Warbird Information Exchange

I don't think Gen Brett will be calling anyone, unless it is thru a wejee board. He died in 1963
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Brett_(military)

Wrong Brett I'm talking about his son
Lt Gen Devol "Rocky" Brett USAF ret
http://www.af.mil/bios/bio.asp?bioID=4789

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Don't touch my junk!!

For some reason I cannot get into any AF.MIL sites, but the army site works fine, and it is a .MIL page

How is that possible? According to his official military biography, Gen. Brett was born in 1923. As of 2006, he would have been 83 years old! How could he have been on full time duty, even with a Reserve squadron at that age? I don't think that is even legal, given mandatory retirement times.

A couple of pictures of the Swoose in its 42/43 paint scheme.

1. A picture of the Swoose undergoing an engine change at RAAF Laverton Victoria Australia, with some RAAF Airspeed Oxfords in the foreground. Possibly after its January first visit, and tail repair? at Laverton, as it later returned to "Melbourne" on March 17 1942 for extensive engine work.

Interestingly the original of this photo, found on 49 of RAAF Camouflage & Markings 1939-45 Vol 1 - Geoff Pentland - Kookaburra Publications - 1980 - ISBN 0858800365" shows a patchy (and probably quicky applied) camouflage, the "Swoose" logo near the side fuselage door entry, but also "possible"? winged artwork on the nose? and no apparant "black" underside?(The Vental bathtub is in place)



2. A second photo, possibly? after the Swoose returned to the US in August 1942? with perhaps a revised version of winged nose art, but prior to the flag nose art that featured on the aircraft in its 1944 bare metal colour scheme? The "black" undersides may simply be shadow? rather than paint? (The Vental bathtub is in place)



3. A third photo post the stripping of the camouflage in 1944 into a bare metal scheme, and application of the flag nose art in place of the winged nose art. - no "black" underside.(the Ventral bathtub has been removed)



regards

Mark Pilkington

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20th Century - The Age of Manned Flight
"from Wrights to Armstrong in 66 years -WOW!"

A General never retires.

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Magister Aviation
It's all in my book

Yes, they do.

The nacelles and forward fuselage appear to have weathered black undersurfaces, while back by the tail she looks gray underneath. Too difficult to make a definiative call about the underside of the wings. Is it possible the black was applied before the different aft section was spliced on?

I can't see a nose art in either photo (but the originals are probably clearer.) The light patch on the side of the nose in photo 2 appears to be reflection off the window.

I'm bit baffled about her current color scheme. Stangdriver's pics show the aft fuselage as black underneath, and black engine cowls as well. Was an effort made to recreate her old camouflage during her vagabond post-war years?

SN

SN

Steve

I am not sure of a winged nose art, I dont have original prints or large format scans to examine, and am not aware of any such artwork, but raised it as a possibility to see if anyone could confirm? etc.

There was no obvious black undersides in pic # 1 in the original photo in the book , which is after the rear fuselage splice undertaken at Laverton in late January 1942, and the application of the "Swoose" logo on the rear fuselage.

That lead me to question the black underside in pic #2 being just shadow from a very bright midday sun, and exposure of the pic?, athough it doesnt look like the black underside was applied back to the rear fuselage in either pics 1 or 2? in any case (see pic 2 forward of the tail wheel)

However the close up pics Jack Cook posted on page 1, listed as Panama November 1942 may show a hastily applied black underside, and the black underside seems to stop rear of the ventral bathtub. These are obviously wartime photos prior to 1944 as the ventral bathtub is still in place. If that is correct the black underside must have been in place from early 1942, but just not evident in pic #1 due to the view being from the rear where it doesnt seem to have been applied?
(I still think some of the dark undersides in pic#2 are purely shadow)



It would have made sense for the 1941 bare metal old Betsy to be fully camouflaged top and bottom in hastily applied standard USAAC colours, in the urgent response to the Japanese attacks.

But in any case, it is obvious there is no black undersides in the bare metal finish in pic #3 in 1944.

The post 1946 restoration at LA as a memorial put the Swoose back into camouflage and the black underbelly,with the remaining black paint undersides now on the airframe being created then.

regards

Mark Pilkington

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20th Century - The Age of Manned Flight
"from Wrights to Armstrong in 66 years -WOW!"

He did retire 1978 but basically switched hats and moved doen the hall.
He is one of the foremost experts on SAR and is regularly inspecting/consulting with units/comands.
http://proceedings.ndia.org/7040/03%20PR%20Mobile%20Training%20Team%20by%20Brett.pdf

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Don't touch my junk!!

I think the black is just mud, dirt, and or oil.

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Shop the Airplane Bunker At
www.warbirdbunker.com

This is not going to be an easy restoration. I fear that no matter what the museum does, some will not be happy. The Belle is easier for the simple fact that it was in such poor shape that it was understood that it had to be a ground up restoration. Not much of it's interior was in it. The Swoose is in really rough shape, and the weathering you see is not from it's combat days but from years spent outside. So it is pretty likely that it too will get the same treatment the Belle is getting.

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Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Director

Actually Generals do not retire. They go on the inactive list. While on the inactive list they can and do perform duties for the active forces.

Remember Zumwalt was on the active list till his late 60s or 70s.

My relative, MG M.W. Kendall, "retired" in 1980. From 1980 till around 2005 he had an official relationship with the 15th infantry, though not in a command capacity.

My understanding is that this is quite common and may have been what Gen. Brett was doing.

Joe

Peter Bower's book Fortres In The Sky has a great shot of the undersides
on pgs. 72 & 73 after she returned to the States in '42. In this one it appears that the entire undersides were painted black and what looks to be grey in other photos is actually the NMF after the black flaked off, probably because the matal wasn't primed first.

I'm glad I don't have to make the decision on how to restore it. I like the look of these photos. The olive drab with the Swoose logo next to the rear door. I vote for adding the bathtub and returning it to od. Maybe the od could be applied carefully around the current markings leaving them intact, also same for the nose. Might not be technically 100% correct but it would look great and preserve the original art flags on the nose and all.

I'm sure the musuem will do right by her, I have confidence in them.

.