Warbird Information Exchange

They have a fair amount of LITHIUM in the metal compound, good against corrosion and loosening and long lived, Boeings been making wing and fuselage skins with lithium for a long time and extended the corrosion warranty.

I used to catch guys @ BADWRENCH shooting 'B' rivets in aileron skins 'cause D's are too tough', yeah, but 'D's will stay put, B's will vibrate loose in no time, especialy on an aileron 'WHAT!?! ARE YOU NEW!!??!!"

And if for some unknown reason @ Boeing you need an 'A' rivet, you can't just go to the roto-bin and get a handful anymore, you need a note from your Manager accompianied by a copy of the R/T repair from Engineering. You go to the crib or more likely your leadperson, the guy or gal issues you exactly as many as specified and not one extra. In the dark past (tho I REALLY wouldn't know ANYTHING ABOUT IT) people plugged 'oops' holes with 'A's and when the airframe was inspected @ a 'C' or 'D' check, there would be all these lightly countersunk open holes in the structure.

Makes you feel good when you and your partner have shot several hundreds of rivets and only find a very few that need replaced, and chances are, as soon as you hit the bad fastener you knew it and flinched.

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Don't make me go get my flying monkeys-

Is it me, or are A rivets a royal pain in the @ss to drill out? Do you guys have any thought on tungsten bucking bars? I just ordered one the other day out of curiosity but it hasn't shown up yet.

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Defending Stearmans on WIX since Jeff started badmouthing them back in 2005.

Hee hee, you got that right when you know it was a bad shoot.

Dan, the "E"s shoot like a DD except no heat treat. You get one shot to do it right, no "a little more". With DDs you need a heat treat oven to do a batch and ovens are not cheap, then a cooler with dry ice to store them until it's time to shoot, and then hope the rivet you're shooting is heat treated correctly or didn't get left out in room temperature too long. I shot a lot of DDs repairing Lockheed 1011s at Eastern Airlines, we had all of the equipment and it was still a big pain in the rear end. We would have to drill out and reshoot about 20-30% of what we shot.

What are the E's like to drill out if you screw one up?

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Defending Stearmans on WIX since Jeff started badmouthing them back in 2005.

Your problem with the "A" rivet may be too much pressure with a sharp bit. The aluminum is so soft the drill bit may be digging in. The "A" rivet shouldn't be used in anything structural, they're good for shooting on data plates or plugging tooling holes and that's about all.

The "E"s are just like any other aluminum rivet to drill out.

A's are almost kitchen foil, they have zero heat treat so they will be very difficult to drill out unless you practice a lot! because you can't 'feel' the difference between the fastener head/shank and the material it's in. Don't ever drill a rivet completely thorugh, just enough to remove the head and a tiny amount of the shank, use a partner with a bucking bar alongside the bucktail and drive the rivet out with the next size smaller pin punch, result? far fewer ovaled or barrelled holes. Practice man, practice-

Tungsten bars are great! they are less prone to marking if you hit a screw or nut while riveting, the down side is you can't re-countour one without removing the tungsten treatment.

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Don't make me go get my flying monkeys-

I hadn't thought of trying a duller bit. They were just startlingly soft to remove (and sharp!) All I was using them for was plugging a few lines of holes when I converted an old janitrol control box into the main junction box for the airplane. The janitrol box was divided up into a couple of compartments and the dividers were riveted to the sides, so all I was using them for was literally plugging the holes. I did succeed in pooching a couple of them at first as they just drove like butter. But if riveting is an art, removing them well and consistently is a black art!

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Defending Stearmans on WIX since Jeff started badmouthing them back in 2005.

"When you have learned all, and practiced much, then, perhaps you will be permitted to walk outside the black lines on the wing grasshopper"

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Don't make me go get my flying monkeys-

THAT I'm going to use!!

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Defending Stearmans on WIX since Jeff started badmouthing them back in 2005.

Sheer is for pantyhose!

Negligees.

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Defending Stearmans on WIX since Jeff started badmouthing them back in 2005.

Remind me NOT to go camping wit you'se guys! I'm guessing he meant shear

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Don't make me go get my flying monkeys-

You might try Guardian Fastener. They make a lot of the old head style rivets. Tungsten bars are worth their weight in gold. I wish I had them 20 Years ago when I started metal working. Would have saved a lot of smashed fingers.

Randy Tait

Thanks Randy, I'll give them a look.

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Defending Stearmans on WIX since Jeff started badmouthing them back in 2005.