Handed engines--is that the correct word?

[famvburg]

I've read & heard the term 'handed', but it was specified which direction. Mostly, tho, I've seen rotation as 'clockwise' & 'counter-clockwise', or even 'anti-clockwise'.

In a brief article on a recently restored Il-2 Shturmovik that I have written for Aviation History magazine, I wrote that the restoration "has a handed Allison engine, possibly from a P-38, to match the original airplane's 'backward' prop rotation."

My editor is questioning the use of the word "handed" in that fashion.

Question: Is he right to do so? I have always referred to "backward-rotating" aircraft engines as "handed," but perhaps it's a British word that's little-known among U. S. aviation people. Or perhaps my use of it is flat wrong.

Opinions?

Last edited by famvburg on Sun Dec 04, 2011 9:19 am, edited 1 time in total.

[Mike Halbrook]

I've mostly read it as "anti-clockwise' in both aircraft and car/motorcycle manuals and pubs.

[Sopwith]

"Backward rotating",would be the term I personally would question,left handed or right handed would be fine and understandable.

[cooper9411]

Counter clockwise works

[JDK]

JDK would probably be a bit more helpful than the rest of us regarding the language differences just for his personal experiences in this matter, if he might chime in....or PM him.

Here I am.

My editor is questioning the use of the word "handed"...

Question: Is he right to do so? I have always referred to "backward-rotating" aircraft engines as "handed," but perhaps it's a British word that's little-known among U. S. aviation people. Or perhaps my use of it is flat wrong.

As a writer, editor and proof reader, and regularly having to differentiate between four (sometimes more) Englishes, this has intrigued me and I've been doing a bit of checking (so first off, I didn't have an answer in my style sheets, which is often the case for this kind of thing!). Although I've not found a source that is fully definitive, I've enough results aggregated that would be enough for me to make a decision in proofing. Some brief comments:

Second comment would be your editor was right to query it, although I might not have picked it up.

Good modern technical American seems to be "Counter-rotating propeller", but I'd suggest not unambiguous enough in itself - so I would take:
"has a handed Allison engine, possibly from a P-38, to match the original airplane's 'backward' prop rotation."
And recast it to:
"has a counter-rotating Allison engine, probably from a P-38, to match the original airplane's ('reversed' to normal American use) prop rotation."
And that too can be debated, but it's crystal clear, I suggest, we have a prop and engine going the other way to US engine standards.

British English would be:
"has a left-hand tractor Allison engine, possibly from a P-38, to match the original aircraft's prop rotation."

"Handed" and related terms are normal British English and historically used in the British Commonwealth. However in modern aviation, outside the UK, as touched on by the Inspector, it has mostly been replaced by the American terminology, with the prevalence of American engines and associated documentation.

"Handed" as has been said simply shows that an item has a bias and isn't symmetrical or able to be used in either direction. Beyond a general classification, as per the 'handed light cluster' mentioned by Dave Smith, it's too little - you may as well as say "most of the world's population are handed", without differentiating in the actual useful data of how many are right handed, how many left, and how many aren't included as they are genuinely ambidextrous.

So you would always state, as has again been mentioned that something is 'right handed rotation' or vice versa; but that is still not fully unambiguous (remember all those group pictures with "the person on the left in the photograph"?).

The best term for period British English and as is used in the RR system (including IIRC, on the RR Griffon & Merlin dataplates) "right-hand tractor", "left hand pusher" - or the variants, as Rich, our US expert on British oddities has already said... These are defined terms with a clear meaning in original use. But a fellow (Australian) aviation writer and pilot found several of the W.W.II era technical aviation terms I used in a couple of articles, such as RH tractor, completely alien. Got to watch for the archaic.

Since most American reciprocating engines (and most jet engines too) on aircraft turn 'clockwise' (in the pilots viewpoint) that is considered 'normal' in most of the world that uses American built engines on their aircraft.

As anyone involved in precision working of any kind knows, there's nothing more dangerous than a non-comprehensive 'normal'.

Lots of aircraft engines built in England, France, Italy, Russia, and other nations over the years turn counter clockwise' when viewed from the pilots perspective. Automotive engines turn 'counterclockwise' or you'd have four reverse gears and a single, REALLY low forward gear because of transmissions and third members.

