Pros / Cons, and opinions on Re-enactors

[muddyboots]

what's wrong with pointy ears I want to know?

[the330thbg]

Scoff if you like but I, for one, don't care. I'm gonna' do it anyway, thank you.

Mudge the outta' here

Land of the free because of the brave (soldiers not re-enACTORS)

why so angry skippy? Why don't you remove the b-29 scheme from your profile? After all you didn't fly it during ww2 or made a combat bombing mission in one , so aren't you just playing a part in a hobby too?

Sport,

Who is angry? Are you reading the same forum we are all reading?

oh, and I'll remove the B-29 from my profile and put up my father.., after you tell me how many combat runs you made in a Corsair.
I never claim to be anything I am not. I do not own a warbird.

I just write checks to them.

Last edited by the330thbg on Sun Jan 30, 2011 9:05 pm, edited 2 times in total.

[the330thbg]

what's wrong with pointy ears I want to know?

Gadzooks!!

[Mudge]

Mudge the photogenic

Who wouldn't want a picture of these two?

Mr and Mrs. Mudge.., were either of you ever in the military? Maybe the people taking a photo of you assume you served and are just wearing your old uniforms. Like the WWIIers who march in parades. I bet if people found out that some of those old veterans were not veterans but were wearing a 'costume' they would not be as receptive. Matter of fact.., I bet they would be down right ticked off.

That you two are adorable veterans. That is obvious!

I did four in the USAF '55-'59. Mrs. Mudge has lived with me for nigh on to 14 years which qualifies her for something akin to combat.
The fact that I look old enough to have served in WWII is unarguable. Mrs. Mudge's looks, however, leave no doubt that she didn't. Neither of us would ever think of passing ourselves off as WWII vets, unless it was in the context of our "characters". I think the people who attend these airshows/reenactments are sophisticated enough to know that all but a few of the uniformed participants are reenactors. I'm sure they don't think the people who are flying the a/c were WWII vets. Why would they think we're any different?

Mudge the geezer

Yeah...yeah...I know I said I was outta' here but I got a button pushed.

[cco23i]

Things like this makes me think I speak a foreign language. Do you not understand that YES we are portraying a person or group and YES many of us DID SERVE AND CONTINUE TO SERVE. As I HAVE worked airplanes INCLUDING the ones we reenact on then why should I quit reenacting for YOU if the WW2 vets are EXTREMELY HAPPY that we are portraying ground crew and show the public OUR HISTORY. As you keep asking why don't "people serve instead of reenacting", my question is how long were YOU in for? AND what did YOU do in the military? O.K as I am pissed I will close.

Scott

As I said all along 'pi$$y boy', I like the uniforms in context around the aircraft. I think it is awesome. I think the people that dress up on the weekends in uniforms they never could qualify to wear in the first place and run around and yell 'pow' at each other is frightening and pathetic. Ones that put on plastic ears and ray guns.., even more so.

I have just as much right to say these people are freaks as you do to say that I am for not subscribing to their lifestyle. This is a "con" to reenacting. Some people don't buy it. So what? It is a free country. Do as you wish. Again., to have a pilot and or ground crew dressed up on display around their vintage (period style) aircraft or armour is awesome and I 'get' it.

Chasing each other around and play shooting is ridiculous. I hated it when I did it back in the early 90's with the MILS at Ft. Leonard Wood. It was 'silly'. I got it. It was training. But silly non the less.

You are not going to change my mind. Move on please and post more photos of the Huey or Bird Dog.

It just gets agrivating as I seem to be talking to myself and no one is listening. As for being "Pi$$y boy" well as I said before I CAN TALK the talk as I DID walk the walk.

Scott

[muddyboots]

no we hear you. We just don't care. Our opinions are our own, and valid, and you're not going to make us suddenly like what you do. Sorry about that, but them's the breaks of Naval Air. Why you are beating this dead horse into tartar I don't know, beyond a need to justify what you do or ensure that we don't think you're acting like children. Let her go Jim, SHE'S DEAD.

[rwdfresno]

It just gets agrivating as I seem to be talking to myself and no one is listening. As for being "Pi$$y boy" well as I said before I CAN TALK the talk as I DID walk the walk.

Scott

"Now you might not believe it but
under fire [Muddyboots] is one of the finest human
beings in the world.

All he needs is somebody to throw hand
grenades at him the rest of his life."

[muddyboots]

[Mudge]

no we hear you. We just don't care. Our opinions are our own, and valid, and you're not going to make us suddenly like what you do. Sorry about that, but them's the breaks of Naval Air. Why you are beating this dead horse into tartar I don't know, beyond a need to justify what you do or ensure that we don't think you're acting like children. Let her go Jim, SHE'S DEAD.

I deleted my prior remark because, after thinking about it, it wasn't very mature.
Muddy...I'll make you a deal. I won't insult you by referring to whatever your hobby is as "childish" if you'll give me the same courtesy.

Mudge the contrite

Last edited by Mudge on Sun Jan 30, 2011 10:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

[Robbie Roberts]

no we hear you. We just don't care. Our opinions are our own, and valid, and you're not going to make us suddenly like what you do. Sorry about that, but them's the breaks of Naval Air. Why you are beating this dead horse into tartar I don't know, beyond a need to justify what you do or ensure that we don't think you're acting like children. Let her go Jim, SHE'S DEAD.

Kinda simple and Obamic there boots- "I am right, YOU are WRONG, so I am RIGHT, and that is all there is to it. NANNY NANNY BOO BOO" I don't give a tinkers dam whether you think I, or ANY reenactor, belongs anywhere or not. Like gays in the military, I don't care what you do, as long as you don't bother me personally. And if you are so abhorrent of reenactors, then JUST STAY HOME, and you won't see any. Matter of fact, why not just go hang out at an empty hangar and pretend to polish an aircraft for a while.

