Warbird Information Exchange

DISCLAIMER: The views expressed on this site are the responsibility of the poster and do not reflect the views of the management.
It is currently Wed May 14, 2025 4:03 pm

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Classic Wings Magazine WWII Naval Aviation Research Pacific Luftwaffe Resource Center
When Hollywood Ruled The Skies - Volumes 1 through 4 by Bruce Oriss


Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 35 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: For Beaufighter Fans
PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 4:00 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jul 18, 2007 12:15 am
Posts: 113
Location: Australia
Hello TriangleP,

I thought you might like to know a little about Harold Thomas. The late Harold Thomas was one of the earliest pioneers of Australian aviation preservation setting up the Camden Aviation Museum in New South Wales around the same time as the Australian Aircraft Restoration Group established the Moorabbin Air Museum. He was, however, an aviation treasure in his own right. As a young man he was the first apprentice of Australian National Airways, the airline set up by Charles Kingsford Smith and Charles Ulm. I only ever met him once; not that long before he passed away. He was a truly fascinating character.

Keith Gaff


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: For Beaufighter Fans
PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 4:00 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jul 18, 2007 12:15 am
Posts: 113
Location: Australia
Hello TriangleP,

I thought you might like to know a little about Harold Thomas. The late Harold Thomas was one of the earliest pioneers of Australian aviation preservation setting up the Camden Aviation Museum in New South Wales around the same time as the Australian Aircraft Restoration Group established the Moorabbin Air Museum. He was, however, an aviation treasure in his own right. As a young man he was the first apprentice of Australian National Airways, the airline set up by Charles Kingsford Smith and Charles Ulm. I only ever met him once; not that long before he passed away. He was a truly fascinating character.

Keith Gaff


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: For Beaufighter Fans
PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 1:44 pm 
Offline
1000+ Posts!
1000+ Posts!
User avatar

Joined: Wed May 05, 2004 8:03 pm
Posts: 1081
Location: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada
...And thanks to Mr Thomas' preservation of not one but two ex-RAN Firefly 6s, we here in Ontario have the privilege from time to time of seeing and hearing WH632 in action. She came to CWH from Camden in 1979 to replace the (also ex-RAN) WD901 which had crashed in 1977. There ought to be a book written about the early visionary Warbird collectors such as Mr Thomas...

Keep the Beau pix coming. I really like Beaux and would very much like to see one in the air someday...one of those tremendously capable and significant combat birds that seem to have gotten short shrift in more recent times.

S.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: For Beaufighter Fans
PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 7:24 pm 
Offline
2000+ Post Club
2000+ Post Club

Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2012 7:26 pm
Posts: 2047
Location: Creemore Ontario Canada
Thanks for the cool beaufighter shots keith! They're BEAUtiful! (sorry, couldn't resist)
This machine has been under appreciated and not widely known unfortunately. Too bad 'cause they look all business.
"Two engines hotly pursued by an aeroplane"
Another bit of Canadian info is that the Beau in the national collection in Ottawa sat outside for decades due to not enough storage space. :(
As far as the prospect of a Bristol twin returning to flight, the safest bet will be the Beaufort, Bolingbroke and I guess the Blenheim Mk1. Not sure what order I'd place my bet though.... Hmm...
Some great projects out there.
Thanks again Keith!

Andy Scott


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: For Beaufighter Fans
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 12:03 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jul 18, 2007 12:15 am
Posts: 113
Location: Australia
Hello Andy,

My guess for order of first flight would be the aircraft below. This is DAP Beaufort A9-141 which is being rebuilt to fly by Ralph Cusack in Queensland. This is quite a project and will be something to see when it gets into the air.

Keith Gaff

Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: For Beaufighter Fans
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 3:44 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 17, 2004 8:33 am
Posts: 474
Keith i think the Blenheim will easily beat Ron's Beaufort..the talk is late this year!!! i dont thin Ron is that close,but i really look forward to his finished restoration...not confidant that we'll ever see a beaufighter as much as i love them.
anyone know whats going on with the Texas Beaufort?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: For Beaufighter Fans
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 4:47 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jul 18, 2007 12:15 am
Posts: 113
Location: Australia
Hello Oz rb fan,

I haven'y much of the Blenheim project for some time so it's nice to hear that it's tracking nicely. I have to agree with you; I see no prospect of an airworthy Beaufighter, the problems are just too great. I too would like to hear what's happening with the Beauforts that went to America.

