Wed May 23, 2007 12:37 am
George,
Thanks for being interested in the unique aspects of this old girl. As to uncovering and researching the original parts of the airplane, you can thank Gary and a few others for all the hard work. I just happened to be doing research on B-24A features some years ago for a model that I was going to build. I had a chance to crawl around in Ol' 927 when it used to winter in Tulsa and documented some of the modifications on film. I've been volunteering some during the reconfiguration (started late, but that's another story) and my prior research just happened to come in handy. I'll bet Gary already has the info on the upper gun door or will have before he gets ready to reconvert it to original. It is cool being around the old bird and seeing the way Consolidated modified it to the transport configuration, as well as seeing how the reconfiguration project is changing people's attitudes about the airplane.
Scott
Thanks for being interested in the unique aspects of this old girl. As to uncovering and researching the original parts of the airplane, you can thank Gary and a few others for all the hard work. I just happened to be doing research on B-24A features some years ago for a model that I was going to build. I had a chance to crawl around in Ol' 927 when it used to winter in Tulsa and documented some of the modifications on film. I've been volunteering some during the reconfiguration (started late, but that's another story) and my prior research just happened to come in handy. I'll bet Gary already has the info on the upper gun door or will have before he gets ready to reconvert it to original. It is cool being around the old bird and seeing the way Consolidated modified it to the transport configuration, as well as seeing how the reconfiguration project is changing people's attitudes about the airplane.
Scott
Wed May 23, 2007 7:22 am
It appears that the door for the top gunner pulled down and slid aft on a track. Difficult to say for sure, but that's what it looks like.
I'm sorry I've not been of more use to y'all on this thread for a while. Just been focused on other things besides the B-24 for the last week or so. I'll get back into the swing of things soon though.
Gary
I'm sorry I've not been of more use to y'all on this thread for a while. Just been focused on other things besides the B-24 for the last week or so. I'll get back into the swing of things soon though.
Gary
Wed May 23, 2007 9:39 am
Gary, stop your apologizing darn it!! You don't owe anyone any apologies. You've been doing us a great service by sharing your experiences with us. We should be apologizing to you for you for taking so much of your limited free time & your valuable work time. If you don't post something for a day or two or even a week, then good for you. I'm sure though, that if you go for more than a week, somebody's going to come looking for you. Figuring you drowned in Lake Austin or something equally as bad.
Anyways, take it easy & thank you for all the effort you've put into the B-24 & educating your airplane poor brethern.
Mac
Anyways, take it easy & thank you for all the effort you've put into the B-24 & educating your airplane poor brethern.
Mac
Wed May 23, 2007 11:33 pm
My computer got a real bad virus and I just got it back all nice and clean. 
Anyway, nice to see the unveiling went well and everyone seems to like the new noseart. Loved the pic of the Lib running at nite 
Please don't anyone take this the wrong way but as far as this winter maintenance season goes, Gary has far surpased anyones dreams of what could be accomplished and doesn't need anyone saying but what about this or that being done!
Where we're at now, is to get her finished with whats been started and flying. We still have a huge amount of work to be done to get her out on tour so folks can get a look at this magnificant transformation.
Just my two cents!
NICE JOB GARY!!
Dave
Anyway, nice to see the unveiling went well and everyone seems to like the new noseart. Loved the pic of the Lib running at nite
Please don't anyone take this the wrong way but as far as this winter maintenance season goes, Gary has far surpased anyones dreams of what could be accomplished and doesn't need anyone saying but what about this or that being done!
Where we're at now, is to get her finished with whats been started and flying. We still have a huge amount of work to be done to get her out on tour so folks can get a look at this magnificant transformation.
Just my two cents!
NICE JOB GARY!!
Dave
Fri May 25, 2007 10:22 am
Gary,
Got any pic's of the "new" tail gunners compartment from the exterior with the doors shut? Just curious...
Got any pic's of the "new" tail gunners compartment from the exterior with the doors shut? Just curious...
B-24A Top Gun Assembly
Sat May 26, 2007 11:52 am
Gary,
I have a copy of Tech Order 01-5EA-11, “CONSOLIDATED – INSTALLATION OF TOP GUN ASSEMBLY – B-24 AND B-24A”. This brief (5 page) typewritten T.O. is dated December 30, 1941 and is not illustrated but it does contain step-by-step instructions and a complete parts list. Glad to mail you a copy, or I can include the text in a long email or post. Let me know which is best for you.
