Ju 87 was an integral element of the German concept of Blitzkreig as a specific type, rather than being the type to hand to fill a standard role (which most fighters and bombers were) and as such was a key tool in changing the face of warfare in 1939-40.

Kinda like the A-10 Thunderbolt (which is an wonderfully Awesome aircraft) before Desert Storm

JDK · **Posted:** Tue Oct 11, 2011 6:20 am

Here's a photo of the remarkably convincing but sadly static full scale model at Omaka, New Zealand.

mike furline · **Joined:** Wed May 05, 2004 3:45 pm **Posts:** 2629

fotobass · **Posted:** Tue Oct 11, 2011 9:49 pm

Steve T wrote:

Achtung folks!

Found the CD with the digitized Stuka pic and it's now on P'bucket, so here it is. The prop has indeed seen some repair work, as can be discerned! Wheel pants nope, BTW, at least circa 1945 when this pic was probably taken. Canopy glass nope either. Incidentally I've heard she's got replacement wheels...from a Texan!...the originals having suffered damage when she "deadsticked" onto the museum floor decades ago.

S.

Check out the images of this Stuka in Montreal postwar...looks like our gal in Chicago, and the prop matches up as well...

http://www.ebay.com/itm/WWI-Photo-RARE- ... 1c1fc05734

CDF · **Posted:** Wed Oct 12, 2011 4:11 am

Frankfurt 1987

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Germany- ... 1230888/L/

Moscow 2004

http://www.flankers-site.co.uk/mos2004_day02.html

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