Wed Nov 12, 2008 8:55 pm
As a follow-on to the moderation of forums, I dropped the SAH forum, as I worked a regular job and couldn't keep up with the spam postings, especially when I went somewhere (air shows) for the weekends. Most people that run forums, usually work for a living, and can't watch the forum every minute, and stuff can get out of hand very quickly. Scott (AeroVintage) has done the repairs that he can as mentioned above and runs a good website, with a wealth of information especially on the heavy metal, that is regularly linked here as a reliable source.
Try and remember moderators usually don't live on their computers, and as I've seen people get excited here on WIX as to why the "moderator doesn't do something" they may not have time to follow every posting word for word.
Try and remember moderators usually don't live on their computers, and as I've seen people get excited here on WIX as to why the "moderator doesn't do something" they may not have time to follow every posting word for word.
Wed Nov 12, 2008 9:01 pm
You know, It's not so much the politics that is the problem. It's the assumption that it's okay to throw insulting terms about and that because it's politics it's okay or that because you think an insulting term describes someone well it means they want you to call them that word.
There is a difference between saying that welfare is bad and that you are opposed to the democratic party because they support welfare-and saying that democrats are socialists and rabble rousers and playing class warfare. I'm not sure that it even occurs to many posters taht what they are saying is in fact extremely insulting. They just hear what their favorite tv pundits are saying and repeat them. And when asked not to they shrug and think "Glenn Beck said it so it must be true and therefore this guy is just throwing a hissyfit"
It is unfortunate but true that it is not politics that arouse anger, but the bloody minded insistence on using insulting language even in the face of requests to not use that language that is the real problem.My general rule of thumb is this: If what I am saying would get me in a physical fight in real life, were I to call someone that word in a bar, I probably should not say it in here. But this is the internet, and as Bill has noted, it is all to easy to hide behind a screen name.
Personal attacks of any sort should be discouraged (ie punished), and the definition of personal attack is far broader than most people want to acknowledge. It's not the politics that hurt. It's claiming those who have a political view are bad people that hurts.
As difficult as it is to digest, Barack Obama is not a traitor because he happens to be black, or because he believes in spreading the wealth. You gain absolutely nothing by suggesting that he is. And John MCCain is not an evil man because he is a republican and believes that an equally shared tax burden is the best means to a successful country. When you attack Obama for his beliefs, then you are attacking me when I believe the same things he does and should therefore be careful in the language you chose to describe his beliefs and him, as you are also attacking me.
Somehow WIXer's either miss or don't care when they are throwing nasty language around, and the only way this will ever be brought under control is by consistent moderation of the forums, or by bannin political talk completely, or by banning repeat offenders.
What I have seen applied elsewhere is this: Any poster can be reported to a mod via the little report post button at the bottom of a post. A reported post suspends posting privs until they are reinstated by a mod. Three strikes earns a permaban. Only registered posters can report posts, and abuse of the report post feature will result in a ban.
This might work here, it being a combination of group enforcement and mod enforcement. The problem of course is that it becomes open to abuse by individuals. and causes the mods a pain in the ass when they have to unlock accidently locked accounts.
There have been no consequences for personal insults being made, I have even pm'd mods and been told basically to pound sand, or ignored.
We're basically back to th libertarian vs liberal issue: Full personal freedom equals abuse of the system, and individuals being hurt. A rigid rules implementation destroys creativity and the relaxed atmosphere necessary for happy posters.
There is a difference between saying that welfare is bad and that you are opposed to the democratic party because they support welfare-and saying that democrats are socialists and rabble rousers and playing class warfare. I'm not sure that it even occurs to many posters taht what they are saying is in fact extremely insulting. They just hear what their favorite tv pundits are saying and repeat them. And when asked not to they shrug and think "Glenn Beck said it so it must be true and therefore this guy is just throwing a hissyfit"
It is unfortunate but true that it is not politics that arouse anger, but the bloody minded insistence on using insulting language even in the face of requests to not use that language that is the real problem.My general rule of thumb is this: If what I am saying would get me in a physical fight in real life, were I to call someone that word in a bar, I probably should not say it in here. But this is the internet, and as Bill has noted, it is all to easy to hide behind a screen name.
