Sun Dec 28, 2008 11:31 am
What do the symbols on the tail mean?
sweet pea
Sun Dec 28, 2008 2:15 pm
Does anyone know what block this bird is.She is olive drab with tail stinger but if you will notice she has staggered waist windows with early style sliding waist window frames.Whats up with that?Could she have had a replacement rear end early on? 
Sweet Pea 42-38078
Sun Dec 28, 2008 2:23 pm
These two photos were taken by Charles F. Hollenberg, a 2nd Bomb Group veteran.
He told me the following story:
"We did have contact with the flight engineer that evening. He did not indicate there had been any consideration of 'stepping out'. The flak burst was at the port side of the ship (not a direct hit . . . ). He related that there was no wire contact with the waist, tail or ball turret location. Therefore they did not know the condition of the ball turret man or tail gun. (As we were informed later the man in the tail had only one wound a flak hit through the spine just below the back side of his flak vest - fatal instant).
"As my log indicated we were informed the radio operator had forty separate wounds (a nice round figure which I'm sure may have been enlarged as the word came down the line). The flight engineer noted that the fin and rudder had a slight horizontal swing of about half a foot. On touch down as they lost speed the ball turret became a skid . . . "
The symbols on the tail are the 2nd Bomb Group's "Y in a circle" over traces of the overpainted 99th Bomb Group diamond and the short-lived "Y in a square" marking that was intended for use by all Fifth Wing groups. The yellow "split arrow" below the serial is the 429th Bomb Squadron's unique symbol. The overpainted circle is where a white ball with a blue "3" (indicating 99th Bomb Group) in it was once painted. The white rudder with a blue stripe is another 2nd Group marking.
He told me the following story:
"We did have contact with the flight engineer that evening. He did not indicate there had been any consideration of 'stepping out'. The flak burst was at the port side of the ship (not a direct hit . . . ). He related that there was no wire contact with the waist, tail or ball turret location. Therefore they did not know the condition of the ball turret man or tail gun. (As we were informed later the man in the tail had only one wound a flak hit through the spine just below the back side of his flak vest - fatal instant).
"As my log indicated we were informed the radio operator had forty separate wounds (a nice round figure which I'm sure may have been enlarged as the word came down the line). The flight engineer noted that the fin and rudder had a slight horizontal swing of about half a foot. On touch down as they lost speed the ball turret became a skid . . . "
The symbols on the tail are the 2nd Bomb Group's "Y in a circle" over traces of the overpainted 99th Bomb Group diamond and the short-lived "Y in a square" marking that was intended for use by all Fifth Wing groups. The yellow "split arrow" below the serial is the 429th Bomb Squadron's unique symbol. The overpainted circle is where a white ball with a blue "3" (indicating 99th Bomb Group) in it was once painted. The white rudder with a blue stripe is another 2nd Group marking.
Re: sweet pea
Sun Dec 28, 2008 2:36 pm
hang the expense wrote:Does anyone know what block this bird is.She is olive drab with tail stinger but if you will notice she has staggered waist windows with early style sliding waist window frames.Whats up with that?Could she have had a replacement rear end early on?
According to some sources, it was the B-17G-25-DL 42-38078.
As far as I know, Douglas started with staggered waist windows exactly in this block.
Mr Birdsall, these are the great photos!
Any of the nose part?
Nose art?
Sun Dec 28, 2008 3:34 pm
Mr Birdsall, these are the great photos!
Any of the nose part?
Unfortunately no, and I don't recall ever seeing any photos of it. Al Lloyd did a lot of research into the 2nd - is there anything in his book?
Re: sweet pea
Sun Dec 28, 2008 5:33 pm
chobi wrote:hang the expense wrote:Does anyone know what block this bird is.She is olive drab with tail stinger but if you will notice she has staggered waist windows with early style sliding waist window frames.Whats up with that?Could she have had a replacement rear end early on?
According to some sources, it was the B-17G-25-DL 42-38078.
As far as I know, Douglas started with staggered waist windows exactly in this block.
HA! Learned something new.That explains the B-17 pic on ebay with the stinger and staggered waist.I thought it must have been refitted with a later back end.Thanks for straightening that out.
Re: Nose art?
Sat Mar 28, 2009 4:04 pm
Steve Birdsall wrote:Mr Birdsall, these are the great photos!
Any of the nose part?
Unfortunately no, and I don't recall ever seeing any photos of it. Al Lloyd did a lot of research into the 2nd - is there anything in his book?
... a few new photos of Sweet Pea:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Wrecked-B-17-Bomber ... =72%3A1205
It would be nice if someone here buy these and share with the rest of us in some bigger resolution.
Looks like there is some nose art visible on the first photo?
Unfortunately, I have no possibility to use ebay services in my country..
