Fri Jul 06, 2007 7:33 pm
Be careful we don't become victims of the "thought police". With warbirds it is sometimes difficult dealing with the "paint police" however don't show anyone a picture of the statue of David. Was Michelangelo gay??? Don't know but it is art.
We are about to paint my B-26 and it will be to the best of our ability correct per her Korean War compatriot - "Hollywood Hangover"....
and I enjoy warbirds because I can't handle drugs, alcohol, women or reality.......
We are about to paint my B-26 and it will be to the best of our ability correct per her Korean War compatriot - "Hollywood Hangover"....
and I enjoy warbirds because I can't handle drugs, alcohol, women or reality.......
Fri Jul 06, 2007 10:12 pm
I've loved warbirds for as long as I can remember. Unfortunately, one clear memory includes my 6th grade teacher confiscating a B-25 special issue of Wings magazine (with a great story of the original Panchito) because of some nude nose art pictures. I've always been a law-abiding straight shooter, but I admit I snuck into the teacher's lounge later and "stole" my magazine back! There was no way I was parting with the B-25 special issue!
Face it, we (fortunately) live in a free society where others have opinions we don't like and vice versa. Unfortunately, some try to force their opinions and (as an AF C-130 pilot with 5 combat deployments for Bosnia) we who respect the military airplanes for representing their role in the fight for freedom have to remember that defending freedom includes those who express differing opinions. (By the way, the only "nose art" we got away with in the mid 90's was a block letter name carefully applied with 3M masking tape.)
And I have visited air museums in Germany where camo netting was gently draped over the vertical fins of some airplanes to hide the insignia ... but that's not the USA.
Remember, not many folks back home saw nose art in the 40's because there was no internet or fast mode of sending photos; not to mention that the media in those days used discretion and chose not to publish anything too controversial. Think of how few citizens realized that FDR was in a wheelchair because it wasn't publicized!
All that said, I 100% support authenic swastikas and nose art but I can easily understand why they offend people. I only wish those whose freedom I helped defend would respect my opinion as much as I try to respect theirs. The most I'd be willing to do at the NMUSAF (for example) would be to add a sign in the lobby that mentions that those who may be offended should choose not to enter. In the end there are some issues where folks should just "agree to disagree" and move on.
Forgive the length, and thanks for allowing me to share these thoughts. As a final tip of my true hat, see the link below for a wartime photo of my aviation mentor's A-1E in Vietnam. (scroll down to photo #6 on the page) His brief message speaks volumes.
Ken
http://skyraider.org/skyassn/memberpics ... oorter.htm
Face it, we (fortunately) live in a free society where others have opinions we don't like and vice versa. Unfortunately, some try to force their opinions and (as an AF C-130 pilot with 5 combat deployments for Bosnia) we who respect the military airplanes for representing their role in the fight for freedom have to remember that defending freedom includes those who express differing opinions. (By the way, the only "nose art" we got away with in the mid 90's was a block letter name carefully applied with 3M masking tape.)
And I have visited air museums in Germany where camo netting was gently draped over the vertical fins of some airplanes to hide the insignia ... but that's not the USA.
Remember, not many folks back home saw nose art in the 40's because there was no internet or fast mode of sending photos; not to mention that the media in those days used discretion and chose not to publish anything too controversial. Think of how few citizens realized that FDR was in a wheelchair because it wasn't publicized!
All that said, I 100% support authenic swastikas and nose art but I can easily understand why they offend people. I only wish those whose freedom I helped defend would respect my opinion as much as I try to respect theirs. The most I'd be willing to do at the NMUSAF (for example) would be to add a sign in the lobby that mentions that those who may be offended should choose not to enter. In the end there are some issues where folks should just "agree to disagree" and move on.
Forgive the length, and thanks for allowing me to share these thoughts. As a final tip of my true hat, see the link below for a wartime photo of my aviation mentor's A-1E in Vietnam. (scroll down to photo #6 on the page) His brief message speaks volumes.
Ken
http://skyraider.org/skyassn/memberpics ... oorter.htm
Fri Jul 06, 2007 10:23 pm
When we toured with the Yellow Rose, we always at every airshow have a woman come up to us and chew the fat about our nose air. But we also had a couple come up and ask if we mind them takling a photo on the other side from us and also asked us not to come around until they were done 
We wanted to judge for ourselves if she was as good as our girl, but they said no 
You hear it all the time at airshow. People just don't understand what it was like then, being so far from home during a war.
Lynn
We wanted to judge for ourselves if she was as good as our girl, but they said no You hear it all the time at airshow. People just don't understand what it was like then, being so far from home during a war.
Lynn
Sat Jul 07, 2007 1:25 am
Think of how few citizens realized that FDR was in a wheelchair because it wasn't publicized!
Back in the 40's it was PC to smoke so pics of FDR show him smoking but no wheelchair. Jump to today and PC has FDR statue in a wheelchair but not smoking?
I always think I'll go to his statue and put a cigarette in his mouth
but some PC person would probably get me arrested. 
Phil
Sat Jul 07, 2007 1:33 am
My late father-in-law was a combat crewman on B-17's and he said they loved nose art in all forms. Also brought 'home' to the war zones.....
Madonna can tell the world about taking a pee in the shower on Letterman and we don't see the TV channel being shut down...
Madonna can tell the world about taking a pee in the shower on Letterman and we don't see the TV channel being shut down...
Sat Jul 07, 2007 8:56 am
A response to Air Marshall Paul:
This p/c BS is not coming from those who read and believe in the Bible, far from it. It's coming from those who are way left of center and have way too much time on their hands. These are the same people who
look for ways to be offended and then drive to Burger King and dump hot coffee on themselves and yell law suit. Todays society is full of mindless people (usefull idiots) waiting each day for their mailman to drop a free check in their mailbox paid for by the very people who fought so hard to protect their right to be idiots!
Jake Fendermen
This p/c BS is not coming from those who read and believe in the Bible, far from it. It's coming from those who are way left of center and have way too much time on their hands. These are the same people who
look for ways to be offended and then drive to Burger King and dump hot coffee on themselves and yell law suit. Todays society is full of mindless people (usefull idiots) waiting each day for their mailman to drop a free check in their mailbox paid for by the very people who fought so hard to protect their right to be idiots!
Jake Fendermen
Sat Jul 07, 2007 10:53 am
Sometimes it is a Christian thing, and other times, there's another reason altogether: Some people don't want their three-year olds seeing this kind of stuff, and for a good reason, I think. Toddlers don't need to be exposed to sex-related things, like, at all. Psychologically it's unhealthy.
Sat Jul 07, 2007 11:34 pm
uh oh. Better send someone off to New Guinea to make sure all those poor people know that they're damaging their children., And Africa. And Asia...
I can almost promise that your toddlers aren't going to be damaged for life if they learn about sex by seeing it. At least, that's based on the experiences of 95% of the rest of the human beings on this planet so far
I can almost promise that your toddlers aren't going to be damaged for life if they learn about sex by seeing it. At least, that's based on the experiences of 95% of the rest of the human beings on this planet so far
Tue Jul 10, 2007 4:52 am
Yeah, I can see a toddler seeing some nude nose art being traumatized for life Their is nothing sexual about nudity. Everyone is born nude! It's not like nose-art is porrnn! All the people offended by it should lighten up as far as I'm concerned.
oh, and about the Swastika:
Their is nothing sexual about nudity. Everyone is born nude! It's not like nose-art is porrnn! All the people offended by it should lighten up as far as I'm concerned.
oh, and about the Swastika: