Warbird Information Exchange

How long will warbirds keep on flying?

I am sure this statement as already made peoples hearts drop to their feet, but.... I just want to see what everyones thoughts were on this?

Back in 2000, me and my dad was talking about warbirds. My dad, being an old SOB as he is, gruntly told me that, "Na, you kiddin'! Warbirds will only fly for the next 2 or 3 years before they don't fly nomore". Somewhat disgruntled myself at to what he said really put a few choice words in that disgussion. Anyway, thankfully it has been a few more years then what he said. But it seem today that we may only have a few more presious years to watch warbirds. The cause could be several reasons. Politics, accidants, and those not understanding of the importance of Flying history will complain and complain until fianlly they get their wish of grounding ALL warbirds. What do you think?

-Nate

1. Restrictive regulations
2. Costs (insurance mostly)
3. Negative public opinion

will be the determinate for how long those expensive toys live on in the air.

Groups like the EAA, CAF, etc...can have an impact on #1. Competition can control #2. An accident(s) resulting in a large number of fatalities would invoke #3.

regards,

t~

4.00 a gallon gas has the makings of a lot of scrap aluminum!

Gas is the cheapest component of flying these aircraft. Really cost is a factor but won't keep me from flying them, insurance and regulatory B.S. are another matter entirely.

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Eric

"I spent most of my money on alcohol, women and skyraiders....and the rest of it I just wasted."

Eric makes a great point. If you can afford the cost to obtain and maintain these aircraft, the cost of gas probably won't deter you from flying them. Granted, the story might be a little different for the 4-engine bombers, but even then I think other factors will ground them before gas prices do.

Someone who pays $2M for a Corsair probably isn't too worried about gas prices.

Quite a lot of the rest of the world's been paying petroleum prices that N America would regard as obscene for years - and flying warbirds on it. (If my calculations are correct, UK (car) petrol is currently a pound a litre, or $7.22 per gallon - about twice Jiggersfromsphilly's tooth-suck figure.)

I never did get anyone stating a place where gas was cheaper than the USA in my previous query...

The demise of 'warbirds' has often been predicted; there will be bulges and restrictions, through time, but there's always going to be a hardcore who keep going.

Th rumours of death are greatly exaggerated...

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Raven

I think I heard recently that the people in Dubai pay about .19 cents a gallon.

Last time I saw something close to that was in 1968. Granted I can barely remember it because as have pointed out before I was just a small child !

Thanks. On this basis, higher gas prices = more warbirds.

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Raven

When the cost of building one from scratch is cheaper than restoring a real warbird. Which I believe is here or not far off.

It is my belief that the ultimate controlling factor will simply be the future availability of 100LL fuel or the ability to make something similar. There will always be people around willing to pay the price if the stuff can be bought.

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Warbird Colour - Authentic historic aircraft finishes http://www.warbirdcolour.co.uk

The greatest potential threat to the warbird movement is the Liberal do-gooder mentality that targets such things as "unnecessary" for public ownership. Any group of people that makes a mantra out of asking "why" rather than "why not" is a sure bet for wreaking irreversible havoc on the activities enjoyed by free people.

Regardless of the history, the engineering genius, the beauty they exhibit in flight, or the passion they imbue in their onlookers, these are still "items created to inflict death and pain on other humans", and therefore should be restricted to government possession only in the eyes of the touchy-feely crowd. If you want to locate the enemy of free will, just cast your gaze wherever "feelings" outweigh the might of logic.

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Rob Mears
'Surviving Corsairs' Historian
robcmears@yahoo.com
http://www.robmears.com

Rob Mears wrote:

".....these are still "items created to inflict death and pain on other humans".

OR....They helped achieve freedom from oppression for humans. Depends on how you look at it or market them to the masses.......

In the end deviant behavior by some operators, or crashes (Often hand in hand) will bring the last curtain call by humorless feds listening to public outcry.

John
CC CAF P-51C

mega millionaire collectors such as tallichette, weeks etc, movie stars with av gas in their blood such as tom cruise, harrison ford, & dennis quaid will all keep it moving forward. these are the high profile guys!! there are also alot of anonymous personalities in the warbird movement with big bucks too!! i see no danger in a kill off. while the liability issue rears it's head, along with operational costs etc, these big wallet guys can absorb the cost, god bless them, & i'm not looking down their throats or in their wallets either, they have the savvy & talent to make big bucks!! i do see 1 growing alternative for the rest of us poor slobs, foundations such as collings are doing a stellar job in preservation of aviation history. there should be more foundations popping up as operating warbird costs go up.

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tom d. friedman - hey!!! those fokkers were messerschmitts!! * without ammunition, the usaf would be just another flying club!!! * better to have piece of mind than piece of tail!!

While I don't think we will see the end of warbirds flying for the next 10+ years, I am fairly certain we will see many of the planes fly a lot less than they have done for the last 20 years!

But how many of Tallichet and Weeks airplanes are actively being flown? Very few, and that is how it's been for a long time. Which means that even they know (& feel) the actual cost involved here!

Kill off, not likely for some time. However when I first went to Evergreen at Marana in 92 they flew at shows, Lone Star, NWM, and Tom Thomas group from Liberal, KS did the same. None of these are participating in the same scale nowadays. Wiley Sanders used to do almost all the shows 20 years ago. Not anymore! Didn't David Lane ground his A-26 N119DR due to cost? Also hasn't there been a B-25 or two sold for the same reason? Thumb through Air Classics show reports from the 80s and note the number of warbirds present. How many planes at Oshkosh or Sun n' Fun compared to a decade ago? And how many more flyable planes aren't around today?


I guess they can. Question is, when does the cost outweigh their love for operating these planes???


As prices will soar (purchase, operating, insuring) that can be a way of keeping a warbird flying!

T J

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Make my day, punk!

I heard Kermit say that " they finish a plane, fly it for a while then park it to make room for the next one. They keep them in near flyable shape and bring it back up to speed if needed". Kermit is also just about the only one who flies his planes.

Lone Star does the same thing. There are aircraft that fly all the time and aircraft that used to fly, and now have been replaced by something else. The F3F hasn't flown in years, the F4F hasn't flown since they got it, the F6F flew when it was fresh, then it was parked for quite a while. It's been up and flying again for the last few years. The Corsair has never been parked.