The inability for some to grasp this 'norm' (or never made aware of it) in aviation leads to some serious problems, a good example would be the BRITISH MIDLAND 737-400 crash in Jan of 1989. Since it was a new subtype and uses digital flight info displays (FADEC) instead of steam gages when the left engine started coughing up parts on descent with the noise makers retarded, the pilot asked the FA to look out the cabin windows and tell him what she saw, the FA, facing the AFT END of the cabin looked out the windows, saw the left engine flaming and said ''ere, it's the right one innit' because she was looking to HER right,

While not debating the truth or not of that case (see the earlier post) there is a perfectly good system that was used in aviation until ambiguity was brought in. The maritime system, as in many other aspects of aviation has the problem solved with 'port' and 'starboard' which relate to the vehicle (ship or aircraft) not a person's left or right. And that's very obviously why we still have red port and green starboard lights - whatever they get called - on aircraft - following marine practice.

We could have some fun with that! There are many British automotive terms that are "foreign" to us Yanks:
...
A car with a retractable soft top is a drophead coupe'.

Fun we can have! Think drophead coupe's archaic even in the UK now. Any Brits care to comment?

A four-door car with a fixed metal top is a saloon.

EDIT - CORRECTED: As it is here in Australia, where the [British] 'estate' is a [US] 'station wagon' - classic Australian with one British term, one American for layout variations on the vehicle. Of course no-one else has 'Utes' (from Utility) while the wonderful 'Charabanc' has pretty much disappeared, 'coach' and 'bus' are merging, with 'omnibus' gone, while 'truck' is a shifting signifier and 'lorry' is on the way out due to the Americanisation of British English.

The fuel/air mixture is ignited by sparking plugs.

I'd see 'spark plugs'. Again anyone else care to differ? That's related to the reversing of terms by shortening - such as '(car') 'shock absorbers' becoming 'shocks', and in aviation what's an 'anti-g suit' becomes a 'g-suit'.

The fuel tank contains petrol.

A good differentiator when the supply choice is petrol, diesel and LPG ('gas').

Several years ago, I was driving around England on a travel-magazine assignment, and everywhere I saw signs saying "Boot Sale Saturday," I was surprised to find that there were so many Brits looking for shoe bargains, but I finally realized it meant what we'd call a "trunk sale," if there were such a thing. It's the Brit equivalent of a yard sale, and since they don't have yards, for the most part, they sell the odds and ends out of the open trunks of their cars, parked in convenient turnoffs. Live and learn.

The US 'trunk' is obviously derived from the 'steamer trunk' style large piece of luggage strapped to the rear of cars up to the 1930s, and often able to be removed as a unit, rather than having a case inside an integral storage area. 'Boot' comes from the same origin, but from the storage area on horse-drawn coaches; I'm not clear on the origin of why 'boot', I'd guess it might be where boots for the muddy roads of the period could be stored during the journey - but a guess only.

The British car boot sale really developed in the 1980s and is a late reflection of the lack of yards (or of the fencing of British gardens to turn that in it's head) as Stephan's noted, coupled with a tipping point from the foot-travel local 'jumble sale' to the heavy car-using society required for a car boot sale.

As an Australian married to a Canadian, we can unintentionally confuse the he!! out of friends when talking about getting gas/petrol, parking in the 'lot' or 'car-park', leaving on the 'sidewalk' or 'pavement' and opening the 'trunk' or 'boot'. With, as they say, amusing results.

All very odd byways, and beats working, which is what I should've been doing...!

Regards,

Last edited by JDK on Sun Dec 04, 2011 6:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

[dhfan]

Drophead coupe's definitely archaic, probably went out late 50s/early 60s for common use. Convertible or soft top (cabriolet in some brochures) probably most used now.
Spark plugs I agree.

James - "where a [British] 'station wagon' is the US 'estate' " - surely t'other way about, or have I read it wrongly? We have estates here.

[Stephan Wilkinson]

We call them "wagons." Nobody has called them "estates" since the 1930s, if they ever did. (I'm a former editor-in-chief of Car and Driver and the current automotive editor of the U. S. Conde Nast Traveler, so I'm reasonably familiar with automotive terms.) The term "station wagon" is archaic, and I suspect there are numerous wagon owners who have no idea what station meant. (Station wagons were originally used by the well-off to pick up weekend guest at the railroad station, among other things.)

And then there's the Brit "shooting brake..."

Off topic, but I've always been baffled by the U. S. dislike of wagons--we own a Volvo V50 and would never be without either a wagon or a Saab-style hatchback with a flip-down back seat and space for a couple of bikes.

[Dan Jones]

British English would be:
"has a left-hand tractor Allison engine, possibly from a P-38, to match the original aircraft's prop rotation."

This is probably the clearest and most concise way to put it for those of us who speak Canadian English.

