Warbird Information Exchange

You might be amazed at how easy it is to obtain a glider rating or add one.

If you are already a power pilot, the add on can even be done in a week or so. You need a minimum of 10 flights after solo and the flight test. There's no further written test, but there is an oral, mine was pretty easy, with the flight test. Cost estimates on one site are about $1300.

There are a couple of things that make a basic training glider very easy to fly. Take the basic Schweizer 2-33, my favorite. Everything happens so slowly,even compared to a C-172. It stalls at about 38 mph, and you fly the pattern at 55, slowing to 50 mph. It is very forgivng, almost won't stall, much less spin. Above all, the glide ratio is listed as 23 to 1, about double of most powered planes, so a little height is money in the bank. Now it won't penetrate a headwind, so stay close or upwind of the airport if it is windy, or fly on calm days.
When you open the airbrakes or spoilers, the glide ratio becomes about 5 to 1, so it is easy to land in a small space and to touch near a chosen spot, and flare is easy.

Doing the whole rating from scratch to private glider pilot might take about 6 weeks if you are dillegent. Most people take about 25 flights to solo, then you are reqired to have 10 solo flights and 2 hours solo, and a written and fight test.

The cost might be about $4500, much cheaper than a powered rating.

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Bill Greenwood
Spitfire N308WK

Bill,

I love the 2-33.., I have been flying gliders since I was fourteen years old. They are fantastic and the 2-33 is one of the safest ones out there.., you get into trouble with her and you just let go., and she will basically right herself.

I love soaring!!! It is a completely different sensation in flying.., you don't feel pulled as by a prop or pushed as by a jet or lifted as by a helicoptor.., you feel like you are flying. I can not say enough good things about it.

Also great training for deadstick landings! lol

Cheers

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S.

I got a little time in a 2-33 a long time ago. It was the slowest responding a/c I ever flew until I got some time in a Lockheed L-10A.....Give the input on the stick and then count several numbers til it starts to react....Really makes you learn to look and plan ahead to make things happen just like you want them to. Maybe one of these days I'll get back to working on my rating and get my oldest interested....

Wow.., I never had that sensation with a 2-33 in all my years flying them. Maybe your control cables were made out of bungies?

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S.

Got my glider rating through CAP in 1966. Still believe that it really teaches you the basics of flying as opposed to powered aircraft. Plus, you don't need to have an aircraft launch you - use an auto tow.

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Bob

Mr Greenwood,

After talking with sevral pilots, I decided to start with my glider rating. So far I have about 5-6 flights in, but have been to long inbetween flights. Hopefully next year, I will be able to take a month or two and complete the lessons and get my rating.

Flying the glider has been lots of fun, and I will contiue flying one even once I complete my Private pilot rating (the eventuall goal). Of course it is probably easier for me since there is a glider club located on my home base airport. There is a monthly $50.00 fee, then a tow fee, for the final cost per flight. I can use the Gliders of the club anytime they are not booked. This one example where the cost per flight hour actually go down the more you fly.

Laterrrrrrrr
Avn-Tech

Avn-tech,
Great tip that you put up about being in a glider club to cut costs of learning and flying. One source that I read on another site said club cost might be half of what getting the rating alone would be.
There are a couple of drawbacks that might apply to some clubs. The one here in Boulder does not have any 2-33, so you;d have to learn in something else. Also the club is mostly active on weekends.

What is the town or airport where you are?

If you can, get out there and finish, one way to save money is to fly often so there is no forgetting or stale period between flights.
Also watching other pilots go and come back to land can be a learning experience and it is free.

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Bill Greenwood
Spitfire N308WK

I've never tried auto tow (always wanted to) but I highly recommend trying a winch launch if you have the chance. After next to no ground roll you pitch just about straight up and follow a huge arc to release height. Very exciting.

-Tim

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Keep 'em Flying.

