Sat Jul 25, 2009 3:38 pm
The plane has more ties to the San Diego area, let it stay there and be placed on the Midway. This BS of the "national" museums have a greater say is just that BS. It has ties to San Diego, having been based there and crashed there, let it stay there. If the navy wants to improve the museum collection, it is easy to do, Raise ALL the plane from Lake Michigan and sell them to restorers and collectors, I bet they can raise more than enough money to build a building to house the ENTIRE collection and then some.
Sat Jul 25, 2009 4:15 pm
Matt Gunsch wrote:The plane has more ties to the San Diego area, let it stay there and be placed on the Midway. This BS of the "national" museums have a greater say is just that BS. It has ties to San Diego, having been based there and crashed there, let it stay there. If the navy wants to improve the museum collection, it is easy to do, Raise ALL the plane from Lake Michigan and sell them to restorers and collectors, I bet they can raise more than enough money to build a building to house the ENTIRE collection and then some.
More people will see it in a national museum. Sorry that you feel that way about the national museums, but I think they are very vital to educate.
Sat Jul 25, 2009 4:46 pm
maybe it should be, if when the plane ditched. if it was owned by the navy or air force, then it still does, and might be up to them. if priviatly owned then it goes back to that owner, for the say so.
Sat Jul 25, 2009 5:17 pm
If the finder is wealthy and thinks he can win the legal fight, then go for it and keep it for himself.
If he is middle class, then claim it and register it as his for salvage, then donate his prize to either the USS Midway museum or the San Diego Air and SPace Museum. I got to see both of them in 07. THey are both impressive., The Midway had retired F-8 pilots standing in uniform giving presentations, and every aircraft on the ship looked as if it were airworthy. There were probably a couple thousand people that were on the ship touring the day I was there. The Helldiver would be well taken care of. It's an awesome ship!
The Naval Museum, still doesn't get it. They have their last of it's kind N.A. "Savage", the Deuce helo, and many other valuable birds sitting outside waiting for the next hurricane. The aircraft on the bottom of Lake Michigan are in much worse shape than those brought up 25 years ago. They could bring up and sell a couple of Dauntlessess and use the proceeds to Build more weatherproof storage, and raise the PBM Mariner and restore (that they damaged in Washingtron State) , and bring up all those remaing aircraft on the lake bottom in Michigan and use to raise funds to finish the Coronado flying boat and anything else on their wish list.
The folks in San Diego really have their stuff together.
If he is middle class, then claim it and register it as his for salvage, then donate his prize to either the USS Midway museum or the San Diego Air and SPace Museum. I got to see both of them in 07. THey are both impressive., The Midway had retired F-8 pilots standing in uniform giving presentations, and every aircraft on the ship looked as if it were airworthy. There were probably a couple thousand people that were on the ship touring the day I was there. The Helldiver would be well taken care of. It's an awesome ship!
The Naval Museum, still doesn't get it. They have their last of it's kind N.A. "Savage", the Deuce helo, and many other valuable birds sitting outside waiting for the next hurricane. The aircraft on the bottom of Lake Michigan are in much worse shape than those brought up 25 years ago. They could bring up and sell a couple of Dauntlessess and use the proceeds to Build more weatherproof storage, and raise the PBM Mariner and restore (that they damaged in Washingtron State) , and bring up all those remaing aircraft on the lake bottom in Michigan and use to raise funds to finish the Coronado flying boat and anything else on their wish list.
The folks in San Diego really have their stuff together.
Sat Jul 25, 2009 5:41 pm
mustangdriver wrote:Matt Gunsch wrote:The plane has more ties to the San Diego area, let it stay there and be placed on the Midway. This BS of the "national" museums have a greater say is just that BS. It has ties to San Diego, having been based there and crashed there, let it stay there. If the navy wants to improve the museum collection, it is easy to do, Raise ALL the plane from Lake Michigan and sell them to restorers and collectors, I bet they can raise more than enough money to build a building to house the ENTIRE collection and then some.
More people will see it in a national museum. Sorry that you feel that way about the national museums, but I think they are very vital to educate.
I don't know where you get that more people will see it at a "National Museum" when all the national museums are EAST of the Mississippi River. I bet more people see the B-24A or B-24J in one year flying around to airshows, then see the B-24D in Dayton in several years.
