Wed May 21, 2008 7:23 am
It is a shame that airknocker dropped out....I don't believe that anyone was trying to "take away" anything that MR. Hoover did in his career in aviation...it is simply a case of someone being wronged, seeing the wrong, and expressing our point of view that Mr. Hoover's lack of compensation to the T-28 owner was basically irresponsible. This being discussed, may perhaps, provide each of us with caution when a "friend" release the flight controls to us, that their Iron Steed is in Trusting, and Greatful hands, and will be returned to them undamaged. What is fair is fair...what is wrong is just wrong. I beileve that Mr. Hoover will continue to be treated with respect in the small circle of aviation, but his glowing reputation may have a little tarnish on it..and if he continues to treat the aircraft of other owners the same way, that tarnish could lead to corrosion...
Wed May 21, 2008 7:47 am
[quote="gary1954"]It is a shame that airknocker dropped out....I don't believe that anyone was trying to "take away" anything that MR. Hoover did in his career in aviation...it is simply a case of someone being wronged, seeing the wrong, and expressing our point of view that Mr. Hoover's lack of compensation to the T-28 owner was basically irresponsible. This being discussed, may perhaps, provide each of us with caution when a "friend" release the flight controls to us, that their Iron Steed is in Trusting, and Greatful hands, and will be returned to them undamaged. What is fair is fair...what is wrong is just wrong. I beileve that Mr. Hoover will continue to be treated with respect in the small circle of aviation, but his glowing reputation may have a little tarnish on it..and if he continues to treat the aircraft of other owners the same way, that tarnish could lead to corrosion...[/quote]
Do you really know the whole story!???.. I don't think so ... I hope this thread sticks around a while so carma can come full circle.
Do you really know the whole story!???.. I don't think so ... I hope this thread sticks around a while so carma can come full circle.
Wed May 21, 2008 8:10 am
"never a lender or a borrower be....." [it may end in tears!]
quote; my grandmother.
quote; my grandmother.
Wed May 21, 2008 8:28 am
[quote="Oscar Duck"]"never a lender or a borrower be....." [it may end in tears!]
quote; my grandmother.[/quote]
Wise Woman!
VERY GOOD ADVICE 
My grandmother like yours probably lived thru the depression. I have always followed that advice and it has worked very well for me.
quote; my grandmother.[/quote]
Wise Woman!
VERY GOOD ADVICE
My grandmother like yours probably lived thru the depression. I have always followed that advice and it has worked very well for me.
Wed May 21, 2008 8:55 am
Brokenwrench, I think you have missed my point, you may not have read what I have posted in the original thread.
Wed May 21, 2008 9:05 am
No, I think I have it loud and clear.... You guys are bashing Hoover for your own entertainment . What have you done with your life? I'm sure if I had a cristal ball alot of the WIX members arn't that upstanding and probably done alot worse than Hoover ever did. He just happens to live his life under a microscope.
Wed May 21, 2008 9:19 am
Obviously you have no idea as to the size of the microscope that is above me...it's called the US Constitution.operated by the Supreme Court, Local Courts, the ACLU, Aspca NAACP FBI GBI ABI and a whole buch of other alphabet operators....This is a moral issue..not a blame game. You have given your opinion, and I have given mine..we can agree that there is more to the story than what has unfolded here..and leads me to believe that what is wrong is wrong, and what is right is right. If I am wrong in this Bill, I will admit it....and would truly appreciate the facts, if anyone can find them. With that...I truly hope that should I have the pleasure of meeting any of you on or near the flightline, that we will have an aviation funfilled time. 
to quote a Thi Pilot..."I go now". 
to quote a Thi Pilot..."I go now".
