Warbird Information Exchange

This shot shows "Mighty Mouse" firing up for a run out of NKP. For those ace detectives out there:

A. Is this a morning or late afternoon picture?

B. Is it early or late in the Nimrod program which ran between 1966 and 1969?

C. What are the weapons hung under the wings and were they intended to be dropped from low altitude or a higher altitude above 1500 ft?

D. Are the machine guns armed?

E. Who was the airplane named after and by whom?

What level will you score?

1 correct: you probably went to correspondence school

2 correct: you attended Texas Community College at Austin

3 correct: you maybe attended SMU, TCU or Baylor

4 correct: you attended Texas A & M University

5 correct: you walk and talk with God on a first name basis as His Aviation Advisor

my new background. You danged air force types. I shoulda joined the air force.

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"I knew the jig was up when I saw the P-51D-20-NA Mustang blue-nosed bastards from Bodney, and by the way the blue was more of a royal blue than an indigo and the inner landing gear interiors were NOT green, over Berlin."

Mud, this is the best answer so far. We will give you a 5 correct for that conclusion!!!
Party on! Cheers, JR

Hawkeye interviewed this Nim about a year or so ago before we really got started on the restoration. The paint had been stripped and the bomb racks removed, but that was about all at the time. Anyway, Larry demonstrates how to mount an A26 the old fashioned way. The right canopy is off so that didn't help since it is part of the hand hold geometry, but he made it up any way just like it was 1968. He continues with an assessment of what he remembers of the cockpit from back then in comparison. Fox Mike for those unfamiliar is an FM radio that was used for comm with Army types. Enjoy some good history straight from the one of the guys who was there and made it!! JR

http://vimeo.com/15702066

I'll take a stab at a couple...

Late afternoon
Late in the program
Sta 1 has a Mk82 rigged as a daisycutter, with 2, 3 and 4 carrying napalm. If loaded symeterical, the same load on right wing, reversed order.
Naplam low release, with the Mk 82 high

Guns loaded but not charged

Nice work, Craig.

And just in case you want that "Aviation Advisor" job, the Nimrod website gives Charles Vogler credit for naming "Mighty Mouse", apparently something to do with his summer cottage called "Mouse Island".

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It was a good idea, it just didn't work.

Breaking news: WE have the latest tag team champions of the world. Good work detectives Dan and Craig. Yes, the name of the airplane was given by Charlie Vogler who was at NKP from late 68 to late 69. He won the Silver Star in that action. His son Don Vogler established the http://www.a-26legacy.org website and if you look at the photos he has posted of the Nimrods, you will find the picture of his dad and the story of how he named the airplane. Don's group started the idea of restoring 679 and has supported us in the effort on behalf of the Nimrods and other A-26 pilots/crew/ground personnel who were there at NKP before the 609th SOS was formalized. He has posted updates about our work on his site as well. There are only two clues that have not been addressed and that concerns the armament load panel on the side of the cockpit (late addition) and the napes hanging off the wings. Did they have fins the whole time? If not, why were they added? OK, Randy, where are you and Walt on this one?? JR

Fins would have been added to stabilize and increase the positive seperation of the tanks when released. As a twofer, they would have aided in getting he canisters in more of a nose down attitude for canopy penetration as well as giving some stabilization to the canisters during their flight after release.

If you are talking about the armaments label block, it shouild have included stores onboard and date and time jett carts installed.

As far as the finned nape, we didn't have them during Project Big Eagle. Never could figure how it took so long to decide to put fins on them. If you've seen unfinned nape falling, it has the ballistics of a falling tree stump. Unless they were dropped from very low level, I can't imagine how you could be assured of hitting anything.
I think cvairwerks hit it squarely as to the purpose of the fins.
Back to the picture of Mighty Mouse:
The shadows on the ramp do in fact indicate a late afternoon launching. Another thing of note, they are no longer carrying their own flares on the outboard racks, which would indicate that they are probably getting flare support from the "Candlestick" C-123's.
We also weren't using daisy cutters in the beginning. According to the book, #651 (Mighty Mouse) was assigned to NKP 24 Oct. 67, so the pic would have had to have been taken after that date.
As far as the armament placard, I cannot recall having ever writing anything on them. Maybe the armament NCO did dthat after completion, or possibly the crew chief. I just have no recollection of it. I'll be sure to get a good pic of the one on 676 this week at the Air Force Museum.

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Randy Ryman
Project Big Eagle
NKP Thailand 1966
http://www.coastcomp.com/av/florence/florandy.htm

Randy, I noticed the black paint on the ordnance undersides. Was this done for evening ops or did ground crew just have too much free time on their hands?

