Air Pirates Oct 2007 B-17 Recovery...

[Taylor Stevenson]

that'd be cool! Are there many of the original life boats around?

[Warhawk]

That pic looks photo shopped. the nose is damaged as if it stood up on its nose.The shadows look wrong as well. The setting does not look right.

It's not just the nose thats damaged. One engine is also missing or folded up fairly bad. You can see that when it came to rest that it was sliding backwards. I would say that whatever it hit smashed the nose and it pivoted around that object on the port inboard engine. Whatever said object is, it's probably just out of the picture frame as the wing appears to be in decent condition overall. The shadowing and general poor quality of the picture may well be distorting my perception of any damage in that area, but I think it is telling that that is the only engine where I cannot see prop blades sticking up.

[B17news]

like someone said the other day, in the 50s, that would have been a write-off, today it is an easy restoration.

Def. interested in hearing more about this.

B

[jmkendall]

Lets assume for a moment it has not been photoshoped. To me the Antennas seem to indicate a true picture.

1) From the tail turret, a late model G. Typical of SB-17K/G/Hs.

2) Yellow and black Sea Air Rescue marking around tail.

3) Three antenna wires? Bet a tech type could make that stand out. Short Wave? For long non los flights?

4)No buzz number

5)Markings aft of Cockpit Most likely read: "Air Sea Rescue"

6) I am going out on a limb here, but; I think it was a wheels down landing. No furrows in the snow. No snow on the a/c indicates a recent crash. The nose seems to be too high to be on the ground. And; I do agree that the nose appears pranged,but; that could be from the radar unit in the old chin turret position hitting a tall terrain feature.

a) assume for a second it is. Then I would be more inclined to think it was a lost bird from the 10th Rescue Squadron in Alaska.

b) would not appear to be 43-39473 which crashed in Cold Bay Ak in 1947. As all eight on board were killed. This looks like a survivable crash.

c) Not 43 39499 which was destroyed in the Philipeans.

Question: What happened to the waist window?

Comment: There were 130 known SB-17 conversions. Some of the serial numbers are known.
43-39112
43-39473-crashed cold bay Ak. All on board killed.
43-39499-destroyed Philipeans
43-39503

B-17H:
44-83573
44-83575
44-83705
44-83710
44-83719
44-83722
44-83794
44-83799
44-83802

TB-17H:
44-83700
44-83714
44-83718
44-83791
44-83793

More later

[gregv]

I agree the photo does look odd, but I think it is due to lighting. I would hazard a wild guess that this shot was taken in very low light or night using a searchlight/flare/starshell or some other form of airborne illumination, possibly from the aircraft that took the photo. Maybe there was no choice due to the time of year and location, i.e. close to or above the Arctic circle...

Looks like snow to me as well, but who knows maybe sand?

Can't wait to see more of this one!

greg v.

[Glen]

Hopefuly it can be restored to Fly again ! any body got ideas where it might end up ?

[Curtis Block]

I'll tell you now that the SB-17 in the Olympics is out of the question. Without referring to the websites. I seem to remember that the aircraft tobogganed down the mountain after impact and then was later dynamited. I haven't been there myself but a very good friend of mine and ex-roomate, visited the site and showed me the pictures. You might be able to savage the wheels or some other misc. parts, if they aren't too corroded or bent. It's a mess.

Here are some of the sites....

http://www.peak.org/~mikey/746/

http://home.sprintmail.com/~kawatson/opff/opffall.htm

There are many more. It is a well known wreck

[b17warbirdguru]

Another observation.... It doesn't seem to have the yellow scheme in the middle of the fuselage like other Rescue B-17's... or on the wings...no color change or black lines....

[b17warbirdguru]

and maybe sand is not a bad idea...i had thought of that too...

http://www.zianet.com/tmorris/dhahranalbum.html

[jmkendall]

44-83345: Crashed Kadena AFB Japan
44-83470: Ditched off Davis AFB Ak
44-83527: Crashed in Japan
44-83575: Collins foundation bird
44-83710: Crashed Colorado
44-83722: Current survivor, sorta
44-83780: Crashed Ernest Harmen AFB NFLD CAN.
44-83794: Crashed on Take off. Ernest Harmen AFB NFLD CAN.

Most of this is from Joe Baughers site. The rest from the net.

[51fixer]

Another observation.... It doesn't seem to have the yellow scheme in the middle of the fuselage like other Rescue B-17's... or on the wings...no color change or black lines....

Appears to have yellow band with black stripes fwd of horizontal.
I don't think the back is broke as the wire antennas still appear to have tension. I think it is an illusion due to snow the the shape of the fus. It might be tweaked but I don't think it is broke.
If it went up on nose that hard then the props and wings would show some damage. Maybe a runaway snow plow or another aircraft?
I would say it was sitting there awhile when the photo was taken. No tailwheel mark that I can make out.
Rich

[Shay]

Another observation.... It doesn't seem to have the yellow scheme in the middle of the fuselage like other Rescue B-17's... or on the wings...no color change or black lines....

There is some snow fall on the aircraft. You can just barely make out the Stars and Bars on th left wing.

Regarding the markings. I think what you are seeing here might be a middle stage in the evolution of the Air Rescue Service Markings for the SB-17


early


SB-17 that was transferred to Portugul from the USAF


Final version of the markings





Here is what I notice. Look at the portugese Fortress above. Dosen't it have it's cockpit "turtledeck" painted white???

Now look at the Air Pirates picture....does it look like the turtledeck is also painted white?




Might lead to a time frame as to when the accident took place and where it happened.


Shay
____________
Semper Fortis

[rwdfresno]

I agree the photo does look odd, but I think it is due to lighting. I would hazard a wild guess that this shot was taken in very low light or night using a searchlight/flare/starshell or some other form of airborne illumination, possibly from the aircraft that took the photo.

I think what you are seeing is that the sun is very low on the horizon. Look at all the hard shadows. The shadow from the tail almost covers the entire right side of the aircraft. If the light was coming from the aircraft it wouldn't be such a tall shadow in my opinion.

[Richard Woods]

The photo looks a lot like the one that was recovered from Labrador a few years ago.

[6trn4brn]

Does anyone here at WIX have any affiliation with Mr Larkins or anyone on the Air Pirates crew? Maybe they could pass on all of the interesting questions and get a little help answering a couple. Always fun to speculate, but some more info would go a long way towards feeding our incurable curiousity