Speedy wrote:
Warbird Kid wrote:
bomberflight wrote:
A Casa with Merlins painted in a Battle of Britain scheme is really
a replica rather than a genuine example.
Not to split hairs but I see it as more of an aircraft representing another aircraft. And if not for nothing it would be flying in an authentic 1969 scheme that it wore during filming.
To me replica is an aircraft thats not really close to the original (i.e. T-6 converted to resemble a A6M2 Zero). Heres a question: Aside from the Merlin Engines, are there anything else thats different between the original German made version and the CASA example?
I kind of see it the same way. Is an Avenger or Wildcat that was designed by Grumman, but built by General Motors even though they might have a different engine variant, STILL an Avenger or Wildcat? (I know, I know...unless it's a Marlet....cheers!)
Well, if a Mustang was built in Dallas then technically it's a P-51K. I wonder how many Dallas-built P-51K's are actually masquerading as P-51D's. Oh the horror. Sheesh. I bet Jerry Gabe must lose hours of sleep at night actually having the gall to call Polar Bear a 'real' P-51 then.
The CASA 2111's were licence-built HE-111-H-16's They originally had Junkers Jumo engines in them, but the supplies ran low so they had to replace them with what they could find. Just like how a HA-1112 is a license-built BF-109G airframe with the same problem.
There's nothing "replica" about that. I wonder how many flyable B-17's are actually license-built by Lockheed or Vega...but (again, GASP) are actually painted to represent an aircraft made by Boeing? Those planes have a distinct designation too...but I doubt anyone is calling those 'replicas', or worried if they are 'genuine examples'.
Maybe I'm off base. Sorry if this offends any delicate sensibilities. Just my uneducated way of looking at airplanes.
Speedy...in my book you are safe on base
CASA 2.111 was merely the Spanish Air Force designation for the CASA built He111-H16.
Every external CASA id plate on a CASA 2.111 lists just the following: CASA HE111-H16.
The CAS 2.111 was an exact match for the He111-H16, part for part. Every CASA built He111-H16 was built as per the Heinkel plan and were to have been fitted with Jumo engines, since the Spanish were merely adding to the fleet of 100 He111s originally given to them by Germany. However, when CASA reached airframe 60, in approximately December 1950 (count and date are approx, as I don’t have the exact figure with me) they ran out of the supply of Jumo engines. All of the rest of the airframes (70) were still completed and placed in storage, in the hope that they could get the necessary engines at a later date.
The airframes that had no engines remained in storage until about 1953, when an agreement was made to acquire 173 Rolls Royce Merlin engines. Over a period of about 3 years, the engineless airframes were modified, firewall forward, to have Merlin engines, and were then put into service. This firewall forward modification was the only airframe modification to the already manufactured aircraft. All aircraft that were still in service with the Jumo engines were subsequently modified to use the Merlin engines as part of a maintenance standardization program, since the Spanish built 109s were also using the same engine.
The CASA 2.111 is therefore, in my opinion, as much a license built He111-H16, as an FM2 is a licensed built F4F. It therefore has as much “right” to be referred to as an He111 as the FM2 has to be called a Wildcat.
Also, to quote from above: A Casa with Merlins painted in a Battle of Britain scheme is really a replica rather than a genuine example.
I disagree, since for the Cavanaugh example:
1. It’s a CASA
2. It has Merlins
3. It has a B of B paint scheme
4. It was actually in the movie
Hence it is the genuine example of a Casa with Merlins painted in a Battle of Britain scheme
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