Warbird Information Exchange

The movie is, imho, one of the all time greats. Despite its detail faults, one must remember it is not a documentary. The larger theme of combat and command and its toll on men and machines is conveyed beautifully without the need for computer generated explosions.
To get an idea into just how this novel, movie and TV show have withstood the test of time, in 2005 the "The 12 O'Clock High Logbook" was published. This is a 422 page paperback subtitled "The Unofficial History of the Novel, Motion Picture, and TV Series". by Allan T. Duffin and Paul Matheis. It is quite detailed and will tell you everything you ever wanted to know. Such as how many B-17's were used.
Also, www.12oclockHighTV.com has transcribed EVERY episode of the TV show onto individual DVD's.
I mention the above to let you all who may be interested know that there is still, even after the passage of many years, an intense interest in the subject.
I, purchased the TV series and am working my way through the three years of shows, and have enjoyed every minute. When I purchased them, I emailed the fellow who did all this work saying I had no idea that there was this much interest in 12 O'Clock High. He replied "you have no idea how much". Thought that was very telling.

12 O'Clock High is one of my top ten all time greatest films. The opening alone is one of the greatest cinematic sequences ever filmed. Perfect way to "go back" in time.

I've said it before, it's all about the writing. If it ain't written well, it doesn't have a snowball's chance in h_ell of being able to rise above mediocrity, regardless of the aircraft, casting, cinematographer or director.
Jerry

_________________
"Always remember that, when you enter the ocean or the forest, you are no longer at the top of the food chain."

Yup, seeing Dean Jagger bicycle out to his one-time home always gives me a little chill. Whenever I set foot on one of the WWII training fields that are now returning to nature I think of all the people who trained and worked on them nearly seventy years ago. I can't imagine how it would feel to have actually been stationed at one of the combat airfields and then returning years later.

Scott

how bout 30 seconds over tokyo and wing and a prayer. great movies too

_________________
" I am a nobody in aviation, but somebody to my family."

I know that it is not a real war time name, but I would love see a B-17 flying as the Lepar Colony.

_________________
Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Manager

how bout mother and country?

_________________
" I am a nobody in aviation, but somebody to my family."

12 O'clock High is a good movie but, unfortunately, I think most WWII movies aren’t that great, especially the ones about aviation. Memphis Belle and Pearl Harbor are the worst. If you ever want to know why the 2001 release of Pearl Harbor sucks so bad, all you have to do is catch Tora! Tora! Tora! I remember asking Capt. Morgan what he thought of the movie Memphis Belle, just after it had been released, I think he threw-up in his mouth a little bit.
Midway may show the wrong planes and have a crapy love story, but the main points are factual true.
Das Boot is properly the best WWII movie, but that’s about U-boats!

Phil

_________________
A man's got to know his limitations.

Das boot is garbage. Watch they were expendable, a true american ww2 movie

_________________
" I am a nobody in aviation, but somebody to my family."

I agree with you on alot of it. I think Pearl harbor and Memphis Belle could have been sooooo much better, however, these movies did atleast get some history into younger generations that may not sit down and watch Tora Tora Tora or Midway. Sort of like when you hid medicine in cheese for your dog. The whole thing may not be valuable, but atleast you got a dose in. Many of my non aviation friends came to me after Pearl harbor and asked if the Doolittle Raid really happened. That is when I turned them to the book and movie Thirty Seconds Over Tokyo. But at the very least PH and memphis Belle got people aimed the right direction.

_________________
Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Manager

Ya, I guess the movie “Battle-of-Britain” got me reading and studying more about WWII aviation.
But that was a better aviation movie, maybe that best of WWII, that and "Catch 22".
Why are the Vietnam era movies so much better???

Phil

_________________
A man's got to know his limitations.

It seems to me atleast that the Vietnam movies especially the ones produced in the last few years have had many of the veterans that took part in the event depicted in the film there on hand to help with making sure things are correct. We Were Soldiers is an example that comes to mind. My father said that is as close to Vietnam as he has seen on film, although he said that the Full Metal Jacket boot camp scenes are the best depicting Basic Training. I am happy that alot of films use the veterans for info. Band of Brothers is perhaps the best use of that where dialogue that was never before known was brought to light by the veterans themselves. Then you have a movie such as Apollo 13, where the film script is basically taken right from the tapes. TO the point that when first viewing the film, Jim Lovell, Tom hanks, and Ron Howard thought it was going to bomb because it was too technical. It just goes to show you that people do respond to accurate movies, even if they don't understand 100% what you the terms mean.
One of my favorite little facts about about movie accuracy involves Apollo 13. The actors had a sense that they were doing something important when doing this movie, and wanted to get it right. While watching a documentary on the real events, Bill Paxton noticed that when they cut the LEM loose, that you hear Jim Lovell say "Fairwell Aquarius, and we thank you." And real soft in the background and in a real sort of sad voice Fred haise can be heard saying, "She sure was a good ship". When the filming was being done for these scenes, that line did not appear, and Bill Paxton added them in on his own, and they left it in when he stated why. Bill Paxton talks about this in one of the making of the movie documentaries.

_________________
Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Manager

You're right on with that one Phil!
Fantastic movie. I saw it twice in the theater with the subtitles when it was first released. Another terrific opening shot.
Jerry

_________________
"Always remember that, when you enter the ocean or the forest, you are no longer at the top of the food chain."

watch they were expendable starring john wayne and robert montgomery. Using real elco pt boats and Montgomery was actually at pt boat skipper during ww2. Now thats real!

_________________
" I am a nobody in aviation, but somebody to my family."

Twelve O'Clock High was a great movie which I watched quite a few times as an USAF training film but one that was shown as often, if not more often was Command Decision. Both are good leadership training examples but could never be considered WW II 8th AF documentaries.

I think that Das Boot was as good a representation of the German U-Boat service as one could hope for although some U-Boat veterans disagree. As far as I'm concerned, the only thing missing was the ever-present stench of diesel oil, tobacco smoke, BO and cooking odors combined which was only alleved somewhat when running surfaced or snorkeling ventilated the boat.

_________________
It's what you learn after you think you know it all, that counts.

I can count how many times I've seen "They Were Expendable". It is a great film and very realistic too!
Oh yeah, and Donna Read also! Whoa baby!
Jerry

_________________
"Always remember that, when you enter the ocean or the forest, you are no longer at the top of the food chain."