Thu Aug 13, 2009 6:24 pm
Hi Jerry,
I think $50-75 might be a safe range for a private warbird show, and while I could go the $100, I know some of my buddies probably wouldn't shell it out for the show.
Thunder Over Mi I think had their most successful gate entrance show ever this year, and they charged $25 for adults, and kids 15 (wow) and under were free (I think parking was $10), and of course the Blue Angels flew in the show. Cars were still pouring through the gates all the way up to the time the Blues took to the air, I couldn't believe the crowds.
When I hear someone complaining about the price of an airshow ticket, whether it be $15 or $20, I usually ask them what it cost them to go to a ball game, or car race? And the ball games here cost $20 to park.
I think $50-75 might be a safe range for a private warbird show, and while I could go the $100, I know some of my buddies probably wouldn't shell it out for the show.
Thunder Over Mi I think had their most successful gate entrance show ever this year, and they charged $25 for adults, and kids 15 (wow) and under were free (I think parking was $10), and of course the Blue Angels flew in the show. Cars were still pouring through the gates all the way up to the time the Blues took to the air, I couldn't believe the crowds.
When I hear someone complaining about the price of an airshow ticket, whether it be $15 or $20, I usually ask them what it cost them to go to a ball game, or car race? And the ball games here cost $20 to park.
Thu Aug 13, 2009 6:25 pm
Isn't an airshow without a crowd called a "fly-in" - with limits on aerobatics? 
I've been to a few good fly-ins and they generally seem to have a much lower crowd percentage - but you'll still have the odd "pilot" who doesn't know a B-17 from a Hellcat.
Ryan
I've been to a few good fly-ins and they generally seem to have a much lower crowd percentage - but you'll still have the odd "pilot" who doesn't know a B-17 from a Hellcat.
Ryan
Thu Aug 13, 2009 6:50 pm
$25 a day- go to Oshkosh, and then you don't need to go to another airshow all year. 
Thu Aug 13, 2009 8:34 pm
Well,
Here is the WIX "Cheap Bastard" chiming in for a little abuse.
HELL NO!
I would not pay $100 to go to a warbird show unless....
1. You would offer Food! Always a plus! Get the sponsors to feed us!
2. You offer a 10% discount for doing something stupid, like entering a special presale code, like "WRBRD!" on your website.
3. Let Ryan K. come
4. Dont kick everybody out at 4:30, we dont like that!
5. Play Rain themed songs during showers to placate us die hards.
Screw it, just go to Geneseo! Its a bargain!
This year we spent...
$75 on a family membership, got us into the show for almost less than daily admission for 3 days.
$70 on 4 dinner tix for each night, I bought 2 extras of each.
$60 on a dorm room for Friday night
10,000 points for a room at the Quality Inn Geneseo, Sat.
$100 in Gas, $100 in other food
Once again, counting down the days till next year!
See you there! You too Jeff!
Here is the WIX "Cheap Bastard" chiming in for a little abuse.
HELL NO!
I would not pay $100 to go to a warbird show unless....
1. You would offer Food! Always a plus! Get the sponsors to feed us!
2. You offer a 10% discount for doing something stupid, like entering a special presale code, like "WRBRD!" on your website.
3. Let Ryan K. come
4. Dont kick everybody out at 4:30, we dont like that!
5. Play Rain themed songs during showers to placate us die hards.
Screw it, just go to Geneseo! Its a bargain!
This year we spent...
$75 on a family membership, got us into the show for almost less than daily admission for 3 days.
$70 on 4 dinner tix for each night, I bought 2 extras of each.
$60 on a dorm room for Friday night
10,000 points for a room at the Quality Inn Geneseo, Sat.
$100 in Gas, $100 in other food
Once again, counting down the days till next year!
See you there! You too Jeff!
Thu Aug 13, 2009 8:43 pm
RyanShort1 wrote:Isn't an airshow without a crowd called a "fly-in" - with limits on aerobatics?
Ryan
I agree that fly-ins are generally more intimate, but if you want the big draws or unique aircraft, they won't come for just fuel. You gotta get them some money to come, which increases the fly-in's generally low budget.
