Warbird Information Exchange

No, I mean neu Ta152s.
And yes, I know I'm dreaming

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" excuse me stewardess I speak jive"

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Many "warbirders" complain about we "rivet counters" and "paint scheme police" raising the issues of authenticity and accuracy in warbird operations from a heritage and provenance point of view.

The reason that is done is to avoid confusion between authentic heritage and recreated heritage.

Museum's strive to preserve and portray aircraft as historic records, where as warbirds do have an element of "toys for the boys" (and if they spend the money, they are entitled to enjoy them).

However this creates the risk of mis-information (even un-intended) rather than education to the general public and even fellow aviation enthusiasts, an example recently stumbled over is below:

http://www.vintagewings.ca/page?a=51&lang=en-CA

An except from the "Just Plane Fun" newsletter of the "Vintage Wings of Canada Foundation" (keeping alive Canada's aviation heritage)






The "Wirraway" is actually a US built T6 fitted with a geared 1340 and three blade prop, and an RAN paint scheme, it was apparantly originally built and flown by a US owner who also operated a Sea Fury in RAN colours.

Other than the engine, prop and paint scheme there is little effort to duplicate the Wirraway unique features.

The structural differences between the Wirraway and T6 are nearly as significant as calling a "Spitfire", a "Hurricane", as the monocoque rear fuselage, metal side panels, different wing outer panels, different wing centre-section, different canopy, different tailplanes, elevators and rudder are all different.

The result provides little accurate resemblance to a Wirraway, and it can't really be even considered a replica? Its simply a modified T6, but its not reported as such? even to fellow enthusiasts? in an aviation heritage organisation?

Obviously there is no malice intended here by the owner nor reporter, or organisation, and an Australian RAN Wirraway paint scheme is a welcome flag waving for us aussies, and a different colour scheme on the flight line.

But the educational and heritage value of "warbirding" is reduced when the fine details, and the "accuracy" is left out.

There is a one original CAC Wirraway in the USA, the former "yellow" Moorabbin Air Museum Wirraway A20-649 now with Kermit Weeks.



regards

Mark Pilkington

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20th Century - The Age of Manned Flight
"from Wrights to Armstrong in 66 years -WOW!"

I still think that the Liberator population is crucially low, so what can we do? Take Mr. Week's example and do what was done on the Willow grove ME-262.

Now that would be something...

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Keep Em' Flying,
Christopher Soltis
Dedicated to the preservation and education of The Sikorsky Memorial Airport

CASC Blog Page: http://ctair-space.blogspot.com/
Warbird Wear: https://www.redbubble.com/people/warbirdwear/shop

Chicks Dig Warbirds.......right?

I dont think a 100% new metal Liberator is going to be on the cards, there are two viable airworthy projects with Mr Weeks and Pima County, neither are likely to part with them unless offered "an offer they cant refuse", Mr Weeks may eventually return his to flight and is the best chance of a third flyer?

There still are substatial remains surviving to allow a very high quality static restoration, that might tempt Pima County to play ball, (along with a fist full of cash) smiles.

I personally think we should enjoy what we have got - two prinstine examples at either end of the design life. a B24A and a B24J.

regards

Mark Pilkington

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20th Century - The Age of Manned Flight
"from Wrights to Armstrong in 66 years -WOW!"

Oh im not saying for Mr. Weeks to give up his Liberator, but to have a group measure and create new production plans from his aircraft when it eventually does go into restoration. Since the aircraft will be immaculate, like the rest of his collection, i say why not take this opportunity to figure out all the plans necessary to build an all new liberator from what has been called "An absolute time capsule". But then again it would also be nice to se new build Marauders too.

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Keep Em' Flying,
Christopher Soltis
Dedicated to the preservation and education of The Sikorsky Memorial Airport

CASC Blog Page: http://ctair-space.blogspot.com/
Warbird Wear: https://www.redbubble.com/people/warbirdwear/shop

Chicks Dig Warbirds.......right?

Any more info on this Cutlass?

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Share your story: Rutgers Oral History Archive http://oralhistory.rutgers.edu/

Very well said.

Identifying differences is not the same as mocking them.

Ken

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"Take care of the little things and the big things will take care of themselves."

Here we go Who cares if these aircraft are not 100.00000000000% original if they fly and are maintained to do so then it doesnt matter Let the museums have all the non flying perfectly restored aircraft

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" excuse me stewardess I speak jive"

Do you not get the point or are you just ignoring it?

It "doesn't matter" only for those who don't care about the preservation of heritage, but just want to see cool planes fly. Is that you?

August

Im not trying to get into a pissing match with anyone! There are two very distinct groups, the cell struture counters and the ones that love to see both types of restorations! I fall into the latter of the two. It seems to me that the purests want nothing but absolute perfection in a aircraft restoration and thats fine but they also seem to be the ones who are very smug in their opinoins and are condesending in their posts. These are my opinions and observations, I have no problem with the other sides views accept when they are pounding their chest about how unworthy the unperfect restorations are.

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" excuse me stewardess I speak jive"

If there is a reproduction warbird that is made and something is put into it to make it more safer and less likely to crash then the original then I say do it. I am for orginality and its important to me..if there are a few internal differneces from the original plans that I cant see and make it safer is alright with me. But now with paint.....i like to see high quality authenitc paint and markings. Its one thing that is easy to get right.

Just my taste on things.

Cheers,
Nathan

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Shop the Airplane Bunker At
www.warbirdbunker.com

Also well said, Nathan. I agree with your point. A dedication to safety and history is a winning combination.

Ken

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"Take care of the little things and the big things will take care of themselves."

K5083,
In my opinion, watching a real something fly, be it restoration, replica, or recreation beats the living h3ll out of holding a copy of a black and white photo of a 65 year old airplane and making 'BLUUULUULLUBUUULLB' sounds with my lips and tongue while I move the photo across my field of vision

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Don't make me go get my flying monkeys-

Inspector, it's better if you colorize the photo first.

Seriously, now that 262crew has moderated his position to where it is reasonable, I can agree with it. In the post I quoted, he didn't seem to get the point of authenticity at all.

He is also wrong about there being "two very distinct groups, the cell structure counters and the ones that love to see both types of restorations." Actually there is a third group, one that loves only hot flyable airplanes, cares not a whit for authenticity, and thinks any static restoration is dead and worthless. And he omits to mention that the first and third groups are really just theoretical extremes where hardly anybody really resides. We are ALL right there in the middle camp with 262crew, he's just trying to assign anybody who's a bit more concerned with accuracy than he is into the extreme position.

August