Regards,

Keith Gaff


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: For Beaufighter Fans
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 8:18 pm 
Offline
2000+ Post Club
2000+ Post Club

Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2012 7:26 pm
Posts: 2047
Location: Creemore Ontario Canada
Agreed Keith
A9-141 is going to be a stunner! Thanks for the shot. I wasn't aware the Blenheim was that close to flight either. Best of luck to all.
I remember containers of Bolingbrokes being unloaded at CWH in Hamilton. Probably about 20+ years ago :shock: . She is finally on her gear but I wouldn't dare guess on a first flight date.
Each of them will fly, when they are ready :wink:

Andy Scott


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: For Beaufighter Fans
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 11:03 pm 
Offline
3000+ Post Club
3000+ Post Club

Joined: Thu Dec 21, 2006 8:32 am
Posts: 4324
Location: Battle Creek, MI
The only one I'll likely ever see in the air is the CWH Bolly. Been following that restoration for over a decade, and really looking forward to seeing her fly. If she comes out as well as the Lysander, she'll be a real stunner!

Here's the most recent pic I have, taken the day after she was put back in the barn after the airshow last June. I don't know how much progress has been made since then. I've always loved that funky "sunken" nose glazing.

SN

Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: For Beaufighter Fans
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 12:09 am 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Fri Apr 30, 2004 7:13 pm
Posts: 5663
Location: Minnesota, USA
Keith Gaff wrote:
I see no prospect of an airworthy Beaufighter, the problems are just too great...



Seriously?


Image


Just lop off the QECs, props, and spinners from a CASA 2111 and let's go flying!


Image

_________________
It was a good idea, it just didn't work.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: For Beaufighter Fans
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 9:19 am 
Offline
2000+ Post Club
2000+ Post Club

Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2012 7:26 pm
Posts: 2047
Location: Creemore Ontario Canada
Dan I love the way you embody the true spirit of your avatar! That's commitment.
This is a good Idea that would work! Nevermind all that engineering and legal nonsense :lol:

On the CWH front. I think they have decided to go with Bristol Mercury engines. I say this because they had explored the possibility of using Twin Wasp Juniors. There were some Boly's that flew with these, out of Hamilton even.
Alas, these are even harder to find than Merc's.

Andy Scott


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: For Beaufighter Fans
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 4:13 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Dec 11, 2012 7:13 pm
Posts: 26
Yeah, let's hear more about the Texas Beaufort...status, location, shop, etc.?

TXCOMT


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: For Beaufighter Fans
PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2013 5:07 am 
Offline
1000+ Posts!
1000+ Posts!
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jul 11, 2004 4:55 pm
Posts: 1105
Location: Australia
Keith Gaff wrote:
I too would like to hear what's happening with the Beauforts that went to America.




TXCOMT wrote:
Yeah, let's hear more about the Texas Beaufort...status, location, shop, etc.?

TXCOMT



Without hijacking this Beaufighter thread into a Beaufort thread I understand the major components of 5 Beauforts along with some additional sections were recovered by Charles Darby and Monty Armstrong as part of a recovery project for Dave Tallichet from Aitape/Tadji in the mid 1970s' which also included an A-20, P-40s and P-39s, These were believed to include major and minor sections from at least T9552/A9-13, A9-182, A9-210, A9-414, A9-535, A9-555, A9-557, A9-559, A9-574 and A9-637, however the aggregate still rreally only amounted to enough components that could form the basis of 5 projects.

This is well covered in Charles Darby's book "Pacific Aircraft Wrecks and where to find them."



http://www.pacificwrecks.com/airfields/ ... index.html

"two" of those Beauforts came to Australia rather than the USA and are DAP Mark V, T9552/A9-13 now at Moorabbin and DAP Mark VIII, A9-557 now in the AWM.

Of the "three" that went to the USA and were stored for a long time at Chino,

"The First" set of US parts were restored and swapped along with a P40N for Spitfire RAF gate guardians, and is now in the RAF Museum at Hendon displayed as RAF s/n DD931 a Bristol built mark 11A, but largely a hybrid of Australian DAP built mark VIII components primarily from A9-559 but also A9-478.


"The Second" set of US parts is with Graham Kilsby of the Bristol Heritage Collection in Tennessee USA, (not Texas), this is all DAP mark VIII material consisting of A9-555 cockpit and centre/rear fuselage, wing centre-section from A9-182, two stern fuselages from A9-182 and A9-574, along with wings etc and a very damaged centre/rear fuselage from A9-414.

Although this was reported to be the basis of an airworthy restoration and it was reported that work had commenced in 2003 with Stripmasters in Tennessee bead blasting the components and then the Nashville Technical College, its understood it was later relocated to Hohenwald Tennessee in 2005 and I havent seen any update on its progress since.

A very straight but very stripped hulk with all the major components, and there were many parts not with the hulks when recovered from Tadji, that would be hard to acquire in the USA today.

Image

Image


"The Third" set of US parts, I understand, was acquired and returned to Australia and were consumed into both the Ralph Cusack airworthy restoration (centre/rear fuselage and wing outers??) and the AWM restoration (cockpit, wing centre-section and stern fuselage) where by the AWM aquired the additional cockpit to support their own aircraft's cockpit restoration and the additional wing centre-section and additional stern fuselage to actually restore and incorporate in the restored aircraft to allow it to be restored back up onto its undercarriage etc. The original wing centre-section and stern fuselage from A9-557 are also retained by the AWM, but are still badly damaged by the aircraft's wartime forced landing and crash into jeeps and hospital, and are stored "as found" for future research of the entire airframe, which therefore consists of the conserved A9-557 and with restored replacement components discussed above, along of course with the stored original damaged parts, and the remains of the additional cockpit.

