Warbird Information Exchange

I don't think it is really a point of accepting a bribe to move things forward, rather if someone is willing to make a donation that is specifically targeted for a restoration that allows them to dedicate resources to that restoration that would have not have been available otherwise.

That could be. I just hate the fact that two aircraft Flakbait and Swoose are in pieces and not displayed together. The funny thing is that when the Udvar Hazy Facility was first opening, the posters that showed the interior of the building showed a B-25, B-25, and Swoose all in the there.

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Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Director

That's not the point. It's the NATIONAL Air & Space Museum...not the International A&SM.
I don't think it's too much to ask that they restore the sole early surviving B-17...and one with a real combat history.

(IMHO, the Japanese seaplane should probably be in Japan where it wil be better appreciated rather than glanced at by the the majority of the people who go to the NASM.)

I appreciate the need to show aviation progress from around the world, but in my not so humble opinion, the NASM has long been a bit ashamed of US military aircraft.
I'm not a uber nationalist when it comes to planes, but it seems really nuts that the U-H Annex has (i'll pick one example) a Westland Lysander (a plane that means nothing to the US in WWII...sorry JDK ) and not the B-17 or B-26.

It will take some talking to convince me that there isn't a deep rooted prejudice against US military aircraft in that organization.

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Remember the vets, the wonderful planes they flew and their sacrifices for a future many of them did not live to see.

I love the NASM , and I think that they have some really great aircraft in the collection. But I also believe in the words that Mr. Boyle wrote. I don't have a problem with the Lysander or Japanese float plane, but I do think that they are not proud of their U.S. military aircraft. The Enola Gay scandal is a prime example. Now I know that they have corrected the problem on that display, but not all together. Remeber the thread about Ollie North not allowed to film in front of the b-29. He came to the NMUSAF and used Bockscar instead. The NASM has done a ton of good, and has some amazing aircraft in their buildings, but there are some issues for sure there.

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Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Director

As for the Fw190D-9 and D-13. The opposite wings did stay on the airframes past their test lives. The D-9, which now lives in the USAFM, had the wings of the D-13. Champlin acquired the D-13 and she had the D-9 wings. During the re-restoration of the D-13, the wing swap was accomplished. If anyone really looks at the D-9 in the USAFM, you'll notice that they have not repainted the wing to match the fuselage. It is the paint from the original Champlin restoration.

BTW, RE-ASSEMBLE THE SWOOSE!!!

The NASM has a great collection and a first rate restoration division but sadly they have a "liberal agenda" (the Enola Gay display fiasco is one example of this) and lean toward the Axis aircraft as their restoration priorities. It would seem that only public outcry or large wallets push certain projects to the front of the line...

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"Everyone wants to live here (New Jersey), evidenced by the fact that it has the highest population per capita in the U.S..."

Hello,

I think there has been unreasonable and sometimes hypocritical criticism directed at NASM over Swoose. Kindly remember that Swoose, Enola Gay, Flak Bait and all those German and Japanese aircraft were set aside for long term preservation at a time when both the Air Force and Navy set aside NOTHING. The USAFM - now NMAF - has a long history prior to 1955 of displaying aircraft and then scrapping them because it would take resources to put them inot storage. Even to this day, many of the rarest and most historic aircraft in the Navy and Air Force museums are there because they were preserved by the Smithsonian. The list of examples that I could give would be a long one.

NASM deserves considerable credit for this. What it gets is a lot of criticism because all those aircraft that have been set aside for preservation are not being restored RIGHT NOW.

The reason as I understand it that the Swoose has not been restored yet is that that restoration would take all of NASM's resources for multiple years. The Swoose was used hard and then spent too many years outdoors among the weather and vandals. It will require a full restoration that will probably take more manhours than did the Enola Gay. For the present, NASM is concentrating on reducing the backlog of other aircraft to get Udvar Hazy closer to being full. This is a reasonable decision given the immensity of the collection and their various cost and other constraints.

Once the UDVAR Hazy Center is more full and their new restoration is built it is my understanding that the Swoose will quickly rise to the top of the restoration list. The result ultimately will be a superb - world class- restoration that will be worth the wait. So be patient, the aircraft is not being destroyed in the meantime. It is true that it would be nice to see this aircraft restored while its original crew members are still alive, but this can be said for a lot of the NASM aircraft.

The criticism concerning Flak Bait is also undue. The forward fuselage has been on display at the main museum since 1976, where you can get very close to the original markings and actually look into the cockpit area. True, this is not the whole aircraft, but it makes for a very intimate display. Flak Bait has been in more-or-less continuous indoor storage since WWII and it is reasonable that resources be devoted to aircraft that are more rapidly deteriorating.

The tone of some of the WIX messages is almost villification, as if the NASM is the bad boy on the aircraft restoration scene. Instead, NASM has set the standard for preservation and restoration, and as such is to some degree responsible for the fine restorations now being done at other museums. Rather than accuse NASM, why not work to raise money, either for their new restoration building or for the restoration of the aircaft of your choice. It seems to me to be a more constructive course of action.

Kevin
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Kevin McCartney

The Swoose did indeed spend a lot of time out doors, and being picked over by vandals. This was while the aircraft was under the control of the NASM. Their Connie is now being restored, but when it arrived, it flew in. They let it sit outside untouched for all of that time. When the Enola Gay was going to be put back together, they asked the NMUSAF to kick in funds to rebuild it! I have a problem with a museum that has had an aircraft since the 50's, and have not done anything to restore it. Has anyone even seen the wings in the last 50 years?

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Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Director

If the NASM is planning on holding off on the Swoose for a decade or more I would like to see it just assembled and on display at Udvar Hazy. I think that would even generate some interest for large donations towards that restoration and it would give people and interesting look at what the NASM frequently has to start with in a restoration and give a better understanding of just how much work and costs are involved in a restoration. Perhaps we should start a letter writing campaign to urge them to get the aircraft on display, whatever the state. I think a large amount of courteous letters that indicate interest in the project may get them thinking about getting the aircraft assembled and on display.

Is there anything else left of flak bait or is it just the cockpit area?

They have the entire aircraft...

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"Everyone wants to live here (New Jersey), evidenced by the fact that it has the highest population per capita in the U.S..."

I think it comes down to miss-information. It seems the general public don't care about early war aircraft. All they want to hear about is P-51's.

Had the swoose been a "G" model I am sure it would have been restored 20 years ago.

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Shop the Airplane Bunker At
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Well I don't know. The NASM has a G model as well, and the NASM told me that there are no plans to ever display it.

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Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Director

If they're aren't ever going to display the G model, why don't they sell it and apply the resulting funds to restoring the Swoose ? Oh wait it's a govt entity and here I am applying logic again ! What was I thinking !

I hear you. I mean the way it was sent to me in the e-mail response I got from them is that there are no plans to ever display the G model. I wasn't even thinking that far ahead, but I was atleast thinking that they could loan it out to another museum that can care for a B-17. Give it to Kalamazoo or someone.

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Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Director