Jerry
Thu Aug 13, 2009 9:18 pm
Heh...
The figures are unknown in North America because most Americans are still in shock from the car petrol price to get there from the airport.
More seriously, the answers are, IIRC, on the respective websites.
The next major Duxford show is 25 quid. (US$41) Legends is more, IIRC.
http://duxford.iwm.org.uk/server/show/nav.24102
Shuttleworth's next are 20 quid. (US$33)
http://www.shuttleworth.org/events.asp
The flying days at Temora, NSW, Australia are A$20 (US$16) or A$35 (US$29) for a two day pass. But you are going to have to travel by road five hours or seven hours from Sydney or Melbourne - so the entry cost is the least of your worries.
http://www.aviationmuseum.com.au/visit/ ... ickets.cfm
These are all full paying adult prices.
However I also don't generally pay to go through the gate, so I don't notice costs most of the time. And there's a significant segment of the hardy faithful that August's plan is after snagging who are pro- or semi-pro or crew - so you'll lose a good 10 - 20 percent of the dedicated enthusiast revenue because they'll be putting the show on or reporting it.
It's an interesting question, and I'll have a think about it and respond more fully when I'm back on home turf.
HTH,
Jerry O'Neill wrote:I wonder if anybody has an idea of what it costs to attend a show in the UK, say like Duxford or Old Warden?
The figures are unknown in North America because most Americans are still in shock from the car petrol price to get there from the airport.
More seriously, the answers are, IIRC, on the respective websites.
The next major Duxford show is 25 quid. (US$41) Legends is more, IIRC.
http://duxford.iwm.org.uk/server/show/nav.24102
Shuttleworth's next are 20 quid. (US$33)
http://www.shuttleworth.org/events.asp
The flying days at Temora, NSW, Australia are A$20 (US$16) or A$35 (US$29) for a two day pass. But you are going to have to travel by road five hours or seven hours from Sydney or Melbourne - so the entry cost is the least of your worries.
http://www.aviationmuseum.com.au/visit/ ... ickets.cfm
These are all full paying adult prices.
However I also don't generally pay to go through the gate, so I don't notice costs most of the time. And there's a significant segment of the hardy faithful that August's plan is after snagging who are pro- or semi-pro or crew - so you'll lose a good 10 - 20 percent of the dedicated enthusiast revenue because they'll be putting the show on or reporting it.
It's an interesting question, and I'll have a think about it and respond more fully when I'm back on home turf.
HTH,
Thu Aug 13, 2009 9:42 pm
Jerry O'Neill wrote:RyanShort1 wrote:Isn't an airshow without a crowd called a "fly-in" - with limits on aerobatics?
Ryan
I agree that fly-ins are generally more intimate, but if you want the big draws or unique aircraft, they won't come for just fuel. You gotta get them some money to come, which increases the fly-in's generally low budget.
Jerry
Depends on the location, the fly-in, and the draw - and you never really know. I do remember the Fredericksburg, TX fly-in last year where Lewis brought out a lot of his fleet and a bunch of other rare birds showed up as well - on their own dime. There was almost NO crowd, and the photo ops were pretty good. Why did the warbird guys go? It was an opportunity for some of us to pay our respects to the Pearl Harbor veterans that were able to come - and some guys were just having fun.
I remember the aircraft that flew in to the Nut Tree (in Vacaville, CA) for the Doolittle Raiders reunion as well back several years now - a great showing of warbirds again with no major fuel or financial draw.
I think the good draws are going to be less and less - especially as the WWII generation sees their final sunsets and the history becomes more remote. Good draws in the future? Probably like August said - a good core group of warbirds, a friendly atmosphere that invites the private collectors to come out and join, and probably a feeling that it's something special - not something you just do every year just because - although I'm all for those as well.
Ryan
Thu Aug 13, 2009 11:23 pm
RyanShort1 wrote:I remember the aircraft that flew in to the Nut Tree (in Vacaville, CA) for the Doolittle Raiders reunion as well back several years now - a great showing of warbirds again with no major fuel or financial draw.
Ryan
Sorry about photo quality, refresher: http://www.sfahistory.org/doolittle.htm
Fri Aug 14, 2009 7:06 am
Roger Cain wrote:RyanShort1 wrote:I remember the aircraft that flew in to the Nut Tree (in Vacaville, CA) for the Doolittle Raiders reunion as well back several years now - a great showing of warbirds again with no major fuel or financial draw.
Ryan
Sorry about photo quality, refresher: http://www.sfahistory.org/doolittle.htm
Hey! I'm in one of those shots - with the 34th B.S. patch.
Ryan
Fri Aug 14, 2009 7:57 pm
krlang wrote
I'm not sure Ken was referring to me, but I can't wait until Geneseo next year either. I certainly don't mind a fantastic warbird show at a bargain price. The added bonus of watching Ken and Ryan K. do their "New Englander" routine was worth the price of admission alone!
More generally, I would and have paid a substantial amount to attend a warbird themed show. I attend two or three long distance shows a year (Geneseo, Thunder Over Michigan, Mustang Gathering) which include significant travel and lodging costs. In addition I attend a number of local Mid Atlantic events such as Reading. At Thunder, I usually pay extra for the photo pit. When I lived in Houston, I drove to Midland several times for the CAF Airsho. The point of this background info is that I am willing to pay a premium for a quality warbird experience. Quality for me is a function of the number and type of warbirds, photography conditions, ease of attending, and of growing importance, spending time with some of the folks I've come to know. Of course, since I do not have unlimited funds or free time, there are many shows on my "to see" list
That said, if an airshow's purpose is to raise money, you have to go with a large crowd. Fifty thousand of the "unwashed masses" at $20.00 a pop brings in 10 times the gate income of a thousand hard core enthusiasts paying $100.00. The incidental income such as parking and concessions (I'm assuming the show organizers get a cut) will be proportional to the size of the crowd. Large crowds will also attract more corporate sponsorship. The larger the income, the more planes the show can support and that is good for us. I'm sure the fuel, oil, attendance fee and lodging cost for each major warbird is substantial.
I think a designated area such as Thunder's photo pit is a good compromise to segregate the warbird fanatics from the general crowd.
I'd like to see other shows institute this feature.
Of course krlang is correct, you can just go to Geneseo and have a blast!
Once again, counting down the days till next year!
See you there! You too Jeff!
I'm not sure Ken was referring to me, but I can't wait until Geneseo next year either. I certainly don't mind a fantastic warbird show at a bargain price. The added bonus of watching Ken and Ryan K. do their "New Englander" routine was worth the price of admission alone!
More generally, I would and have paid a substantial amount to attend a warbird themed show. I attend two or three long distance shows a year (Geneseo, Thunder Over Michigan, Mustang Gathering) which include significant travel and lodging costs. In addition I attend a number of local Mid Atlantic events such as Reading. At Thunder, I usually pay extra for the photo pit. When I lived in Houston, I drove to Midland several times for the CAF Airsho. The point of this background info is that I am willing to pay a premium for a quality warbird experience. Quality for me is a function of the number and type of warbirds, photography conditions, ease of attending, and of growing importance, spending time with some of the folks I've come to know. Of course, since I do not have unlimited funds or free time, there are many shows on my "to see" list
That said, if an airshow's purpose is to raise money, you have to go with a large crowd. Fifty thousand of the "unwashed masses" at $20.00 a pop brings in 10 times the gate income of a thousand hard core enthusiasts paying $100.00. The incidental income such as parking and concessions (I'm assuming the show organizers get a cut) will be proportional to the size of the crowd. Large crowds will also attract more corporate sponsorship. The larger the income, the more planes the show can support and that is good for us. I'm sure the fuel, oil, attendance fee and lodging cost for each major warbird is substantial.
I think a designated area such as Thunder's photo pit is a good compromise to segregate the warbird fanatics from the general crowd.
I'd like to see other shows institute this feature.