Here is all the info on where to go:
http://www.ssa.org/

Auto tow was a blast. We used one of the runways out at Hondo back in the mid-80's. Quite a thrill. You actually have a guy sitting in the back of the truck(car) hanging over the edge with a large knife or hatchet to whack the rope if the glider does not release at the apex. Thrilling on both ends of that rope!

I'll tell you it really fine tunes your piloting skills. You feel everything in that glider. You hear everything.., sense the airframe like no other form of fixed wing flight.

You also learn to knock buzzards out of thermals! That is the most fun!

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S.

Cvair,
A 2-33 is designed for training all students, from basic day one. Therefore quick controls aren't required or even desired.
Especially when on tow behind the tug, you wouldn't want the elevator to be too sensitive.

The 2-33s that I often fly at Boulder seem to have some play in the controls, and I don't know whether the bearings and rod ends in the system are worn or that is just the way it is. It really doesn't bother me in flying, and as for as the ailerons, they seem ok to me, but realize that you need rudder with them also. Quick ailerons in a 2-33 don't seem needed. I sometimes fly a Grob 103, the 2 place long wing one, and it has very slow roll and lot's of adverse yaw, and the elevator is sensitive. Of course it's glide is much better.
For general handling I like the single place Grob 102, pretty fair performance and handles like an airplane.

The most sluggish alierons I have ever seen were in the Ford Trimoter, like putting the helm over on a ship. The next most were in a PBY Catalina seaplane. Dennis Buein give me the pilots seat and the wheel ,then they went back in the rear. The ailerons were so slow, that I thought they might have a differnt set of controls in the back and were joking with me. They had a great time walking back and forth in the fuselage to change the cg while I was trying to acheive level flight. A great plane,but no fighter!

For really nice ailerons, light and quick, try a Buecker. P-40 has good ones also. The F-15 sim that I flew was almost too quick on the alierons. I like the Spitifre controls, not super quick, but with real good positive feel.

I haven't had a chance to try an auto or winch tow,hope to sometime.

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Bill Greenwood
Spitfire N308WK

I started out in the mid-80's with the ASK-21 and Grob 103, didn't fly the 2-33 until well after I had my license. By then it was slow and comparatively unresponsive compared to the glass sailplanes BUT taught me a lot and was nice and simple to fly. Very little workload and you have the time to look around really enjoy the flight.
You're right 330th, stealing lift from buzzards is a blast, and you have not lived until you have flown formation with a hawk!

I love the ol' 2-33. That's the first aircraft I soloed on. I did my glider license through the Royal Canadian Air Cadet program in 1998. Since then I have about 130 hours in the 2-33. I instructed for a few years on them too.

With the cadet gliding program we have about 12 x 2-33A's and 5 x L-19 Birdogs. Of the 12 gliders, they all seemed to fly differently. Every year one of the gliders are torn down during the winter and restored, because they really took a beating. So, depending on the last restoration the gliders received, the better or worse the handling and appearance.

Bill, you're certainly right about the disinterest the 2-33 has in stalling. We always joked that if you were flying a 2-33 and anything were to go wrong, just let go of the stick and the plane will fix the situation and practically return to a normal glide attitude on its own. In fact, when practicing stalls, spins, and spirals you actually had to work quite hard to keep the glider in the maneuver.

I got a few opportunities to do some soaring/thermalling during our operations and it is one of the greatest feelings in the world. I suppose it's a lot like sailing a sailboat. It's just you and nature.

I haven't flown gliders in almost 5 years though, but when I get a better job I'm wanting to get back into gliding and maybe buying one; maybe a 2-33 or maybe something more skookum.

I HIGHLY recommend getting a glider endorsement, or in the least going for a glider flight at your local club. It's fantastic fun.

Now, I gotta say, I've never had the 'joy' of doing a winch or auto tow, but have heard they are quite exciting. I would like to try a winch launch someday, but I'm more than happy to live with being towed to altitude rather than hurdled there.

That's my two nickels.

Peace,

David