Wed May 21, 2008 11:32 am
[quote="gary1954"]Obviously you have no idea as to the size of the microscope that is above me...it's called the US Constitution.operated by the Supreme Court, Local Courts, the ACLU, Aspca NAACP FBI GBI ABI and a whole buch of other alphabet operators....This is a moral issue..not a blame game. You have given your opinion, and I have given mine..we can agree that there is more to the story than what has unfolded here..and leads me to believe that what is wrong is wrong, and what is right is right. If I am wrong in this Bill, I will admit it....and would truly appreciate the facts, if anyone can find them. With that...I truly hope that should I have the pleasure of meeting any of you on or near the flightline, that we will have an aviation funfilled time. to quote a Thi Pilot..."I go now". [/quote]
What are the Facts? As you admited, You really know what they are and that being said who can say what is right or wrong.. You weren't there and or interviewed anyone in regards to the issue so your pretty much just flapping your gums for fun at the expense of Bob Hoover.. I wish I could say the same about meeting however I'm selective in the company I Keep. What I do find faciniating is how the spitfire/ hurricane incedent will play out in the courts with people trying to assign blame. Oh there are going to be volumes wrote on wix about that.
to quote a Thi Pilot..."I go now". [/quote]
What are the Facts? As you admited, You really know what they are and that being said who can say what is right or wrong.. You weren't there and or interviewed anyone in regards to the issue so your pretty much just flapping your gums for fun at the expense of Bob Hoover.. I wish I could say the same about meeting however I'm selective in the company I Keep. What I do find faciniating is how the spitfire/ hurricane incedent will play out in the courts with people trying to assign blame. Oh there are going to be volumes wrote on wix about that.
Wed May 21, 2008 12:17 pm
On age and wisdom: Age doesn't bring wisdom, it brings the opportunity to build wisdom. Some do and some don't take this opportunity.
Much like travel. We all know people who've traveled the world, yet have managed to avoid acquiring any knowledge, appreciation or respect of foreign cultures. The opportunity was there, but they took a pass.
On respect: Nobody, no matter their age, their experience, or how many people they've killed, gets my respect unconditionally and for all purposes forever. In my mind, any stranger starts with a certain amount of esteem, and they can make that go up or down by their actions at any time. Many war "heroes" (I have not really had a hero since I was 12) have driven my respect for them down to about zero by their actions since the war. Others have increased it. I might respect a guy's ability or skills but detest him as a person, or vice versa. Nobody gets a free ride based on "what they've done in their life."
On Hoover: Probably the smoothest flying pilot I've ever seen. I don't care about his war experience since being a great warrior doesn't cut much cheese with me. I have heard that smooth flying pilots made bad fighter pilots because you could easily see and project where they were going; maybe that's why Hoov got waxed. He should have made uncoordinated turns and jerked the plane around, but can you imagine him doing that? Anyway. Reputedly he's a nice guy. The T-28 thread has left me with no idea what happened in the T-28, and I don't care much. Too bad about the plane. But nothing here has changed my view of him.
I really don't think anyone's tearing anyone down, especially a war hero. If there's one place where warriors get a free ride 99% of the time, it's here.
August
Much like travel. We all know people who've traveled the world, yet have managed to avoid acquiring any knowledge, appreciation or respect of foreign cultures. The opportunity was there, but they took a pass.
On respect: Nobody, no matter their age, their experience, or how many people they've killed, gets my respect unconditionally and for all purposes forever. In my mind, any stranger starts with a certain amount of esteem, and they can make that go up or down by their actions at any time. Many war "heroes" (I have not really had a hero since I was 12) have driven my respect for them down to about zero by their actions since the war. Others have increased it. I might respect a guy's ability or skills but detest him as a person, or vice versa. Nobody gets a free ride based on "what they've done in their life."
On Hoover: Probably the smoothest flying pilot I've ever seen. I don't care about his war experience since being a great warrior doesn't cut much cheese with me. I have heard that smooth flying pilots made bad fighter pilots because you could easily see and project where they were going; maybe that's why Hoov got waxed. He should have made uncoordinated turns and jerked the plane around, but can you imagine him doing that? Anyway. Reputedly he's a nice guy. The T-28 thread has left me with no idea what happened in the T-28, and I don't care much. Too bad about the plane. But nothing here has changed my view of him.
I really don't think anyone's tearing anyone down, especially a war hero. If there's one place where warriors get a free ride 99% of the time, it's here.