Al Blue
I have a copy of Tech Order 01-5EA-11, “CONSOLIDATED – INSTALLATION OF TOP GUN ASSEMBLY – B-24 AND B-24A”. This brief (5 page) typewritten T.O. is dated December 30, 1941 and is not illustrated but it does contain step-by-step instructions and a complete parts list. Glad to mail you a copy, or I can include the text in a long email or post. Let me know which is best for you.
Al Blue
Re: B-24A Top Gun Assembly
Sat May 26, 2007 1:00 pm
Al Blue wrote:Gary,
I have a copy of Tech Order 01-5EA-11, “CONSOLIDATED – INSTALLATION OF TOP GUN ASSEMBLY – B-24 AND B-24A”. This brief (5 page) typewritten T.O. is dated December 30, 1941 and is not illustrated but it does contain step-by-step instructions and a complete parts list. Glad to mail you a copy, or I can include the text in a long email or post. Let me know which is best for you.
Al Blue
Well, first of all, Welcome to WIX!
Second, it would be wonderful if you can send me a copy of what you have for that top gun position. If there's anyone out there that would know how it's supposed to go, and have the documentation to prove it, it would be you. I use your book, The B-24 Liberator, as a reference often.
Gary
Sat May 26, 2007 1:02 pm
APG85 wrote:Gary,
Got any pic's of the "new" tail gunners compartment from the exterior with the doors shut? Just curious...
Sorry, but I've not finished that part of the tailgunner's section yet. It looks just like it did several weeks ago. I've been pretty much...no...completely worthless for the past two weeks. I just haven't had the fire in me to do anything on the airplane, but that's about to change, as I MUST get the dang thing finished for it's tour season.
I'll start back with the work and photo updates here pretty quick.
Gary
Sun May 27, 2007 6:46 am
Here is a volunteer mini-update and opinon piece:
The radio room passenger seats are installed with the exception of safety harnesses. I originally thought this would take a short time to accomplish, so of course it took me three 12 hour days!!! Ellen has been getting great on-the-job experience with a holesaw prepping the locations for passenger vents, and she wasn't exactly thrilled with the idea of cutting big holes in a near 70 year old artifact with her level of sheetmetal experiece. She did good, now if I can talk her into a project of our own I'll be set! Daniel is working on the complicated flooring at the main entry door that hinges to allow access to PX storage. Gary will fill you in later with photos (hint, hint).
I noticed something this weekend. All the visitors on Saturday that were touring the hangar called Ol' 927 a B-24 rather than a transport or LB-30. I think (hope) that the reaction from the general public will be as positive as what I heard yesterday.
Scott
The radio room passenger seats are installed with the exception of safety harnesses. I originally thought this would take a short time to accomplish, so of course it took me three 12 hour days!!! Ellen has been getting great on-the-job experience with a holesaw prepping the locations for passenger vents, and she wasn't exactly thrilled with the idea of cutting big holes in a near 70 year old artifact with her level of sheetmetal experiece. She did good, now if I can talk her into a project of our own I'll be set! Daniel is working on the complicated flooring at the main entry door that hinges to allow access to PX storage. Gary will fill you in later with photos (hint, hint).
I noticed something this weekend. All the visitors on Saturday that were touring the hangar called Ol' 927 a B-24 rather than a transport or LB-30. I think (hope) that the reaction from the general public will be as positive as what I heard yesterday.
Scott
Sun May 27, 2007 8:10 am
-
Here's a picture of the seats that Scott is referring to...
He's done a great job on them and they're plenty strong now for anyone that can fit up there. I've been second guessed by quite a few folks now, regarding these seats, but the only reason they're there (rather than the single, radio operator's chair), is because we have to sell rides on this airplane in order to help support it. Only one seat up there wouldn't have been enough revenue to make this happen. Initially, I didn't care about the revenue part of it, as I wanted to keep the airplane as original looking as possible. However, after seeing the picture below of an original troop seat setup, I decided to go ahead with this installation. Is it in tight quarters? Yep. Is it going to be less comfortable than a Regional Jet at any of those scumbag...I mean "Major" airlines? Very likely. But will it give folks the opportunity to ride on a W.W. II bomber in a seat that is very much like what troops and/or crew members would've sat in? You're darn tootin' it will.