Oh, yeah- I have about 15 years in the military, between active, guard, and reserve, in both the Army and the USAF. And I have been a reenactor since 1984. Grow up.
Scott

[muddyboots]

[RyanShort1]

Gentlemen,

I started the thread, so I figure I can say this...

Let's all grow up and have some civility here! Some of the reenactor types are being OVERLY defensive, and FYI, that doesn't make you look ANY better to those who have pre-conceived notions.

Ryan

[muddyboots]

Why you are beating this dead horse into tartar I don't know, beyond a need to justify what you do or ensure that we don't think you're acting like children.

Mudge you've misread my comment. Try again without the pre formed notions.

[Robbie Roberts]

To reply to your previous version of the reply, no, that's not it at all: You're entitled your opinion, but it sounds like you've decided you think reenactors are pointless and that is all there is to it. But how can you even have a valid opinion of reenacting unless you have been a reenactor, and actually KNOW from EXPERIENCE what it is about? And if all you see is grown men (and women) playing dress up, then the point is quite far from you at this point- you do not understand what it is about, or why it is done. You have just seen something you do not understand, and criticized and condemned it.

Once you have spent a few years doing all types of reenactment events- private tactical events, public events, displays, parades, etc., and made the investments, both monetary and emotional, talked with the vets(getting fewer by the hour) who were there, who bring their kids, grandkids, great grandkids, over to point at you, your gear, vehicle, etc. and say things like "I used to carry one of those at Normandy...", "I haven't seen one of those in years", "Where did you find one of OUR jeeps?!"(Actual quote from the commander, D Troop, 4th Armd/25 Cav Rcn Sqn. Mecz when he saw MY restored and equipped Willys MB at their 1986 reunion at Valley Forge Pa. He then proceeded to drive my jeep, equipped as one of theirs down to the armor plate and radio, around the area with several other WWII vets of the unit with him) THEN maybe you can criticize reenactors. These are the guys we learn a lot from: and we are doing our best to learn before they are gone. And nothing gets more info out of a vet than showing up dressed like he did in his youth- and letting him "play" with the equipment, vehicles and weapons he lived with for up to 5 years of his life fighting in the largest war in history. The look of gratitude when they explain to someone who wants to listen makes it really worthwhile.

I had an encounter with a WWII B-17 radio operator a couple years ago, at Ft. Indiantown gap which is one of the greatest ones I can think of: Hu Peterson was shot down on the first raid on Berlin in March 1944. I was walking across between buildings at the Gap a couple years back when I ran into him and his son, trying to find something. They'd heard about the event, and the son decided to bring his father out- to try to bring out some memories. He looked at me, in my flight suit, A2, and hat, and commented, "I see you've got your crush cap!" And we started talking. I found out he'd been shot down on that particular mission, and was a POW for the remainder of the war. He and I talked for half an hour, and we made arrangements to meet again, later in the day, when more of the guys in my group were there. Well, he showed up just as we were about to reenact a downed airman capture scenario. Hu discussed it with the member of our group who was to be the captured airman, and then sat through it with a front row seat. He was rather moved, and opened up with lots more info about his experiences during the war, both in England, and as a POW. His son later told us he'd never heard these stories. Such as how the rear door on the B-17 wouldn't open, and one of the waist gunners pushed him out of the way, and shouldered through it; the feeling of not falling when he WAS falling through the air after bailing out. How he landed in a group of farmers, but was saved by the Wehrmacht troops nearby. How he was transported in a KDF Beetle Army staff car, and was whistling the Beer Barrel Polka to himself(it was popular at the time) and the German driver becoming suspicious that he spoke German when he had said he didn't... All sorts of personal memories which will be lost to time once that generation passes, unless they come forward with them- And reenactors HELP that process- by giving them a catalyst, a reason to bring up little details, and talk to people who ARE interested. Oh- and Hu JOINED our reenactment group. Not as an active participant(he is in his mid 80's) but as a friend- Every Reading he shows up at our encampment to say HI, and let us know he's still going.

And the vets enjoy us as well- as I said before, I used to have WWII, Korea & Vietnam vets running around in the field with us when I started in the early '80s. The WWII guys are out of it for the most part now, there are still a few Korean War vets about, and a good number of Vietnam vets. One of my best friends in my unit was a Vietnam vet who was shot down in Huey Slicks with 1st Cav Airmobile a few times. His first major event, he took a nap midday, and woke up during a firefight. He had an interesting wakeup...

Like someone criticizing the military, you don't know nothing unless you been in and done it. So I hereby invite you to find the nearest reenactment group to you- nearest not as to simple physical location, but rather to interests- aviation, infantry, armor, etc. and spend five years- collecting, learning, participating, and then maybe I'll accept your opinions. Of course, by then maybe you'll understand.

Put up, or shut up. We'd enjoy having you- with military experience, it helps the group the most- because your knowledge helps others learn. After you've had a few tacticals where your military training assists you in teaching the young'uns a few things, maybe then you'd appreciate that too.

Reenacting: it is a learning experience- not a macho trip.Yes, you get yo-yos who like to play army- till they have been around a bit, and grow up and take their impression seriously. And yes- lots of us like to go to the local watering holes in our impression- but we usually do it en masse, and at the same places each year, where, in many cases, they KNOW us, and appreciate our business. And the locals know we are coming- many like to hang out or chat when we are there.

Scott

[cco23i]

All I know is I will continue to do what I do in order to educate the public about the ground crews. I will not try to explain the value of what many of us do and how many WW2 vets truely appreciate what we do.

Scott