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It was a good idea, it just didn't work.

.......... I noticed the black paint on the ordnance undersides. Was this done for evening ops or did ground crew just have too much free time on their hands?
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We didn't do that when I was there, but somewhere along the line I think someone figured out that the silver nape canisters were reflecting pretty good off the flares, and giving the gunners a target, so they started painting them black.

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Randy Ryman
Project Big Eagle
NKP Thailand 1966
http://www.coastcomp.com/av/florence/florandy.htm

Yeppers, you guys are good!! Bout got it all figured out. Mighty Mouse was named by Charles Vogler who arrived at NKP in Sept 68 so we know it was not named until then. He named it for his summer home on Mouse Island in a lake in New Hampshire. The issue with the finned napes.... yep, without they had the ballistics of a tumbling bear. Never knew exactly where they would land, but if dropped low enough, it didn't matter all that much cause napes are almost in the same category as horseshoes and hand grenades. Close counts. The problem arose when the AAA became much thicker on the HCM trail. The A-26's were doing so much damage to the truck convoys that a lot more was done by the NVA to try and stop their losses. So the A-26 drivers had to release the napes from a much higher altitude to avoid the guns. Fins kept them headed the right direction. Black paint helped cut down on the reflections. Most of the gunners fired by sound when they couldn't actually see the airplanes in the dive so the pilots very often put the props out of sync to throw them off. The gunners oftentimes waited for the airplanes to pull off the target before firing so the crews couldn't see what was chasing them and maneuver to avoid. So the practice of pulling hard and changing directions quickly to reacquire the target or see who was firing at them could be a tactic to help avoid the element of surprise to some extent. Attacking the guns was something that pilots sometimes got their fangs out and buried in the floorboards going after. But if a shooter keeps missing you, why would you want to attack and possibly kill him. They might replace him with somebody who shoots better?? The addition of the written armament panel on the side under the cockpit was added later as a standard practice so the crew could verify the load out. JR

..............The gunners oftentimes waited for the airplanes to pull off the target before firing so the crews couldn't see what was chasing them and maneuver to avoid.........
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When we departed for Project Big Eagle, we took along several GE mini-guns, the lttle brother of the 20mm "Vulcan" gatling guns. They were pylon mounted versions like shown here. Anyway, one night at one of the parties, one of the pilots was complaining about the very thing mentioned above. He said, "The little bas*#%& keep their heads down until I pull out and then they jump up and shoot at me on the pull out." I jokingly mentioned that he should turn the mini-guns around backwards on the pylons. He could straff them going in with the .50's, and when he pulled out he could just give them a couple bursts with the mini-guns to make them keep down until he got out of range. This guys eyes lit up and said, "What a helluva idea!!." I didn't say anymore, but heard later that he actually tried to get permission to do that, but was denied on the premise that it "hadn't been tested for that configuration."
Nothing more became of it, as the mini-guns didn't hold up well in the environment we were working in.

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Randy Ryman
Project Big Eagle
NKP Thailand 1966
http://www.coastcomp.com/av/florence/florandy.htm

yep, that would be a heck of idea, but probably not hit a thing and only give away your position. So Randy, what was the effect of the climate on the mini's? Was it ever rectified where they would work ok? JR

...................what was the effect of the climate on the mini's?
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Well, the mini-guns were a fairly intricate piece of equipment. Lots of finely machined parts working at high speed. They weren't tolerant of dirt, dust or grime, which was plentiful at NKP. They required a lot of maintenance, parts, etc. This was basically 6 complete guns mounted around a drum, which was rotating inside a cylinder, driven by an electric motor that spun it at 1000rpm. It didn't take much of a malfunction inside for it to self destruct. Aside from the maintenance required, not to mention parts availability, they just weren't worth the effort. The .50 cal. guns, on the other hand, were built like an anvil and were much easier to maintain, and made bigger holes than a 7.62 round.
But, put 3 of the minis on a C-47, and you had something. I was very fortunate to get to see a live fire demo of one of the first AC-47's at one of the Eglin ranges on a cold December night in 1965, just before being transferred to England AFB. Pitch dark on the range, and they had previously naped an area on the range for the gunship to aim on. We heard the drone of the engines as they went into their orbit, then this bright red light came to the ground. It was one of the most impressive sights I saw during my enlistment. The 4/1 tracers from 3 guns made it look like a solid red light. There were lots of facts/rumors of the AC-47's, but they told us that in one pass over the area the size of a football field they could put a bullet in every square foot of it. Doesn't leave much room to hide!

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Randy Ryman
Project Big Eagle
NKP Thailand 1966
http://www.coastcomp.com/av/florence/florandy.htm