Warbird Information Exchange

Why is it that small shows are happy to pay the appearance fee asked to get our planes to them, but larger shows like Wings Over Houston, and now Airsho in Midland, act like they are doing us a favor just to let us come to their show, and they tell us how much fuel they will give us...even when it's often not close to what it takes just to get to the show and back, much less fly the show?

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Mike

Both of those two shows have something in common, right? Aren't they both CAF shows?
I suspect it might have something to do with the bigger shows being able to pick and choose more what they want to come.
Ya'll coming to Randolph in November?

Ryan

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Aerial Photographer with Red Wing Aerial Photography currently based at KRBD and tailwheel CFI.
Websites: Texas Tailwheel Flight Training, DoolittleRaid.com and Lbirds.com.

The horse is prepared against the day of battle: but safety is of the LORD. - Prov. 21:31 - Train, Practice, Trust.

Maybe it's because these "big" airshows aren't as "big" as you think in terms of budget?

Remember, AirSho is the primary fundraising event for the CAF as a whole as is Wings Over Houston for the CAF Squadrons that sponsor it. As such, they have very limited budgets to ensure they can actually come out on top. Small airshows like what you're speaking of tend to be put on for the public with little or no fundraising components.

Also, with AirSho, CAF regs are pretty clear that all CAF-owned aircraft which are airworthy are expected to attend. I don't think this has happened for very a long time (even before the move to Midland), but they have to plan as if they all are. As such, the already limited funds available are even more limited. I think if the CAF can get more sponsorships for AirSho, you will see more acts get booked and more appearance fees paid. I know that's been one of Steve Brown's big goals.

I second the fund raising part. Many of the airshows out there are a tool to raise money for organizations that has a goal of perpetuating one or another aviation oriented cause. I don't think there are that many individuals making money hand over fist on airshows. I see nothing wrong with the approach of telling aircraft owners how much the event can afford to give you. It allows you to make the decision of whether or not you can afford to come or not. It can only afford what it can afford.

In some cases the events are allowing aircraft owners to fly their aircraft at a shared cost of the event. It is a win win situation, the owners get to have the enjoyment of flying their aircraft at a shared cost of the event sponsor and the event gets to have an aircraft which increases the value of their event. Many owners also enjoy the property tax incentives provided by exhibiting their aircraft at public events.

The few out there who are actually utilizing their warbird as a business I can understand them wanting to at least break even or make money for their participation in an airshow, at the same token if you own the aircraft as a hobby you likely just like getting out and flying it. If the airshow can help you pay for some of those hours then it seems like a pretty good exchange.

Many aircraft owners have their pet show or pet organizations that they enjoy supporting so they will attend the show at a break even or loss because they enjoy flying and exhibiting the aircraft and enjoy helping out the airshow benificiary. Over the years I have seen this a lot, there have been people like John Ward, Carl Scholl, Mike Pupich who will come year after year because they want to support our organization. Sometimes we get decent sponsor money for them, some years we don't get hardly any and they come anyway.

I guess my point is if you want to fly your aircraft to AirSho you should ask yourself, do you want to attend with your aircraft or not? If you do, they are willing to compensate you in part for your participation, if not, great, happy flying. Why does it seem like a slight to you if they can't afford what it takes for you to get there?

Ryan

Aren't you part of a CAF unit? Both shows you mention are CAF shows, so I'm not sure why you would expect an appearance fee from the organization of which you are a part?

Undoubtedly budgets are tight and I think one of the things the CAF would like to do is increase attendance from their own aircraft, but unfortunately HQ can't cover 100% of the costs.

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“Words are never enough . . . words do not exist to make us see, or know, or feel what it is like, what actually happens."

Danger! Some shows don't pay their bills if they don't make the money or get the sponsors they anticipated. Get at least 1/2 your money up front (if you can't get it all) and cross your fingers that they pay the remainder.

Ober...

WOH is different from Midland. It used to be a show that was created and benefitted the Gulf Coast Wing, no more, it is now its own 501C3 entity. All of the CAF aircraft that show get their movement fees, which I assume goes to Midland .

As I put it to the former Warbird coordinator when he wanted our B-25 for a little gas, why is our B-25 any different than the Rose or the Dawg where an appearance fee is concerned ? We are asking no more than they do and we have exactly the same expense. They were already getting the aircraft cheaper than any other airshow in the country because there was no travel gas expense, no hotel rooms or vehicles required. The mindset seemed to be that since we lived in town then we should be willing to come for free. 100.00 B-25 tires and 1500.00 engines in cans are no more, some of these aircraft depend on the airshow appearance fee to continue flying.

And from what I've heard, Midland certainly expects the movement fee to show up in their office.

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"You cannot invade the mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind each blade of grass..."
Admiral Isoruku Yamamoto

Yep, you are correct about WOH and that comment was regarding Midland.

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“Words are never enough . . . words do not exist to make us see, or know, or feel what it is like, what actually happens."

For clarification: there is no term "movement fee" that I'm aware of. Whatever appearance fees CAF airplanes generate goes to the unit that operates them, not directly to big, bad "Midland" where (apparently from reading many posts here), evil Steve Brown must sit and daily figure out how he can anger the greatest number of people with more "tramp stamp" directives, higher dues, sale of airplanes, and general nefarious behaviors.

Seriously, people....

The Airsho in Midland is a "required" visit for all operable CAF airplanes: it is in the assignment letter all units sign when they get the airplane. As this Airsho is the primary fundraising event that supports the CAF's HQ operation, it is in the best interests of everyone to get their airplanes to Midland. The more airplanes, the better the show, the more attendance, the more income, the less the pressure on the budget, ANUAC, dues income, etc. Having done the Airsho for ten years, I can tell you that airshows are a terrible way to try to make money. Without a "named sponsor" it is a crapshoot if an airshow will break even. The Midland show simply has to be successful (make money) or the pressures on the budget are tremendous.

Thanks Young Shep and CAPFlyer for your comments.

Old Shep

More airplanes does not mean more attendance and more revenue generated-that is the falacy that Midland is spreading.

If the CAF was to hold an airshow in order to attract more paid attendance, Midland, TX, is not the place to hold it at. The airshow at Midland is more of a Colonels homecoming airshow than anything else.

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If God had wanted man to fly behind a flat motor, Pratt Whitney would've built one.