Quick A-25 Move. Hurry, Hurry, Chop, Chop.

[EDowning]

Mustangdrivel wrote:

Jack, Pappy Boying is the best

Who is Pappy Boying?

[Jack Cook]

How could the Belle be first if not one single crewman flew 25 missions on her

[mustangdriver]

O.K. so I have got to ask, and this is not being a smart ass. I am not an aircraft mover and I know so. What is wrong with this move besides the fire wall issue. I am not sure why they did that either, but I also don't know another way to load it on there. Please be constructive, and maybe I can help fix this going forward.

Having the center section sitting on the truck strapped down like that seems dangerous. The weight is all centered all on the firewall. Then you have the rest of the center section strapped tightly to the deck. When the trailer goes down the road it will flex and since there is no cushion to give and the wieght is not distributed it will put additional forces on the fuselage. I'm not say that it will break or bend for sure but just isn't waht I would suggest. I would suggest building a cjig that bolts to various hard points on the center section and make a ridged frame between the hard points with heavy steal to keep it from flexing. Either that or create a craddle that more evenly distributes that wieght and leaves the the fusleage less vulnerable to the flex of the trailer.

The tail section doesn't look horrible to me, it doesn;t have much weight to it and hopefully that mattress will give it some cushion from the flex. It looks like it could use some better strapping but it doesn't look like they are done iwth that yet. As far as sawing anything, that seems like nothing but being in a hury. They didn't want the take the time to figure out how to do it right and that isn't something I would expect from the a national collection. I am extreamly disapointed by that.

THank you for useful information. I am trying to get some suggestions into the right hands. I can't go and say, it sucks. They are going to look for something a little deeper than that.

[mustangdriver]

Mustangdrivel wrote:

Jack, Pappy Boying is the best

Who is Pappy Boying?

Edowner, thanks for pointing out that. That is the biggest problem you have with my comment? That I disn't spell check it first?

[Jack Cook]

we are a static museum, we own the aircraft. It is not going to fly. As for the Helldiver, don't worry. We are going to study some very authentic paint schemes to place on it, pick the best one, and apply a very accurate scheme to it. Then after that we will paint names all over the outside.

Do you say "we' because you're a dues paying member or a actually member of the decision making process

[mustangdriver]

How could the Belle be first if not one single crewman flew 25 missions on her

Jack, from most of my interviews I have done with crews, most of the say that they NEVER flew all of their missions on the same airplane.

[mustangdriver]

we are a static museum, we own the aircraft. It is not going to fly. As for the Helldiver, don't worry. We are going to study some very authentic paint schemes to place on it, pick the best one, and apply a very accurate scheme to it. Then after that we will paint names all over the outside.

Do you say "we' because you're a dues paying member or a actually member of the decision making process

I am a nobody that tries to make a difference. And sometimes it works. THere have been things I brought to the museum that they have actually used. I am a dues paying member, and a volunteer.

[davem]

I have recovered / transported many warbirds over the years. One posting said that the fuselage comes off the wings very simply - if this is the case, it seems like a lot of work and damage was done splitting the fuselage.

If the aircraft is built with in one piece with no way of breaking it down for transport, perhaps this was the best that could have been done - one would assume the main fuselage is riding on the engine mount points and not directly on the firewall. The fuselage seems to have been broken apart with some skill and compassion - so someone involved must have had half a brain.

I find it hard to believe if the fuselage lifts off the wings that anyone would choose to instead break the fuselage - the must have been a reason..if not I agree it was kinda a stupid move.

What is the history here? It sounds like the rebuilder (Mike) was not involved. One would assume he knows the a/c better than anyone, not involving him seems shortsighted to begin with. Was the a/c being taken back after a dispute?

Last edited by davem on Fri Jun 20, 2008 12:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

[Jack Cook]

Chris,
All you can say is "don't worry about the Helldiver" "We'll pick a good paintjob" or "It's for static". Can't you even say "I feel bad for Mike for all the work he's put into it", "it's a shame the a/c was damaged" or possibly anything Who gives a rip about the stinking paint job We're talking the National Museum of the USAF which is held up to a higher standard. So what, so they show up and carve up that plane like it's a Christmas goose. Geez who'd they send down there to get it 3 Stooges??? Maybe so with General Fine in command. I'm appauled and you should be also.

