Warbird Information Exchange

Spitfire PL965 is another which flies today with an engine that is original to its wartime service.

Glad to see the interest and discussion! Many good ideas, a lot of Spitfires which makes sense. If those lost Spitfires in the crates conspiracy is actually true, that would forever change the idea of authentic and flying.

How original are some of the other POF rarities? P-26, AT-12, Dauntless?... I remember seeing a lot of older pictures of these in the 70's, were they restored prior to those pictures?

Historically important though?

FHCAM Fw190A-5, very original (down to 90% of the skins) and a combat veteran - edit, I see John has already mentioned it.

Used to be able to delete posts if you caught them prior to someone else responding, dunno why not now....

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Just throwing this out there for conversation sake. How about the one aircraft that is a PH survivor that was being worked on at American Aero?

The other thought would be the WW1 survivors. This book claims there are over 300 of them out there.

World War I Survivors
Ray Rimell
Aston Publications, Ltd,

ISBN 0 946627 44 4

The other very famous aircraft not a flyer is the NC-4 at the P-Cola Museum.

Talking most original AIRWORTHY WWI, the only ones I can think of are TVAL and Guy Black's Camels, IIRC they have substantial original parts. Also the TVAL Hanriot HD1, once part of Shuttleworth and the RAFM.

I think the last relatively complete original to fly was the LVG out of Shuttleworth, but it is grounded now.

Not sure about others, any Great War aviation Gurus out there?

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Not a guru, but that 300 figure had my eyebrows in the roof! I can't think of any flying WW1 veterans with history but there are a few static museum examples with history: the Be.2 in the UK Imperial War Museum and (though not a flyer) Barker's VC-mission Snipe in Canada being two.

'Bout 10 yrs back there were some folks who would post especially flammable taunts and when the fire was well onto its predictable path, would go back and delete their post. "Wha? I dunno what that guys all jacked about..."
IIRC, for awhile we lost the ability to edit our posts, but the privilege eventually returned.

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He bowls overhand...He is the most interesting man in the world.
"In Peace Japan Breeds War", Eckstein, Harper and Bros., 3rd ed. 1943(1927, 1928,1942)
"Leave it to ol' Slim. I got ideas...and they're all vile, baby." South Dakota Slim
"Ahh..."The Deuce", 28,000 pounds of motherly love." quote from some Mojave Grunt
DBF

That 'pleading of innocence' only worked if the quote button wasn't used, which usually was in such stouches

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Yup, and tho they deleted it from public view, Scott could still see the original.

_________________
He bowls overhand...He is the most interesting man in the world.
"In Peace Japan Breeds War", Eckstein, Harper and Bros., 3rd ed. 1943(1927, 1928,1942)
"Leave it to ol' Slim. I got ideas...and they're all vile, baby." South Dakota Slim
"Ahh..."The Deuce", 28,000 pounds of motherly love." quote from some Mojave Grunt
DBF

Personally, I think not enough care is being given to the rarity of the aircraft in its importance. Just because it had a combat history doesn't make it more important than an earlier example

While I'm particularly fond of the story of Diamond Lil, the fact that most her contributions were important "adjacent" (being a testbed that never directly led to any definitive variant) makes her a hard sell beyond her longevity and originality (though modified, those mods were done by the factory, so it's still "original" in that no post-factory modification has been done to the airplane, only de-modification). However, being among the first 25 aircraft built, being a (techinically) pre-production airplane, and the afore mentioned lack of major restoration (against all the other aircraft mentioned which have all seen at least one multi-year major restoration in their history), still puts her up there.

I would also add Cavanaugh's B-25 "How 'Boot That?" with 80+ combat missions, a role in "Catch 22", and now stored airworthy with nose art done by its original painter as a non-fighter worthy of consideration. Much as Cavanaugh stopped flying its CASA 2.111 after the CAF's crashed, the only reason the plane isn't flying is because the airplane is considered by Mr. Cavanaugh and the team at the museum to be too valuable to risk damage from flying.

Another I'd consider as important is Collings' B-24J. It did see combat in the Pacific with the RAF during WWII, then saw service with the Indian Air Force into the late 1960s. It's also one of only 2 airworthy B-24s in the world and one of only 13 surviving restored aircraft, which are 0.07% of all B-24s ever built.

Finally, I'd like to give some love to the BBMF Lancaster. While built too late for combat, it did see post-war service as a Photo Reconnaisance aircraft before being loaned to several government contractors, including Flight Refuelling Ltd, and being a testbed. Returned to RAF service in 1964, it's served continuously since, making it one of the longest serving active duty aircraft in the world (I believe BBMF's Photo Spit PM631 is the longest having returned to active duty in 1957 while also having been built in 1945).

One to add to the list of airworthy WW I aircraft is Sopwith Pup N6161, recently flown again at Duxford.

TVAL own operate a Bristol Fighter (formerly with Shuttleworth) which was originally manufactured in 1917 and flew with RFC No.13 Sqdn. (at least the fuselage is of that provenance).

All are pretty original with respect to the structure. None have original radios.

The Dauntless is a combat veteran with service in New Zealand. When it was restored there were still shells and links buried in the dirt in the rear fuselage. The wings came from different combat veteran Dauntlesses (South Pacific recoveries?) and were mostly reskinned. It was restored in the early 1980s.

Surprised that there’s been no mention of That’s All Brother. I would think she’d definitely make a Top Five list of historically important flying warbirds.