Warbird Information Exchange

For USAF C-17 Globemaster flight testing out of Long Beach, the military registration was used. For foreign customers (UK, Canada, Australia, NAMP, UAE, Kuwait, Qatar & India), N-Number registrations were applied. Upon delivery, the aircraft were deregistered in the US system.

https://registry.faa.gov/aircraftinquir ... rTxt=171UK and https://registry.faa.gov/aircraftinquir ... rTxt=272ZD for example. Not 3 digits though!

So, we have managed to stump the FAA. I emailed their chief historian, Terry Kraus, and she was intrigued, but unable to find anything. She pulled in the staff at the aircraft registry branch and they were fascinated as well, but also came up empty handed. There were no make/model/series codes (MMSC) for a "G-36" or "Martlet" and the only "F4F" was BuNo 12260 from the National Museum of Naval Aviation. Although they had other Martin models on file, there was no "Model 187" or "Baltimore".

I think there may be a few avenues to pursue:

• Although they have seemingly exhausted their records, the aircraft registry branch left open the possibility that they might be able to discover additional records with more detailed aircraft identification. Specifically, manufacturer's serial numbers. Does anyone know where I might be able to find a list of either Grumman G-36/Martlet/Wildcat or Martin 187/Baltimore construction numbers? I was thinking possibly the Glenn L. Martin Maryland Aviation Museum.
• One of the individuals in the aircraft registry branch suggested contacting a man from Europe named Barry Collman who had come to them multiple times a year to do research and they regarded as very knowledgeable. Does anyone have his contact information?
• The records of the British Air Commission exist in the British National Archives.
• The Fleet Air Arm Museum has Martlet AL246, the sole surviving airframe from the "AL" batch. Perhaps they would know more.

Finally, could someone clarify something for me? What model is NXM53? The caption for the picture in the original post calls it a "Baltimore III" - a Model 187. However, the source M-62 included in his post claims it is a "Maryland II" - a Model 167. A profile comparison supports the former, so is the Martin Aircraft book wrong?

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Well done on catching the interest of the FAA's historians.

Finally, could someone clarify something for me? What model is NXM53? The caption for the picture in the original post calls it a "Baltimore III" - a Model 187. However, the source M-62 included in his post claims it is a "Maryland II" - a Model 167. A profile comparison supports the former, so is the Martin Aircraft book wrong?

To clarify and expand on my earlier reply.

"Martin Aircraft 1909 - 1960" includes the following photographs:
Page 85. NXM36 - the first 167-B4 (Maryland II, AH280).
Page 88. Five of the thirty-five 167-B3s completed in July 1940 with British equipment and designated Maryland I. Wearing temporary NXM registrations, they await shipment via Canada.
Pages 124 & 125. NXM43 - the first 187-B1 (Baltimore I).
Page 126. NXM53 - Baltimore III with Boulton-Paul four gun turret.

Hope this helps, M-62A

It does indeed help. Not just in terms of clarification, but confirmation of additional three letter registrations (TLRs) that can be correlated with manufacturer's/military serial numbers means more data points and potential hits. Thanks!

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Tri-State Warbird Museum Collections Manager & Museum Attendant

Warbird Philosophy Webmaster

I was just perusing my copy of North American's T-6: A Definitive History of the World's Most Famous Trainer today and I came across this interesting picture and caption that hints at a potentially larger trend:

(Source: Dan Hagedorn, North American’s T-6: A Definitive History of the World’s Most Famous Trainer (North Branch, MN: Specialty Press, 2009), 62.)

On a slightly different, but still related, subject I was reading through the Vultee XA-41 Wikipedia article the other day and I noticed this sentence:

(Source: Wikipedia)

Even without the "X" in the second position, NX60373N is not possible under current format rules, which limit registrations to six characters (or five, if you don't count the initial "N"). Can anyone confirm this registration or is it a typo?

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Tri-State Warbird Museum Collections Manager & Museum Attendant

Warbird Philosophy Webmaster

N[X]60373 has been reported (and makes sense), but I can find no photographic evidence of either.

After studying these aircraft and their expanded family for 60 years, I have to admit that the Harvard caption from Dan Hagedorn's book threw me for a loop, because I had never seen that apparent situation before. However, I'm afraid that after a few minutes with photoshop and paint shop pro, it is obvious that the underside of the wing shows N7000. There is no X. I wonder if the author grabbed the wrong image? At least this has given me something to search out...just when you think you're retired!

Doug

Check your mid-70s Air Classics - the "Things with Wings" feature had a photo of the XA-41 at Pratt and Whitney along with a civil marked Vought Vindicator; both were later scrapped .

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All right, Mister Dorfmann, start pullin'!
Pilot: "Flap switch works hard in down position."
Mechanic: "Flap switch checked OK. Pilot needs more P.T." - Flight report, TB-17G 42-102875 (Hobbs AAF)

A little off topic, but the other day I came across a picture of an F6F-5 marked as "NF6F-5" and "V94286":

(Source: Francis H. Dean, America’s Hundred Thousand: U.S. Production Fighters of World War Two (Atglen, Pennsylvania: Schiffer Publishing, 1997), 575.)

This is interesting, because the "N" status prefix for permanently modified test aircraft was a USAF convention that did not appear on Navy aircraft. (In addition, the earliest instance of an "N" prefix I could find after a quick search was an NC-121K so designated in September 1962, so it may have come in with the tri-service sequence introduced that year.[1] For more on the origins of status prefixes, see a post in another thread.)

It reminded me of a post on one of Tommy H. Thomason's blogs that shows an F-84 with similar markings:

(Source: U.S. Navy Aircraft History)

Making the connection even more intriguing is that Mr. Thomason makes the supposition that the F-84s were acquired to replace F6F-5K target drones. So, it's very likely that the same organization that was responsible for the markings on the NF6F-5 also painted the F-84.

So, while they're not technically registrations, they do fall into the category of "multiple instances of odd identification markings on American-built military aircraft".

EDIT (24-12-03): Another couple aircraft with the "N" prefix, in this case NFG-1Ds, show up in a post about US Naval Air Reserve markings by Dana Bell.

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Tri-State Warbird Museum Collections Manager & Museum Attendant

Warbird Philosophy Webmaster

The 'X' on the F-84 in this case is an indicator of test status; FJ-3D2s were likewise referred to (and recorded as) "FJ-3D2X" prior to delivery. It seems to be a Navy quirk, and a means of identifying a non-Navy aircraft - K meaning drone and the 'X' as explained.

To build off of this one, Mayborn suggests a similar reasoning:

(Source: Mitch Mayborn, Grumman Guidebook, vol. 1, American Aircraft 4 (Dallas, Texas: Flying Enterprise Publications, 1976), 35.)

Also, to throw in a minor detail, the aircraft apparently lost the hyphen in the registration when the order was taken over by the British and they were repainted. Compare a picture of NX-G1 in French markings with the pictures in the initial post in this thread.

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Tri-State Warbird Museum Collections Manager & Museum Attendant

Warbird Philosophy Webmaster