August
Wed May 21, 2008 12:56 pm
Ummmm Broken Wrench... 
your point is well taken..and to show you the most respect I can without you having earned it, I will consider the source, and, ignore it. Have a peachy day Dud e
your point is well taken..and to show you the most respect I can without you having earned it, I will consider the source, and, ignore it. Have a peachy day Dud e
Wed May 21, 2008 1:00 pm
I just wonder what the actual condition of the inside of that engine was before the incident: what do the engine logs show? Perhaps there was an underlying preexisting condition, certainly exacerbated by the wringing out, but bound to appear at some point- Russian Roulette flying...
Robbie
Robbie
Wed May 21, 2008 1:13 pm
[quote="gary1954"]Ummmm Broken Wrench... your point is well taken..and to show you the most respect I can without you having earned it, I will consider the source, and, ignore it. Have a peachy day Dud e[/quote]
Thanks, Always willing to help Junior aviation enthusiests make educated decisions. I'll send you an autographed picture if you like for free just send 29.95 for shipping and handeling..
your point is well taken..and to show you the most respect I can without you having earned it, I will consider the source, and, ignore it. Have a peachy day Dud e[/quote]
Thanks, Always willing to help Junior aviation enthusiests make educated decisions. I'll send you an autographed picture if you like for free just send 29.95 for shipping and handeling..
Wed May 21, 2008 1:18 pm
Robbie Roberts wrote:I just wonder what the actual condition of the inside of that engine was before the incident: what do the engine logs show? Perhaps there was an underlying preexisting condition, certainly exacerbated by the wringing out, but bound to appear at some point- Russian Roulette flying...
Robbie
It's entirely possible that the aerobatics had nothing to do with the failure. An additional factor is that the owner claimed to be in the habit of loaning the plane to others, one can only speculate how they operated it. We've all had things fail unexpectedly with no apparent cause.
Tom-
????
Wed May 21, 2008 1:25 pm
An additional factor is that the owner claimed to be in the habit of loaning the plane to others, one can only speculate how they operated it.
I don't think the a/c was treated like a rental though. If he was loaning to guys like Bob Guilford then he was a trusting quality people
Wed May 21, 2008 1:31 pm
Thanks Broken Wrench, the check is in the mail! or visa amexpress MC?
I do see your point, but at the same time I hope you can see mine...I "know" Mr Hoover is a teriffic aviator, I got to see his stuff at the Paris Airshow way back in the last century when he was fline the yeller P-51...and have seen him dance the AeroCommander forthand back to landing, yes he is talented and skilled , and I am truly not attempting to airbrush that out of the Hoover Photo ..after 20years in the field of aviation and over 35 years researching aircraft as a hobby, I believe I am entilted to my "opinion, having assisted on aviation mishap investigations, former Air Traffic Control Facility Training Supervisor, ATC Facility Chief, oh..and almost 4 years in aviation maintenance.....I was basing my "opinion" on what I "read", in that after the now infamous flight, the 28 was rung-out...but at whose hand? was it rung-out prior to flight (don't think so 
)? I merely pointed out, that the crew flying the aircraft was/is repsonsible for damage done to the airframe...I don't give a tinkers Dayum about the engine, they die all the time 
. and it is merely my opinion...
or visa amexpress MC?
I do see your point, but at the same time I hope you can see mine...I "know" Mr Hoover is a teriffic aviator, I got to see his stuff at the Paris Airshow way back in the last century when he was fline the yeller P-51...and have seen him dance the AeroCommander forthand back to landing,
yes he is talented and skilled , and I am truly not attempting to airbrush that out of the Hoover Photo ..after 20years in the field of aviation and over 35 years researching aircraft as a hobby, I believe I am entilted to my "opinion, having assisted on aviation mishap investigations, former Air Traffic Control Facility Training Supervisor, ATC Facility Chief, oh..and almost 4 years in aviation maintenance.....I was basing my "opinion" on what I "read", in that after the now infamous flight, the 28 was rung-out...but at whose hand? was it rung-out prior to flight (don't think so )? I merely pointed out, that the crew flying the aircraft was/is repsonsible for damage done to the airframe...I don't give a tinkers Dayum about the engine, they die all the time . and it is merely my opinion...