Ralph's original airframe A9-141, as acquired from Pearce Dunn in Mildura and was originally recovered from the Nhill district in Victoria, consisted of a cockpit, wing centre-section and centre/rear fuselage and stern fuselage (all war surplus in Australia, and nothing at all to do with the Aitape recoveries from PNG). However the Centre-Rear fuselage (from A9-230), was badly damaged on one side, and there were no wing outer panels, no fin etc.

Ralphs aircraft, while still identified as A9-141 a DAP Mark VII, had acquired the centre fuselage from DAP Mark VIII, A9-230 during a wartime repair. It now contains the cockpit and wing centre-section from A9-141, the centre-rear fuselage from DAP Mark VIII A9-689 and stern fuselage from A9-485.

Ralphs surplus material was acquired in 2004 by the AARG at Moorabbin to commence collecting towards an eventual Beaufort static restoration, including the restored cockpit of DAP Mark VII A9-150 which had originally being in the AARG collection in the 1970's. That material will now support the restoration of DAP Mark V T9952/A9-13.

So we are still heading for 5 complete Beauforts world wide, 3 in Australia, 1 in the UK and currently 1 in the USA, with 4 of those being recovered ex-PNG, and at least 1, possibly 2 flying, and the 5th recovery from PNG being consumed to support other restorations.

Of course the Beaufort with its P&W 1830's is a lot simplier to get airworthy in terms of engine issues as compared with the Beaufighter, however, while Ralph's aircraft is approaching flight, it has required a lot of work and a lot of substitute and additional parts to get it there, and I'm not sure how suitable the Tennessee components are for an airworthy restoration, and the Tadji recoveries were of very stripped hulks, and in fact while its a restored museum display, the RAF Museums example is largely still a stripped fuselage internally.


Graham Kilsby apparantly started the Bristol Aero Collection in the UK in 1988, (I assume he is of british origin?) and over the years has attempted to acquire a Bristol Freighter for that UK collection as well as since donating a Bolingbroke for static restoration to it, and so it is possible that his Beaufort project currently in the US may well end up with that collection in the UK as a static restoration in the longer term as well?


Scott has recently added the Beaufort type to the WIX Warbird Directory.

http://www.warbirdregistry.org/beaufortregistry/beaufortregistry.html

Regards

Mark Pilkington

_________________
20th Century - The Age of Manned Flight
"from Wrights to Armstrong in 66 years -WOW!"


Last edited by Mark_Pilkington on Sat Jan 12, 2013 7:51 am, edited 6 times in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: For Beaufighter Fans
PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2013 6:10 am 
Offline
2000+ Post Club
2000+ Post Club
User avatar

Joined: Sat May 01, 2004 2:43 am
Posts: 2491
Location: New Zealand
Mark- that is an impressive response I must say!

Dave

_________________
Classic Wings Magazine

https://www.classicwings.com/

Facebook

https://www.facebook.com/ClassicWingsMagazine/

Preserved Axis Aircraft

http://www.classicwings.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: For Beaufighter Fans
PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2013 6:38 am 
Offline
1000+ Posts!
1000+ Posts!
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jul 11, 2004 4:55 pm
Posts: 1105
Location: Australia
DaveM2 wrote:
Mark- that is an impressive response I must say!

Dave



Hello Dave, I spent along time around two of the aircraft T9552/A9-13 and A9-557 in the late 1970's and early 1980s when they were first in Melbourne after their PNG recovery, and have also been to many a slide night by the two original private owners to hear and see their records of the Aitape/Tadji recoveries, and more recently have been involved again with these two same aircraft with close involvement with the original and more recent acquisitions of A9-150/230 and T9552/A9-13 at Moorabbin and no direct involvement but certainly close access to A9-557 at AWM.

I also first saw A9-141 in Mildura with Pearce Dunn in the late 1970's when helping Ian Whitney recover his Spitfire fuselage and wings for restoration (now in the NMUSAF), and was re-acquanted with A9-141 in Ralphs hands when the AARG re-acquired the restored cockpit of A9-150 and his other surplus parts from him in 2004 as the basis of a project, and more recently again in 2011 when the AARG acquired the more complete project of T9552/A9-13 as it was stored with Ralph.

Hence I had past "interest", and more recent "need" in pursuing a Beaufort project for the AARG in knowing what "went where" and who "had what" smiles.

regards

Mark Pilkington

_________________
20th Century - The Age of Manned Flight
"from Wrights to Armstrong in 66 years -WOW!"


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 35 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 320 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group