Warbird Information Exchange

The thread on the merits of QF-4's being shot down prompted me to dig up these pics of the F-4's being scrapped at Cherry Point after the Navy canceled their drone conversion program (cheaper to use the USAF non-dogfightable versions than these being converted into QF-4S by the NADEP facility). The last of the planes were crunched about two years ago. Before everyone goes ape on the Navy and Marines, they went above and beyond trying to find homes for the birds. A number of the planes went to museums (Carolina's Aviation Museum, MAPS, +others) but several groups expressed interest then backed out after seeing the work/cost to move one by truck. I helped do the two on loan to us in Charlotte (one complete, one cockpit only), and take it from me -- it's a pain and then some! I also later helped the FACM guys in TX with theirs from Pt Mugu, --the only easy thing when working on an F-4 is giving blood! Sorry for the big pictures but shrinking them killed the gruesome details. This is why I think a Viking funeral as a drone is a better way to die for these awesome machines, at least they get to go down swinging!
Brian

That was torture ... Poor old lady spread across the ground, all naked ..... I would prefer the F-4 be shot down at least it would pass with dignity.

Thanks for the pic (I think)

I sure wish they could have cut out a cockpit or at least a seat or maybe a tailhook for me...

Thanks for helping to get "Scooby" saved here in Ft. Worth!



[img][img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v260/Ztex/Aero%202007/P1010261.jpg[/img][/img]

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Zane Adams
There I was at 20,000 ft, upside down and out of ammunition.
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Like the old saying goes, "If only I had know ahead of time!". At least we kept a few of the planes from being ground up into cans. Glad to have been able to help, it was really a pleasure to help save another F-4 (especially since Michael Dean already did the really hard parts!) Congrats of the F-14 too! Scooby's looking good!

The F-14 is a cool thing to see.










(Disclaimer: I'm not involved with the FAC guys...just a spectator)

Z

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Zane Adams
There I was at 20,000 ft, upside down and out of ammunition.
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Not sure where you heard that the USAF QF-4s can't be fought. They seem to do that just fine -- I have witnessed it with my own eyes.

Randy-

Me thinks that is a Naahveee shot at us USAF types... not anything about the jet.

Say, are you a Mad Hatter or a Panther? And where is Magoo thse days?

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Scott 'Gunny' Perdue
www.flyAMT.com
www.scottperdue.com

Sorry if I was not clear, I was not trying to take a shot at USAF pilots !

I was told by the NADEP guys that the Navy NADEP QF-4S's were more
capable of dogfighting etc than the ones done FOR the USAF. Maybe
because they are S models with the slats ?
I have not got to see either fly (other than heritage flights).


Brian
Proud supporter of all the military branchs!
(except maybe the five sided wind tunnel!)

Brian-

No worries. I've got 1200 hours in straight wing F-4s... the F-4E had slats. In fact I did spend a certain amount doing BFM with them. The slatted F-4 had a much better inital turn than the straight wing... but after that the straight wing could gain it's energy back faster... survive that initial turn and things were much better. As for capability... it depends more on the pilot than the airplane... neither were capable of GFM.

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Scott 'Gunny' Perdue
www.flyAMT.com
www.scottperdue.com

It does seem in those AF F-4 drone shoot down pictures they are flying straight and level and the AF always doing the shooting. However in those Navy top gun videos they are a yanking and banking.

Can't talk about that, or the videos you have seen. But my one and only Combat Archer profile was an AIM-7M shot at a 5g maneuvering target... does tht meet your criteria of yanking and banking?

_________________
Scott 'Gunny' Perdue
www.flyAMT.com
www.scottperdue.com

I'm a Bolar...Magoo was just the SQ/CC up until the beginning of November, now he's off to do O-6 stuff I believe.

You don't remember, I'm sure, but I met you at SJAFB in '99 or so when you were sharing a hanger with BA Anders. I flew his T-6 a couple times, and I think you had a Bonanza in there...

Hmmm, interesting stuff. I've seen the USAF drones wrap it up for the AIM-9 shoot profiles, so I don't know what the limitation is.

"Aces 3, Arm Hot"

"Aces 1, Merge, Merge"

"Drone's Turning"

"Aces 3, Fox!"

"Fox Fox!"

Sorry, I don't remember you... were you in the Eagles with me or the Lancers with BA... I'm guessing the Lancers? That hangar was mine... BA still has the T-6... I've sold my third Bo... selling an Extra so I can buy a T-6... do you remember the Stearman parts I had in the hangar... I finally finished the project in 02, took it to Osh in 03... and it sits in my backyard as we speak (I live at an airpark and it's a tad too cold to fly open cockpit right now.).

I knew Magoo was the CC... I dropped in on him on a First Friday summer before last... I coined the whole squadron and caught about half a dozen! I was a Bolar when we stood up the Strike Eagle at RAFL... Magoo was in my flight... once upon a time. Say hey to Leno for me... and drop in next time you're in Fort Worth.

gunny

_________________
Scott 'Gunny' Perdue
www.flyAMT.com
www.scottperdue.com

Hi Scott and Randy,
Do either of you remember seeing a former Polish AN-2 biplane at any of
the airshows at Shady J ? I was a crew member on it until the owner sold it in 2000.
Scott were you in the Marines before the Air Force by chance?
Brian