Fri Jun 20, 2008 9:07 am
Jack, they accomplished the number one priority by cutting the longerons.
It must NEVER, EVER, be capable of flight ! Some misguided soul might try it in the future, so,...by cutting it they were actually protecting it ! I suppose they are actually studying the NHC policy of storing aircraft on the bottom of the ocean to further protect them for future generations !
It must NEVER, EVER, be capable of flight ! Some misguided soul might try it in the future, so,...by cutting it they were actually protecting it ! I suppose they are actually studying the NHC policy of storing aircraft on the bottom of the ocean to further protect them for future generations !
Fri Jun 20, 2008 9:10 am
Jack, just curious.
Could it be that the longerons where already spliced from the bat ?
Mike did start with a battered wreck to begin with.
Look at the pic of the back end.
They cut the longerons to start with
Could it be that the longerons where already spliced from the bat ?
Mike did start with a battered wreck to begin with.
Look at the pic of the back end.
Fri Jun 20, 2008 9:24 am
all the NMNA in FL can do is stare on with envy! (for those who might not know, they don't have a Helldiver anymore)
Sasnak, where did it go ?
Fri Jun 20, 2008 9:27 am
Michel wrote:
Because Mike started with such a battered mess, new longerons had to be painstakingly, fabricated. It was expensive and time consuming. That's why it's so shameful that they were cut. The real shame is that there a series of bolts that can be removed that detach the entire upper fuselage from the lower wing structure, no cutting required. This would have left two sections that could have been moved easily.
As far as Mike's thoughts on this, I'll just let him decide whether he wants to comment any further. You all know how that goes.
Jack, just curious.
Quote:
They cut the longerons to start with
Could it be that the longerons where already spliced from the bat ?
Mike did start with a battered wreck to begin with.
Look at the of the back end.
Because Mike started with such a battered mess, new longerons had to be painstakingly, fabricated. It was expensive and time consuming. That's why it's so shameful that they were cut. The real shame is that there a series of bolts that can be removed that detach the entire upper fuselage from the lower wing structure, no cutting required. This would have left two sections that could have been moved easily.
As far as Mike's thoughts on this, I'll just let him decide whether he wants to comment any further. You all know how that goes.
Fri Jun 20, 2008 9:34 am
that detach the entire upper fuselage from the lower wing structure
OK. I now have made my mind.
Makes me wonder if people know how to read an instruction booklet and get information first.
Tks Eric & say hi to Mike
Mike
Fri Jun 20, 2008 9:49 am
When I was not in the middle of helping Tom Reilly move from Kissimmee, I got to watch Mike move his TBM. There were quite a number of people who stopped by and wondered why he was taking such care to disassemble an aircraft which would probably never fly. He just ignored them and continued making careful work of the disassembly. It was really something to watch- his diligence was incredible and something that people should note, respect, and follow in similar work. From seeing the obvious care he took on the A-25, I can imagine how he feels. Mike, I'm truly sorry to see what they did to the A-25, cause I know you put a lot of work into it.
????
Fri Jun 20, 2008 9:50 am
They'll be a cutting on the Belle next now that they're all practiced up 
Fri Jun 20, 2008 9:57 am
That's just wrong. No way around that conclusion.
Edu-bacation
Fri Jun 20, 2008 10:22 am
where was Mike during this move?
I don't know where Mike was during this event. But if I was the legal titled owner of a rare aircraft, I'd probably make sure the people who went to pick it up knew how to take it apart, properly and carefully...
Somebody should make up an information sheet about this move, with photos and description of what happened, and pass it on to every single owner of a warbird. I'd burn my L-5 and BT-13 before I let clowns like that care for them...
Fri Jun 20, 2008 10:55 am
You'd think that there would be manuals to show how the aircraft disassembles. Like the Structural Repair Manual or the Illustrated Parts Breakdown. Don't have a Helldiver manual, but the T-6 manual shows these things quite clearly! I wonder if they had access to them? 
????
Fri Jun 20, 2008 11:00 am
a quote from a informed source............
What they did to Mike's work was just stupid. They've treated him horribly and are pissed that he wasn't there to load it.
They wouldn't take any of his advice about disassembly. The guy in charge of restorations is a complete dickhead.
What they did to Mike's work was just stupid. They've treated him horribly and are pissed that he wasn't there to load it.
They wouldn't take any of his advice about disassembly. The guy in charge of restorations is a complete dickhead.
Fri Jun 20, 2008 11:04 am
Hey guys I was at Chanute Air Force Base when they decided to move the B-36 to the west coast, they hired a bunch of local guys to come help take the airplane apart, I about when I saw this guy go up into one of the engine nacelles with a hacksaw and just start cutting through tubing and wire bundles . So this does not surprise me one bit, it is just a different mentality when it comes down to who's dime is paying the tab. The Air Force guys will have all of the time and budget to put it back together the way THEY WANT IT, so who knows if they'll if fix it right. It was like someone said earlier," It must NEVER, EVER, be capable of flight ! Some misguided soul might try it in the future"
Scott........
when I saw this guy go up into one of the engine nacelles with a hacksaw and just start cutting through tubing and wire bundles . So this does not surprise me one bit, it is just a different mentality when it comes down to who's dime is paying the tab. The Air Force guys will have all of the time and budget to put it back together the way THEY WANT IT, so who knows if they'll if fix it right. It was like someone said earlier," It must NEVER, EVER, be capable of flight ! Some misguided soul might try it in the future"
Scott........