[JDK]

James - "where a [British] 'station wagon' is the US 'estate' " - surely t'other way about, or have I read it wrongly? We have estates here.

I should've listened to that nagging little voice in my head, yes, vice versa is correct, not as I had it.

The Australian Ute, the American Truck (otherwise known sometimes as a pick up depending on where you are) - (and to a lesser degree the British Estate) all fulfil a similar specialised roles that's actually more about status and desire than the much claimed advantages or flexibility; they reveal much about the irrationality of motor-aspiration and the most revealing of this, IMHO, is the British advertising trying to reposition the estate car from the 'Green Welly brigade' to the more aspirational mythic 'sporty dad'.

As a coda to the earlier remarks, at the risk of stating the obvious, each national or cultural English is correct and valid within it's own environment, and all seem to have advantages and shortcomings compared to the others - however in areas like aviation, which becomes pan-national and one English (in this case American) over-rides more local terminology. (As a contrast, it was the case that the Industrial Revolution was in British English.

What is interesting to me is how to get period terminology right and how tricky it is to find good definitive documentation relating to items like the original 'handed' 'counter' propeller question. What is going to be interesting is the effect on on our own Englishes from the one that is coming - English as a second language.

Meanwhile, I'd be more interested in Stephan's thoughts on some of the other comments, rather than just the error.

And thanks to Dan for his input. Canadian English is always a challenge when I'm not there to get the right one of the three possible options! Glad to hear 'handed' may live on in the Great White North.

Regards,

[Stephan Wilkinson]

James, sorry, didn't mean to zero in on your "error," which I actually thought was more of a natural misunderstanding, but there really was nothing else in your extensive text that could benefit from my comments. You're obviously very devoted to your craft and have fascinating and diverse awareness of the language in general as well as our mutual areas of interest in particular.

Off-topic warning again: It intrigues me that most Americans call those idiotic vehicles "ess-you-vees" and haven't the faintest idea what the acronym stands for. (Read something yesterday that says they're on the rise again, like a bad dream, as the economy improves slightly/temporarily.) In the U. S., as you probably know, they too are considered to be trucks, just like pickups, as a function of their EPA classification. Just got the report of most recent monthly car sales in the U. S., and the most popular vehicle is the Ford F150 pickup, by a wide margin.

When I was last in Australia, utes were called Toorak Tractors, in honor of the posh Melbourne suburb.

[JDK]

James, sorry, didn't mean to zero in on your "error," which I actually thought was more of a natural misunderstanding, but there really was nothing else in your extensive text that could benefit from my comments.

Thanks! It was a (stupid) error...

My blushes as to the rest. I find the stuff interesting (beats what I should be doing, as well), while much off topic, it's clear a number of us agree!

When I was last in Australia, utes were called Toorak Tractors, in honor of the posh Melbourne suburb.

Indeed! I hadn't realised until recently, that a Melbourne name won't do for Sydneysiders, so up in New South Wales they're "Mosman Taxis". Of course you don't want to be picked up by a booze bus, or taken home in the divvy van, although my parents used to own a Black Maria (when in the UK), which was definitely a neat thing for a kid to ride in, IMHO...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australian ... k_vehicles

The link's interesting in the regional variations on police vehicle names across Australia, given the homogeneous nature of Australian accent and vocabulary otherwise.

Regards,

[ErrolC]

When I was last in Australia, utes were called Toorak Tractors, in honor of the posh Melbourne suburb.

Indeed! I hadn't realised until recently, that a Melbourne name won't do for Sydneysiders, so up in New South Wales they're "Mosman Taxis". Of course you don't want to be picked up by a booze bus, or taken home in the divvy van, although my parents used to own a Black Maria (when in the UK), which was definitely a neat thing for a kid to ride in, IMHO...
Regards,

SUVs in Auckland (and perhaps the rest of NZ, not sure) are 'Remuera Tractors', for the same reason. We also have 'Queen St farmers', for those that have real jobs in Auckland's CBD, and play farms in the countryside.

Dragging things back to aviation, how many names are there around the world for LSA/microlight/ultralight etc?

[dhfan]

Over here, pick-ups or utes are generally bought by people that actually need them. SUVs, or 4x4s to use the UK generic term are a different matter. Most owners of "Chelsea Tractors" wouldn't recognise a field or farm track if it bit them.

[Stephan Wilkinson]

In the U. S.,, driving a pickup is considered by some to be a mark of manliness, like wearing a jersey with a football player's name and number. So there are a huge number of shiny pickups being driven around by accountants, dentists and dermatologists with beds as spotless and unsullied as a Bentley's boot.