Rocky Mt. Mustang
Fri Feb 08, 2008 4:30 pm
P-51D s/n 44-14190 5Y+Q “Denver Belle” flown by Capt John Walker 384th FS 364th FG Honington, UK 1945. A little trouble on the taxi-way.
Fri Feb 08, 2008 6:09 pm
I like those 'toned down' national markings. Widely used in Europe. Pity none appearing on restorations now...
Sat Feb 09, 2008 12:56 am
Toned down? There seems to be no conclusive evidence that Mustangs had their insignias toned down purposely. It rather may be from fuel spillage, discoloring the white. Note this A/C appears to have had the invasion stripes removed. Av gas was the most prevalent solvent. Second aircraft shows different shade variation. to me, this suggests accidental effect. Any reliable evidence to the contrary???
Please, let's get to the bottom of this Mustang notion.
Please, let's get to the bottom of this Mustang notion.
???
Sat Feb 09, 2008 9:35 am
Please, let's get to the bottom of this Mustang notion.
Let's get the Razorback and the canopy issue settled before moving
to paint
BTW looks like it was toned down to me no gas cap on the right side
Sat Feb 09, 2008 10:36 am
"Razorback" issue settled? Come on Jack, the earlier Mustangs don't feature a sharp spine ala P-47. How is it even an issue? LOL
It's a plot I tell you!
It's a plot I tell you!
Sat Feb 09, 2008 11:00 am
It seems that if the USAAF went to the trouble of graying the markings, they would be doing OD Green.
Its like Lo-vis on a mirror!
Its like Lo-vis on a mirror!
Sat Feb 09, 2008 1:50 pm
IIRC, according to Roger Freeman 8th Air Force fighters were never officially instructed to 'tone down' their national insignias as IIRC the bomber groups were. Going on memory here. Makes sense from the start as the bombers were lumbering along and the insignias (they must have figured out back then) were nice aiming points for the Luftwaffe.
However, there are examples where it's pretty obvious (including good clear shots of obvious no-masking tape paint overspray on the insignia) that "toning down" did indeed occur in some 8AF fighter groups and/or squadrons.
The 'irony' of 8th AF markings for artists like me and my friends in the serious scale modelling community is that while the 8th is so well documented in terms of photos and official general markings regulations/guidelines, there was a tremendous latitude in the time periods of application/adherence to regs of markings application group to group, and even squadron to squadron.
In some groups, the squadron commanders were the "gods" of their units, with much leeway in less-important areas like this. In other groups, the burning bush resided in the group commander's office alone. I suspect personalities had much to do with each case-by-case basis. The evidence suggests that if a group was "hot" and pulled their fair share and then some, VIII Fighter Command, especially in the Doolittle/Kepner era, didn't sweat the small stuff like whether or not a squadron sprayed some gray on their insignias a'la what the bomber boys were doing.
That's why I specialize in the 8th ... every time I begin research for a painting I have to start from scratch almost and figure out what squadron "X" was doing to their planes as of the date of my planned painting - luckily, as I said, while there were differences group to group and even squadron to squadron, the 8th was so well covered image-wise that the detective work is made much easier.
And thanks to guys like Jack and Martin who always seem to have one or two magic images to illustrate (or discredit
) certain points ... guys? ...
Wade
However, there are examples where it's pretty obvious (including good clear shots of obvious no-masking tape paint overspray on the insignia) that "toning down" did indeed occur in some 8AF fighter groups and/or squadrons.
The 'irony' of 8th AF markings for artists like me and my friends in the serious scale modelling community is that while the 8th is so well documented in terms of photos and official general markings regulations/guidelines, there was a tremendous latitude in the time periods of application/adherence to regs of markings application group to group, and even squadron to squadron.
In some groups, the squadron commanders were the "gods" of their units, with much leeway in less-important areas like this. In other groups, the burning bush resided in the group commander's office alone. I suspect personalities had much to do with each case-by-case basis. The evidence suggests that if a group was "hot" and pulled their fair share and then some, VIII Fighter Command, especially in the Doolittle/Kepner era, didn't sweat the small stuff like whether or not a squadron sprayed some gray on their insignias a'la what the bomber boys were doing.
That's why I specialize in the 8th ... every time I begin research for a painting I have to start from scratch almost and figure out what squadron "X" was doing to their planes as of the date of my planned painting - luckily, as I said, while there were differences group to group and even squadron to squadron, the 8th was so well covered image-wise that the detective work is made much easier.
And thanks to guys like Jack and Martin who always seem to have one or two magic images to illustrate (or discredit
) certain points ... guys? ...
Wade