I have not been to the AF or the NASM museum since 95 because I don't get to travel to the Eastern part of the country, nor have I been to the navy museum for the same reason, but, I am able to make it to other airports to see FLYING planes and airshows.
The Helldiver should stay in the area it was found, it will be more appriciated by the locals since it is part of thier history.
Sat Jul 25, 2009 6:36 pm
Matt, I am not going to hi-jack the thread because you as usual have an ax to grind.
Sat Jul 25, 2009 6:47 pm
I am a equal opportunity national museum basher, both the AF and Navy museum get thier fair share, both have thrown thier weight around to get what THEY want.
Sat Jul 25, 2009 7:24 pm
mustangdriver wrote:
More people will see it in a national museum.
Unless the museum is in P'cola. I'll bet a lot more people go on vacation to San Diego than there.
Sat Jul 25, 2009 7:57 pm
Matt Gunsch wrote:I am a equal opportunity national museum basher, both the AF and Navy museum get thier fair share, both have thrown thier weight around to get what THEY want.
Matt, it is unfortunate that you feel that way, National museums have some of the most important and historic airframes preserved for all to see. It is great to see them fly, and it is a blast to fly in them. But we need some saved in the National Collections as well.
So how is placing the Helldiver in a non-climate controlled aircraft carrier the better way than over a national museum that is climate controlled. The plane crashed in SD so it is important to them? I feel the more important reason to move it is so that it can be restored to the level that the NMNA does, and be preserved in that collection over where it happened to crash.
Sat Jul 25, 2009 7:57 pm
michaelharadon wrote:mustangdriver wrote:
More people will see it in a national museum.
Unless the museum is in P'cola. I'll bet a lot more people go on vacation to San Diego than there.
And I am sure they all say, I can't wait to see the Helldiver!
Sat Jul 25, 2009 8:31 pm
which is better a plane on a aircraft carrier, or a whole collection of PRICELESS planes in a hurricane prone area. They got lucky last time.
Sat Jul 25, 2009 10:11 pm
Matt, and most of those aircraft are protected by a very strong building. WIth the addition of the new hangar, most of the aircraft will be coming indoors. But it doesn't matter what I say here, you said it yourself. You don;t like national museums, and nothing I say will change that.
Sat Jul 25, 2009 10:47 pm
Well, I say keep it here where it truly belongs. If the Navy wanted one that bad they could have brought it up long ago instead of just letting it sit at the bottom of the lake. Now that there is interest in it they suddenly want it. I say no. They have their own storage lot in the Great Lakes and can dig up some from there!
San Diego gets quite a bit of tourism and the Midway is hard to ignore. Not only that, but, we have the largest naval base in the country and that counts for something and our ties to the aircraft industry can not be ignored either! Don't forget who got the message first stateside when Pearl Harbor was attacked. It sure wasn't Florida!
National Museums are great, but, they can't keep everything!
We can preserve it just as good as anyone and even better in some cases.
San Diego gets quite a bit of tourism and the Midway is hard to ignore. Not only that, but, we have the largest naval base in the country and that counts for something and our ties to the aircraft industry can not be ignored either! Don't forget who got the message first stateside when Pearl Harbor was attacked. It sure wasn't Florida!
National Museums are great, but, they can't keep everything!
We can preserve it just as good as anyone and even better in some cases.
Sun Jul 26, 2009 2:50 am
How many folks attend San Diego Air & Space every year?
How many people attend the Midway Museum every year?
Seriously..........?????
How many people attend the Midway Museum every year?
Seriously..........?????
Sun Jul 26, 2009 9:44 am
The USS Midway would be cool also, but I'd still like to see it next to great collection of other dive bombers and WW2 aircraft.
the San Diego Air Museum needs to expand or something, When I was there the place was packed in so tight it was hard to enjoy the aircraft.
But even better would be to see it flying!
The Navy knows where there are enough parts to put one together to form a display aircraft.
Tim
the San Diego Air Museum needs to expand or something, When I was there the place was packed in so tight it was hard to enjoy the aircraft.
But even better would be to see it flying!
The Navy knows where there are enough parts to put one together to form a display aircraft.
Tim