Fri Jun 20, 2008 11:07 am
When I see something like that it just makes me want to throw up! Mike has put some serious time on that bird, and those Morons come in and do that. Someone needs a good a$$kicking.
Fri Jun 20, 2008 11:17 am
mustangdriver wrote:O.K. so I have got to ask, and this is not being a smart ass. I am not an aircraft mover and I know so. What is wrong with this move besides the fire wall issue. I am not sure why they did that either, but I also don't know another way to load it on there. Please be constructive, and maybe I can help fix this going forward.
Having the center section sitting on the truck strapped down like that seems dangerous. The weight is all centered all on the firewall. Then you have the rest of the center section strapped tightly to the deck. When the trailer goes down the road it will flex and since there is no cushion to give and the wieght is not distributed it will put additional forces on the fuselage. I'm not say that it will break or bend for sure but just isn't waht I would suggest. I would suggest building a cjig that bolts to various hard points on the center section and make a ridged frame between the hard points with heavy steal to keep it from flexing. Either that or create a craddle that more evenly distributes that wieght and leaves the the fusleage less vulnerable to the flex of the trailer.
The tail section doesn't look horrible to me, it doesn;t have much weight to it and hopefully that mattress will give it some cushion from the flex. It looks like it could use some better strapping but it doesn't look like they are done iwth that yet. As far as sawing anything, that seems like nothing but being in a hury. They didn't want the take the time to figure out how to do it right and that isn't something I would expect from the a national collection. I am extreamly disapointed by that.
Fri Jun 20, 2008 11:26 am
Well thank you all for the constructive criticism that I asked for. Is there anything anyone can offer me besides "that sucks". So far no. How would you have moved it?
Rick H, we are a static museum, we own the aircraft. It is not going to fly. We aren't just holding it for a while until someone wants to fly it, it is part of our collection. You are still pissed about the F-105. It would have been nice to see one fly, but that very F-105 is preserved with the Spruce Goose. Pretty nice I'd say. As for the Helldiver, don't worry. We are going to study some very authentic paint schemes to place on it, pick the best one, and apply a very accurate scheme to it. Then after that we will paint names all over the outside.
The Navy museum does not have an SB2C on display any longer. Some of the people here love to bash that museum. And say, "Id love to ask them where their Helldiver is". O.K. here is a question for you. Where is that Helldiver that they had? Oh yeah it's in storage where no one can see it at NASM.
I have seen worse things done to flying warbirds here, with much less said. Is this all really about the transportation of this aircraft, or about a chance to kick sand in a museum's face that you don't like.
It seems here that you can say anything you want about the national museums, but if you whisper anything about a private owner or flying warbird, you are in the wrong.
Rick, would you like to tell people anything good about the NMUSAF? How about all of the stuff they gave the CF to get the 909 back in the air after it crashed off of the end of Runway 28? Even when a very well known person in your group said to scrap it. That's right scrap it. Others including Wright Pat said it could be fixed.
I try time and time again to be respectful here and before I open my mouth I try to put it in a tasteful manner. I know what a labor of love these aircraft, and museums are to us. SO I try and pay one everyone a little respect. It would be nice to get it back.
Jack, Pappy Boyington is the best, Yeager was the first to break the Sound barrier, the Belle was first in it's 25th mission, and Bob Hoover is awesome. So there.
Rick H, we are a static museum, we own the aircraft. It is not going to fly. We aren't just holding it for a while until someone wants to fly it, it is part of our collection. You are still pissed about the F-105. It would have been nice to see one fly, but that very F-105 is preserved with the Spruce Goose. Pretty nice I'd say. As for the Helldiver, don't worry. We are going to study some very authentic paint schemes to place on it, pick the best one, and apply a very accurate scheme to it. Then after that we will paint names all over the outside.
The Navy museum does not have an SB2C on display any longer. Some of the people here love to bash that museum. And say, "Id love to ask them where their Helldiver is". O.K. here is a question for you. Where is that Helldiver that they had? Oh yeah it's in storage where no one can see it at NASM.
I have seen worse things done to flying warbirds here, with much less said. Is this all really about the transportation of this aircraft, or about a chance to kick sand in a museum's face that you don't like.
It seems here that you can say anything you want about the national museums, but if you whisper anything about a private owner or flying warbird, you are in the wrong.
Rick, would you like to tell people anything good about the NMUSAF? How about all of the stuff they gave the CF to get the 909 back in the air after it crashed off of the end of Runway 28? Even when a very well known person in your group said to scrap it. That's right scrap it. Others including Wright Pat said it could be fixed.
I try time and time again to be respectful here and before I open my mouth I try to put it in a tasteful manner. I know what a labor of love these aircraft, and museums are to us. SO I try and pay one everyone a little respect. It would be nice to get it back.
Jack, Pappy Boyington is the best, Yeager was the first to break the Sound barrier, the Belle was first in it's 25th mission, and Bob Hoover is awesome. So there.
Last edited by mustangdriver on Fri Jun 20, 2008 11:39 am, edited 1 time in total.