Warbird Information Exchange

look at it as a 1/2 glass full & not 1/2 empty. at least the cannons will be preserved.

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tom d. friedman - hey!!! those fokkers were messerschmitts!! * without ammunition, the usaf would be just another flying club!!! * better to have piece of mind than piece of tail!!

I picture the same thing happening to the P-38 on the beach in the UK. Right now it is doing the slow fizz. If it was salvaged that process would be complete in just a few weeks.

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Always looking for WW2 Half-Tracks and Parts.

i agree as well

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tom d. friedman - hey!!! those fokkers were messerschmitts!! * without ammunition, the usaf would be just another flying club!!! * better to have piece of mind than piece of tail!!

ATTENTION PLEASE.......

I sincerely think that I am about 95% closer to finding out which aircraft this is BUT I NEED HELP!!!

The other day I was washing off one of the inwing ammo cans that I had pulled off the wreck and noticed that the water was acting funny around two areas on the center (bottom)panel of the bottom of the can. It was as if " SOMETHING " had been written on there with a grease pencil or other type of " oily " marker.

Any-hew, (here is the exciting part) I have three cans at my house, TWO of which have the exact same number " WRITTEN " on the bottom of them, so I went back to the wreck and looked at two other cans that I left there due to damage, and one of them has the same number written on there. Now please help me make sure that I am ASSUMING correctly. Three out of 5 of the ammo cans have this same number " WRITTEN " on the bottom????????

DOES OR COULD THIS SOUND LIKE A " SIDE " NUMBER?????????

This is how the writing appears on each can if you were to look at the bottom of each one! I do have pictures but have a hell of a time posting them on here from a gov't computer.

597 597 597

AFT FWD AFT

So if anyone can help me, PLEASE DO SO!!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks!!!!!!!!

Jason

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.

MA1 I just checked through Joe Baugher's website and it does NOT appear that any Dash 5's were produced with a BuNo ending in "597". So it doesn't seem to be a bureau number.

Also if by side number you mean the "Modex" number. I suppose its possible but usually the first number of the Modex is assigned to a particular squadron during that cruise and the 2nd and 3rd digits are assigned to each aircraft in the that squadron. Squadron's don't have 97 aircraft, usually around 14 to 16 So "597" would seem to be an odd Modex for an aircraft but not impossible for some reason.

My question would be did Corsairs come from the factory with Ammo cans already installed and could the "597" be an aircraft construction number? This still may not be definite as it could be possible that cans got swapped around as you saw different numbers. Also since it was a temporary marking could the numbers on the cans have been the number of rounds loaded?

Very interesting.

Shay
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Semper Fortis

Shay,

Thanks for the reply! Yes, Modex number is what I meant! When I was in HS-11 we only had 6 aircraft assigned to the squadron, seven when we went out for 6 months. Our Modex's, were 610, 611, 612, 614, 615 & 616. Usually the 1st four helo's were " Foxtrot's " with the modex being the last three digits of Buno # ie. 164610, 164611, 164612 etc. etc.

Now the numbers on three of the cans were the same, 597. I have a link of 7 20mm rounds at the house that I got off of the USS Cole when it was inport and I don't think that 597 rounds of 20mm ammo would have fit in these boxes, possibly, I may be wrong.

But like you said, very interesting! But I really hope that it is something related to the bird's ID.

Shay,

Also, take a look at my Facebook page, http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id= ... .730521148 (third picture, second row in the folder). There is a picture of the starboard wing that two of the ammo cans came out of. They are marked with the number " 3 " on one and the number " 4 " on the other one! You can't see the numbers but you can clearly see the outlines of both lids of the cans on the left side of the pic.

If you look to the right of the outer two cans, you can see two more cans, one with the lid missing off of it with a second can behind it! Hope you like them!

Jason

Unfortunately, your Facebook page isn't coming up. However, the numbers you see written on the top of the cans "3" and "4" have to do with the position the ammo can has on the wing (rather than referring to any bureau number). However, the other numbers you mentioned earlier may indeed refer to the serial number. I have seen a number of ammo cans from RNZAF F4U-1A/FG-1D corsairs and they often had the RNZAF serial number annotated on them... usually in short hand, ie. the last few digits. On another note, are we sure that this is indeed an F4U-5, rather than an AU-1 or cannon-armed F4U-4/7? We should check the numbers of these aircraft too. It would be really helpful to see the photos though. Thanks for taking the time to preserve this history. The other stuff, even if it's crushed is probably still worth looking through for parts too, by the way. There are bound to be static examples out there that need a few bits to help them along.

