Warbird Information Exchange

Seems a lot of warbird restorations currently being done, as well as new discoveries all over the world, as well as new-built warbirds, (which I guess wouldn't really count)

Wondering if 30 years from now the Warbird numbers will rise, even out, or even drop? Since everything that goes into a warbird is becoming so expensive and new discoveries, even though many currently, will begin to drop simply because only so many can be discovered.

Also the fact that Warbirds still are destroyed each year in many ways. It's always nice to see and hear about new restorations and discoveries, but it seems this all will end someday.

So what do you think, in 30 years, more, less or about the same? and will there still be an interest in warbirds as there is today?

My guess would be that the current trend in flyable aircraft becoming grounded and collections turning into static museums (Kalamazoo and significant portions of the Allen, Pond and Weeks collections being examples) is likely to continue due to rising insurance costs, scarcity of parts (especially engines), fuel costs, maintenance skills becoming harder to find as the older generation retire, etc. Therefore, I'd say that there will be less ACTIVE flying warbirds in 30 years, although the number of airframes in circulation may well be about the same.

Agreed. Although I can see some examples still doing limited flying in more eccentric collections like the Flying Heritage Collection. I can see the engine/parts problem overcome to a degree by specialty motor shops such as Crossthwaite and Gardener or others--if it pleases the applicable government agencies. It would still be worth the price of admission to see them in the air, too.

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"They done it, they done it, damned if they ain't flew." December 17, 1903

If the global warming freaks get their way, no warbirds will be flying in 30 years. They are already starting to figure out that some people fly for fun, which of course, is unacceptable to them. Now, if we could get Bill to take Al Gore for a ride.....


Steve G

Now watch what started off as an interesting thread about the future of warbirds degenerate into yet another pointless political argument!

Bill would probably LOVE to take Al Gore for a ride. Great minds,...well like minds anyway, unfortunately from what I saw of ALgore he'd throw the Spitfire into a severe aft CG config !

Come on kid's ... take that crap somewhere else, I want to hear from serious folks about what they really think about the Warbird population in 30 years. Keep it on the right tract please. I'm sure there are better places to discuss Al Gore.

I think there will be more Warbirds flying in 30 years. There is still no piston powered aircraft that fly the speeds and are as well built as WW 2 aircraft. I have been watching them for the last 38 years and with the better training now and less of a cavalier attitude about their use fewer are lost and more enter the market as restored aircraft.

I know there are quite a few that are static in museums. But not all of the owners have donated them to the museums.

What happens at least half of the time is that the owner leaves enough money to keep the aircraft in the mueum after their passing.

The other half of the time after the owner passes there is an auction, or before that the aircraft are slowly released over time.

Also museums do fail on occasion and aircraft need to be sold to the public to avoid total financial collapse.

I agree completely with what Mike said. As time goes by, millionaires with disposable cash will pay ever increasing amounts, raising the costs of warbirds. Provenance is one such outfit which is fueling the fire for rising warbird prices.

Since they will be raising the value of warbirds, insurance will become increasingly harder to obtain and cost more. Because of this, I believe we will see more collections being permanently grounded because they are considered "too rare" to fly. That's pretty much what happened to the P-38. At one time, in the late 90's, early 00's, there were only 2 or 3 P-38's flying because they were considered too valuable to fly. That mentality will only proliferate.

Also, fueling the fire will be maintainability and operability. With less and less people being trained to work on radial motors and less pilots with taildragger time, that also will have a negative effect. Also, finally, is the skyrocketing price of aviation fuel. Unless, we find an alternative energy supplement to dinosaur gas, it's likely to only go up in price. That will keep a LOT of warbirds and warbird owners from flying their planes. What I think will happen is that the Big Iron, such as the heavy bombers will be the first casualty.

Don't think it's possible, look at FIFI. True, she has engine problems, but even after those are fixed, the CAF has real issues to contend with on how they are going to pay the fuel bills to feed 4 gas-guzzling 3350's. I hate to say it, but I think it's only a matter of time before FIFI and a lot more heavy bombers are permanently grounded because of the HUGE operating costs. It's already happened to one heavy bomber, the B-17 "Pink Lady". She is being grounded soon because of extremely costly operating expenses. Unfortunately, look for that trend to continue.

My two cents!

I wasn't talking about politics. I was talking about an issue that, sooner or later, almost certainly will affect all of us that fly for the pure enjoyment of it.


Steve G

I suspect(hope) that we will have warbirds for some decades to come. They are still supported by a good part of the public that sees them as historic and patriotic. It is getting more difficult as young people growing up today don't have that image we or our parents may have had as kids. At Oskhosh, Thunder, Genesseo, Midland I have had dozens, maybe hundreds of people thank me for bringing teh Spit. Two of my fears are too much or hostile govt. regulation, and also a lack of 100 ll fuel. As for big Al, who I just saw on TV, I think he is more the size for a Skyraider. Now Tipper, however seems to be right in mid Spitfire cg range.

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Bill Greenwood
Spitfire N308WK

it won't be a political argument if insults continue being thrown for no reason at all. Bill kindly ignored this. You can bet I won't.

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"I knew the jig was up when I saw the P-51D-20-NA Mustang blue-nosed bastards from Bodney, and by the way the blue was more of a royal blue than an indigo and the inner landing gear interiors were NOT green, over Berlin."

I would rather see Teddy Kennedy take Al Gore carpooling over a bridge.

In 30 yrs, there will be no warbirds flying due to lack of 100 octane fuel, and insurance. There is all ready mounting pressure from the EPA to get rid of the lead in avgas.

Again, come on people, keep that political nonsense away from this post. You tend to turn the people off who really want to contrubute to this "SPECIFIC POST" when you bring up politically charged statements. Please keep on the topic, or simply just go to another post that would welcome that kind of banter. I strongly believe politics WILL NOT bring an end to the warbird community in 30 years. I really refuse to believe that. But who knows right?, but we still can discuss this issue with better imput than politics. I know you can do better than that muddyboots, you seem like a smart guy, just a little hot at times, but I guess I am too at times. There's a time and a place for politics, just not here in this post.

the only flying warbirds will be jets and they will be operating on bio fuels

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EVERYTHING that CAN fly should be ALLOWED to FLY!
IWO JIMA'S best narative..."GOD ISN'T HERE"
http://www.amazon.com/God-Isnt-Here-Ame ... 0976154706


P: Noise coming from under instrument panel. Sounds like a midget pounding on something with a hammer.

S: Took hammer away from midget.