Personal attacks of any sort should be discouraged (ie punished), and the definition of personal attack is far broader than most people want to acknowledge. It's not the politics that hurt. It's claiming those who have a political view are bad people that hurts.
As difficult as it is to digest, Barack Obama is not a traitor because he happens to be black, or because he believes in spreading the wealth. You gain absolutely nothing by suggesting that he is. And John MCCain is not an evil man because he is a republican and believes that an equally shared tax burden is the best means to a successful country. When you attack Obama for his beliefs, then you are attacking me when I believe the same things he does and should therefore be careful in the language you chose to describe his beliefs and him, as you are also attacking me.
Somehow WIXer's either miss or don't care when they are throwing nasty language around, and the only way this will ever be brought under control is by consistent moderation of the forums, or by bannin political talk completely, or by banning repeat offenders.
What I have seen applied elsewhere is this: Any poster can be reported to a mod via the little report post button at the bottom of a post. A reported post suspends posting privs until they are reinstated by a mod. Three strikes earns a permaban. Only registered posters can report posts, and abuse of the report post feature will result in a ban.
This might work here, it being a combination of group enforcement and mod enforcement. The problem of course is that it becomes open to abuse by individuals. and causes the mods a pain in the ass when they have to unlock accidently locked accounts.
There have been no consequences for personal insults being made, I have even pm'd mods and been told basically to pound sand, or ignored.
We're basically back to th libertarian vs liberal issue: Full personal freedom equals abuse of the system, and individuals being hurt. A rigid rules implementation destroys creativity and the relaxed atmosphere necessary for happy posters.
Wed Nov 12, 2008 9:07 pm
HO MAN 
you guys are driving me nuts
Thanks
Steve
you guys are driving me nuts
Thanks
Steve
Wed Nov 12, 2008 9:21 pm
Etiquette, politics and racism are one thing but the post in question, which I was unfortunate enough to read, was way wrong. Scary wrong.
Wed Nov 12, 2008 10:18 pm
I didn't see a problem with it, just a little wild. I think ww2 aircraft.net is the best setup, because it has a separate section for politics. It allows everybody to get their anger out, and kind of keeps the rest of it sort of unbiased or wild. I would recommend that for this site, have a separate discussion for politics, and let folks debate the issue in a free but respectful manner.
Wed Nov 12, 2008 10:57 pm
A2C wrote:I didn't see a problem with it, just a little wild. I think ww2 aircraft.net is the best setup, because it has a separate section for politics. It allows everybody to get their anger out, and kind of keeps the rest of it sort of unbiased or wild. I would recommend that for this site, have a separate discussion for politics, and let folks debate the issue in a free but respectful manner.
And while we're at it, let's also have a separate sub-forum to discuss religion, and one for football, one for hockey, one for base-ball, one for ecological themes, one for vegetarians, one for gay and lesbian issues, one for oil and ......
WARBIRD INFORMATION EXCHANGE. The name of the title should be enough to know that nothing else should be discussed here, if it not pertains to warbirds.
A forum that tries to be everything for everybody, will end up being nothing for all.
Saludos,
Tulio
other
Thu Nov 13, 2008 12:03 am
Tulio, maybe there is a website other than WIX right up your alley where you won't be bothered by "base-ball" or people who express and discuss ideas that are different from yours.
And guys, when I wrote about posters using screen names I wasn't really thinking of WIX. If you go on some of the other websites there are enough real nuts to make you wonder a bit about our country. And they are not all right wing, the left has some folks I am not proud of either.
And guys, when I wrote about posters using screen names I wasn't really thinking of WIX. If you go on some of the other websites there are enough real nuts to make you wonder a bit about our country. And they are not all right wing, the left has some folks I am not proud of either.
Thu Nov 13, 2008 12:15 am
Ok that's enough...gee whiz.
Let's stick to airplanes and airplane accessories on the 13 aero sections and stupid fun stuff on the others.
Let's stick to airplanes and airplane accessories on the 13 aero sections and stupid fun stuff on the others.