Cheers,
Richard

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Richard Mallory Allnutt - Photography - http://www.rmallnutt.com

Richard,

Yes, it definately is an F4U-5N. Already confirmed that! My full name is Jason Carpenter. My profile pic is of me in a brown t-shirt with a blue Under Armour beanie on my head! Go to my photos and look under the folder that says " F4U-5N 20mm Cannon Removal " or something to that effect! I have pics of the plane when they pulled it out and as it sits now!

I knew the numbers on the ammo cans were the positions (3 & 4) but the 3 digit number " 597 " like I mentioned earlier, I am hoping is part or at least the last three digets of the buno/serial number as you mentioned but I don't know where to start looking or who to talk to about this! Hopeing someone on here can help!

Thanks,
Jason

Jason

I guess my mind was in Fighter Squadron mode which generally have a larger aircraft compliment. That may have been an exception on your cruise, but typically aircraft BuNo.s don't align with Modex assignments. An example from the 1970 Satan's Kittens cruise aboard the USS Oriskany:

VF-191 (F-8J Crusader)
Modex BuNo
100 150299
101 ????
102 150872
103 150318
104 150900 (My Uncle's assigned aircraft and later scored a unofficial MIG-17 kill in 1972 by LT. J.Tucker)
105 149205
106 150670
107 150871
110 150889
111 150289
112 150660
113 150315
114 ???

Also according to JB's site your Modex 616 couldn't have been BuNo 164616 as this Hawk was struck off charge prior to delivery due to an accident. So like I said before it could happen but not generally likely.

Dash 5 production #'s: One source lists 568 -5s being built.
BuNo:
(-5, -5N, -5P) 121793 - 122066, (-5) 122153 - 122166, (-5P) 122167 - 122206, (-5N, -5NL) 123144 - 123203, (-5N) 124441 - 124503, (-5NL) 124504 - 124560, (-5N) 124665 - 124709, (-5NL) 124710 - 124724

Regarding the AU-1 possiblity: 111 built, BuNo.s 129318 - 129417, 133833 - 133843 ( No 597)

Regarding the Dash 7 - They were French Navy only I believe.

Here is a list, I compiled from information on GONAVY.jp, of Post 1947 Squadron Dash 5 deployments on Med cruises. This may not be a complete list as these are only from the big carriers and i haven't come across any info regarding -5s on post war Jeep carriers (if they were).



Hope some of this helps in finding the identity.

Shay
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Semper Fortis

Yeah it didn't occur to me til after I asked about the round capacity to check. 20mm rounds capacity is listed as being "924". Still think it could be a factory construction number. How do we know it's a (-5N) vs a (-5), (-5NL) or a (-5P)? Jason if you could flood this forum with pictures, there are alot more knowledgeable people than myself on here that can ID the most minute details. Any luck on finding the Data plate in the cockpit?

Shay
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Semper Fortis

sorry, it's not junk, it's history. It's an aircraft that served our nation to protect and fight. So i don't consider it junk, no matter the condition.

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" I am a nobody in aviation, but somebody to my family."

Shay,

No luck on the data plate! We moved everything around as best we could inside the over turned cockpit short of rolling the aircraft over to see what we could find! There was no luck seeing on the bulkhead of the engine compartment. Would it be on the cockpit side or not?

I have been trying like CRAZY to post pictures on here but everytime I use the IMG button, all it does is drop this " ". Am I doing something wrong? Hercules130, asked me to send him a cockpit picture, which I have. I would really like to get that on here as well as the others!

Jason

P.S. Go to my Facebook page and send a Friend request!

if you look inside the wing roots, where the wing folds upwards. There should be a data plate inside there marked " Briggs" with a serial number. I don't remember if you need to remove the outer wing from the spar section to view it. That's IF it's there. I was working on a port outer fg-1d wing and saw that it had one. Maybe you would have luck with that?

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" I am a nobody in aviation, but somebody to my family."

Jason, you have to have your images hosted somewhere on a website, not just your computer.

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Sure, Charles Lindbergh flew the plane... but Tom Rutledge built the engine!

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