My hope is to give our passengers at least a partial experience of what it may have been like flying in an airplane such as this back in the day. I think that plush seating and "refinements of today" would be taking away from that experience a bit. We will do what we can to insure that nobody gets a knot on their head by the placement of additional padding on the control cable cover up top, but I'm still going to attempt to make it look like it's supposed to be there.
I'm actually working on the airplane again, building the right waistgunner's door. I have to return the one that we're borrowing from the SanDiego Air & Space Museum, so I've got to get this done asap. As Scott mentioned earlier, Daniel is here working on the never-ending floorboard project. Normally, this would be a simple job, but we've had to make hinged, hidden doors within the floors to gain access to storage compartments underneath. Making these compartments for the PX has been a huge time killer for us, but we're getting closer to being finished with it.
I'll post progress pictures later.
Gary
Here's a picture of the seats that Scott is referring to...
He's done a great job on them and they're plenty strong now for anyone that can fit up there. I've been second guessed by quite a few folks now, regarding these seats, but the only reason they're there (rather than the single, radio operator's chair), is because we have to sell rides on this airplane in order to help support it. Only one seat up there wouldn't have been enough revenue to make this happen. Initially, I didn't care about the revenue part of it, as I wanted to keep the airplane as original looking as possible. However, after seeing the picture below of an original troop seat setup, I decided to go ahead with this installation. Is it in tight quarters? Yep. Is it going to be less comfortable than a Regional Jet at any of those scumbag...I mean "Major" airlines? Very likely. But will it give folks the opportunity to ride on a W.W. II bomber in a seat that is very much like what troops and/or crew members would've sat in? You're darn tootin' it will.
My hope is to give our passengers at least a partial experience of what it may have been like flying in an airplane such as this back in the day. I think that plush seating and "refinements of today" would be taking away from that experience a bit. We will do what we can to insure that nobody gets a knot on their head by the placement of additional padding on the control cable cover up top, but I'm still going to attempt to make it look like it's supposed to be there.
I'm actually working on the airplane again, building the right waistgunner's door. I have to return the one that we're borrowing from the SanDiego Air & Space Museum, so I've got to get this done asap. As Scott mentioned earlier, Daniel is here working on the never-ending floorboard project. Normally, this would be a simple job, but we've had to make hinged, hidden doors within the floors to gain access to storage compartments underneath. Making these compartments for the PX has been a huge time killer for us, but we're getting closer to being finished with it.
I'll post progress pictures later.
Gary
Sun May 27, 2007 10:38 am
As always Gary, many thanks for another informative post. Your clear explanations, coupled with historical and current pictures are truly educational and provide real insight both to your work AND how things were "back in the day"...
Sun May 27, 2007 11:35 am
retroaviation wrote:- Is it in tight quarters? Yep. Is it going to be less comfortable than a Regional Jet at any of those scumbag...I mean "Major" airlines? Very likely.
Gary
Gary,
You must have not sat in one of those "seats" on the Embraer jets. I get the feeling there will be much more leg room and actually room for your carry on, on Ol' 927.
Sun May 27, 2007 11:35 am
retroaviation wrote:- Is it in tight quarters? Yep. Is it going to be less comfortable than a Regional Jet at any of those scumbag...I mean "Major" airlines? Very likely.
Gary
Gary,
You must have not sat in one of those "seats" on the Embraer jets. I get the feeling there will be much more leg room and actually room for your carry on, on Ol' 927.
Sun May 27, 2007 12:33 pm
Nice job Gary but what's with the personal attack on regional jets...Buddy passes revoked!
Sun May 27, 2007 12:44 pm
Hi Gary, new to the posting game, but have been lurking here long enough to know how big a deal you have are going through with this b-24 rework. and to even have the time to read here let a lone post THANK YOU!!! You may have this Pic. but here it is any way. It seems to show the top side windows and if you look close hatches. look like an A model to me?? Jim