Last edited by Jack Cook on Fri Jun 20, 2008 12:19 pm, edited 2 times in total.

[RickH]

MD, the comment made has very little to do with the F105 issue. Yes, I'm still pi$$ed over that and a whole lot of other things. This particular fiasco is just another one of them.

I got it first hand from one of the lead guys working the Belle in Memphis that your favorite General ordered the fuel tanks pulled from the Belle so that no one in the future would have any chance of making her flyable, ala Shoo Shoo Baby. I thought it was supposed to be a preservation museum, not a gut it and put back what you think is best museum.

It all boils down to being the 600 lb gorilla and idea that you are the know all to end all because of it ! It's called arrogance and most of the museum community around the country is getting pretty tired of it !

[Fouga23]

Rick H, we are a static museum, we own the aircraft. It is not going to fly. We aren't just holding it for a while until someone wants to fly it, it is part of our collection. You are still pissed about the F-105. It would have been nice to see one fly, but that very F-105 is preserved with the Spruce Goose. Pretty nice I'd say. As for the Helldiver, don't worry. We are going to study some very authentic paint schemes to place on it, pick the best one, and apply a very accurate scheme to it. Then after that we will paint names all over the outside.

I'm with Rick on the F-105 thing.

[Jack Cook]

What is the history here? It sounds like the rebuilder (Mike) was not involved. One would assume he knows the a/c better than anyone, not involving him seems shortsighted to begin with. Was the a/c being taken back after a dispute?

Mike salvaged the wreck and sold/rebuilt it for the AFM. During his updates over the past few years he's had only positive things to say about the AF.
He wasn't able to be there (which I assume) because of his new job in St Louis. He left the crew that came to get it detailed instructions on correct disassembly. I'm sure those instructions didn't involve the use of a chainsaw.

[RickH]

Jack, I think he referencing the names of the sponsors and VETERANS that are on the B-2 and B-17. Nevermind why they are on their and that they are done ina fairly discrete manner.



As far as the 909 repair, I have no knowledge of what went on there. I was down here in Houston and hadn't started volunteering on the A-26 at that time. After we were focused on it and really had no contact with the rebuild effort.

I have been knee deep on all of the jet effort here in Houston. As it regards the F105, I saw first hand and rebutted to the House Armed Services Staff the mistruths and lies that were told to the them by the USAF Congressional Legislative Liason, who got his info directly from NMUSAF. They have also been a royal pain in the A$$ as it regards the F-4. I was told by a museum staffer that if the F-4 program was so important that it would be done by the USAF so that it could be done correctly. I have been personally named in an email to a USAF project officer, circulated by that same NMUSAF staffer that CF and myself in particular were no better than thieves and constantly worked outside the system. In this same email, this officer was told that if he worked with us in any way that it might cause him career complications.

The F-4 fodded an engine a while back. Almost immediately the Houston FSDO recieved a call from an individual identifying themselves as a rep from NMUSAF. They suggested that the FAA might want to take a look at our maint practices as it regards the F-4 because since we lost an engine there might be other substandard maintence being done to the aircraft. They were told to pi$$ off, in so many words. We happen to have a very open and transparent relationship with the local FSDO. If the NMUSAF management had their way the CF F-4 would be confiscated and scrapped.

As I've said before, the Museum itself is great ! The hierarchy and the way they conduct some of their business sucks !

Last edited by RickH on Fri Jun 20, 2008 12:53 pm, edited 2 times in total.

[Michel Lemieux]

I have this pic, ( sorry I do not heve the original credit )

All I know is when it was restored for the CAF at one point.





So I guess it can be spit

[davem]

I have this pic, ( sorry I do not heve the original credit )

All I know is when it was restored for the CAF at one point.





So I guess it can be spit

Well if it can be split - this was pretty stupid.

Jack, it does look like the rivets were drilled out and no chainsaw cutting involved that I can see - but still not the way to do it if the wings come off the fuselage.