Tue Oct 07, 2008 8:30 am
Obergrafeter wrote:1942 crashed at Boerne Texas! I remember my dad telling me about an Army Bomber crashing not 2 miles from my house, but I thought it was pre war with like a B-10 or something. Lynn my dad said it was between my house and your ranch right off old 87 which is now IH-10. Of course hes' been gone for over 20 years, I wonder if we could find something in the archives and maybe go on a dig? Something to go with the Nelson gold. Did anybody ever mention this to you? Haven't thought about it in years, you know my old mans' penchant for Toro Cacka!
If you find anything - let me know. I'd be for helping out!
Ryan
Tue Oct 07, 2008 7:05 pm
So far no luck trying to get info on line from either SA or Boerne papers. Guess I will have to go down to the morgue personally and look it up.
Tue Oct 07, 2008 7:50 pm
For the Squadron logo, looks kind of like the FTD Man (Murcury), have not found one that looks like that yet.
If you are AC hunting around Boerne, try this one while you are at it. Though if it hit one of those limestone hills at speed, it will just be little pieces!
(web location) http://www.check-six.com/lib/Coast_Guar ... alties.htm
Date of incident: 19 December 1938
Crash related deaths:
LT Perry Smithson Lyons (CG Aviator #29)
ENS Clyde H. Teague, Jr.
AMM1 Rupert H. Germaine
CPL George C. Latham, US Army (passenger)
Air Station the aircraft and/or crew were assigned to:
Coast Guard Air Patrol Detachment El Paso, TX
Aircraft type and Coast Guard tail number:
Waco J2W, V157
Location of the incident: Boerne, Texas - 30 miles north of San Antonio, Texas
Description of the incident:
The aircraft left El Paso about 4 p.m. on Monday, 19 December 1938, bound for Houston. It crashed in flames near the town of Boerne at 10 p.m. on Monday night. The cause of the crash was never determined.
If you are AC hunting around Boerne, try this one while you are at it. Though if it hit one of those limestone hills at speed, it will just be little pieces!
(web location) http://www.check-six.com/lib/Coast_Guar ... alties.htm
Date of incident: 19 December 1938
Crash related deaths:
LT Perry Smithson Lyons (CG Aviator #29)
ENS Clyde H. Teague, Jr.
AMM1 Rupert H. Germaine
CPL George C. Latham, US Army (passenger)
Air Station the aircraft and/or crew were assigned to:
Coast Guard Air Patrol Detachment El Paso, TX
Aircraft type and Coast Guard tail number:
Waco J2W, V157
Location of the incident: Boerne, Texas - 30 miles north of San Antonio, Texas
Description of the incident:
The aircraft left El Paso about 4 p.m. on Monday, 19 December 1938, bound for Houston. It crashed in flames near the town of Boerne at 10 p.m. on Monday night. The cause of the crash was never determined.
Re: ???
Tue Oct 07, 2008 9:00 pm
Matt Gunsch wrote:Jack Cook wrote:Matt,
Could you make that smaller and blurrier?
Looks like the 3rd Attack Group.
That is actually enlarged, and scanned at a hi res.
Looks like 411th Bombardment Squadron. Equipped with the B-18 from 1937-1941. Based at Langley from 1 September 1936 until Sept 1939 when it went it to Miami Municipal Airport until April 1941.
Info from Combat Squadrons of the Air Force World War Two published by the Office of AIr Force History in 1982. It has drawings of nearly every squadron emblem and a breakdown of the aircraft and bases from inception.
Hope this helps.
Tue Oct 07, 2008 10:44 pm
See its only been 24 hrs and already we have doubled the odds of finding a late 30s warbird. Just imagine Ryan that B-18 and Waco lined up behind the AT-10 waiting there turn for restoration. Maybe then I could go find that Stuka!
Wed Oct 08, 2008 12:11 pm
I pulled out my trusty "Air Force Colors" Volume 1 1926-1942 by Dana Bell and found this:
The limbs are positioned just a few degrees differently, but I think the airplane was in the 21st Recon Squadron.
Scott
The limbs are positioned just a few degrees differently, but I think the airplane was in the 21st Recon Squadron.
Scott
Wed Oct 08, 2008 1:27 pm
So it WAS the FTD man, er, um.... Mercury!!
That looks like a handy book. Must grow library, must resist, must grow library, must resist!!!
That looks like a handy book. Must grow library, must resist, must grow library, must resist!!!
Wed Oct 08, 2008 6:26 pm
so, it was from the 21st Reconnaissance Squadron at Langley Field, Virginia, which did operate B-18s at the time the pic was taken. They recieved the planes in 1937 and the photo was taken in 1938.
Thx for the help
Thx for the help
Wed Oct 08, 2008 7:01 pm
Matt Gunsch wrote:so, it was from the 21st Reconnaissance Squadron at Langley Field, Virginia, which did operate B-18s at the time the pic was taken. They recieved the planes in 1937 and the photo was taken in 1938.
Thx for the help
Looks like I should have read the entire reference in Combat Squadrons of the Air Force instead of just looking at the heading. The 21st Recon Squadron became the 411th Bombardment Sq on 4/22/42 and continued to use the same emblem.
Thu Oct 09, 2008 12:47 am
I have two photos of 21st Recon B-18s somewhere. One shows an early airplane with the insignia placed just like your photo, and the second shows a three-ship formation of B-18As in '41 with the squadron emblem on the aft fuselage and the national insignia on the nose like the Navy did on their patrol planes. The national insignia was painted on the nose so as to avoid confusion with naval folks--the primary mission of the 21st during that period was off-shore reconnaissance.