Of course krlang is correct, you can just go to Geneseo and have a blast!
Sat Aug 15, 2009 10:24 pm
Kids-for-free was the tipping point for me in deciding to go to Thunder Over Michigan this year, esp since my local small shows were both canceled. The big draw for me was the Battle of Britain flight and the F-4. (After buying advance tix and a parking pass and driving 3 1/2 hours it would have been nice to have been able to see the show from inside the gates, though...)
Probably not going to go to the Labor Day Cleveland airshow this year. It's north of a hundred bucks to get my family in the gate, not to mention sky-high prices for food and drink.
I've been thinking about Geneseo for a while. Might just check it out next year.
Probably not going to go to the Labor Day Cleveland airshow this year. It's north of a hundred bucks to get my family in the gate, not to mention sky-high prices for food and drink.
I've been thinking about Geneseo for a while. Might just check it out next year.
Sat Aug 15, 2009 10:50 pm
To Ken and Jeff - have no fear, I've been listening to Bob Marley on YouTube (the comic, not the singer), so I'll be pritneer prepay-ahhhd to go toe-ah to toe-ah with that Langlo-whachamacall-him.
But, I disagree with krlang on one thing... if I am coming, promoters should issue discounts for people who sit within 20 feet of me, which would be tough because I never seem to stay in one space at a show!
But, I disagree with krlang on one thing... if I am coming, promoters should issue discounts for people who sit within 20 feet of me, which would be tough because I never seem to stay in one space at a show!
Wed Aug 26, 2009 3:28 am
Having been thinking this over a bit, I have a different version of the same question:
Is the entry price a factor in your decision to attend a show?
For me it isn't for two reasons; currently I usually get a free pass as press - (and if you think that's a good gig, it is, but I don't see a queue to help when writing the report...)
Secondly I'd usually chosen to go to shows because I thought it was worth it content-wise, and the entry cost alone has rarely been a factor, the ticket just being one cost in among transport, film & processing (back then) food, souvenirs and time.
Your views?
Is the entry price a factor in your decision to attend a show?
For me it isn't for two reasons; currently I usually get a free pass as press - (and if you think that's a good gig, it is, but I don't see a queue to help when writing the report...)
Secondly I'd usually chosen to go to shows because I thought it was worth it content-wise, and the entry cost alone has rarely been a factor, the ticket just being one cost in among transport, film & processing (back then) food, souvenirs and time.
Your views?
Wed Aug 26, 2009 8:33 am
Okay, here's my $.02
$75-$100 dollars for a VIP ticket (kids under 15 get in free)
$25-$35 for a regular ticket
For that VIP ticket you should get:
- a program
- a wristband
- some sort of airshow specific trinket, keychain, t-shirt, automatic weapon, etc...
- Courtesy tent with cold water and a rest area with chairs
- Entry to the airfield an hour before everyone else
- Be able to stay for an hour after the general masses are asked to leave
- Maybe arrange a discount at local hotels & coupons for restaurants
- A discount at the gift shop of the museum (if applicable)
- 10-20% off the VIP ticket price on the next airshow (or a free regular admission ticket for the next airshow, something like that.
These are just some quick thoughts that I would like to see and would make me more inclined to pay the higher ticket price
$75-$100 dollars for a VIP ticket (kids under 15 get in free)
$25-$35 for a regular ticket
For that VIP ticket you should get:
- a program
- a wristband
- some sort of airshow specific trinket, keychain, t-shirt, automatic weapon, etc...
- Courtesy tent with cold water and a rest area with chairs
- Entry to the airfield an hour before everyone else
- Be able to stay for an hour after the general masses are asked to leave
- Maybe arrange a discount at local hotels & coupons for restaurants
- A discount at the gift shop of the museum (if applicable)
- 10-20% off the VIP ticket price on the next airshow (or a free regular admission ticket for the next airshow, something like that.
These are just some quick thoughts that I would like to see and would make me more inclined to pay the higher ticket price
Wed Aug 26, 2009 8:43 am
I want my Oshkosh 2009 automatic weapon!