Top Warbird Museums England/France/Germany

[StangStung]

I'm trying work in some European warbird museums into an upcoming trip. I've seen the major warbird sights in London, so I'm looking to expand my horizons. Here's what I can come up with off the top of my head:

RAFM Cosford
All the Duxford outfits
RNAS Museum in Yeovilton

Can't venture outside of England, as time won't allow.

Then over to France, I'm thinking Le Borguet?

Germany I've seen several mentioned at Gatow, Munich, etc., but if I could only pick one or two, I'm not sure what would be the most comprehensive of aircraft I probably couldn't see in the U.S.

For those who've been, what are your top picks and how much time would you allot for a proper visit?

[StangStung]

I'm trying work in some European warbird museums into an upcoming trip. I've seen the major warbird sights in London, so I'm looking to expand my horizons. Here's what I can come up with off the top of my head:

RAFM Cosford
All the Duxford outfits
RNAS Museum in Yeovilton

Can't venture outside of England, as time won't allow.

Then over to France, I'm thinking Le Borguet?

Germany I've seen several mentioned at Gatow, Munich, etc., but if I could only pick one or two, I'm not sure what would be the most comprehensive of aircraft I probably couldn't see in the U.S.

For those who've been, what are your top picks and how much time would you allot for a proper visit?

To the extent that it is relevant, this will probably happen from the third week in August though the second week of September.

[Pat Carry]

The Utah Beach museum (new since we were there in 1994) has a B-26 Maurader

[Sopwith]

Call by the Shuttleworth Collection at Old Warden, Bedfordshire. You won’t be disappointed and it is not too far from Duxford.

[StangStung]

The Utah Beach museum (new since we were there in 1994) has a B-26 Maurader

All the Normandy museums are on the agenda. Looking forward to that.

[StangStung]

Call by the Shuttleworth Collection at Old Warden, Bedfordshire. You won’t be disappointed and it is not too far from Duxford.

Right. This is exactly the kind of oversight I was hoping the team here would correct. On the list.

[blurrkup]

Newark Air Museum http://www.newarkairmuseum.org/
de Havilland Aircraft Museum https://www.dehavillandmuseum.co.uk/

These are another couple of options in the UK

[quemerford]

I'd suggest Toulouse; it's not often that you have two major aircraft museums next to each other, but here you have the largely indoor Aeroscopia museum (Concorde, Super Guppy, A400M and lots of smaller stuff), plus the amazing outdoor Ailes Anciennes museum right next door (It really is right next door), with such exotics as Deltaviex, Espadon, Deux Ponts, Breguet 941S etc. You could also try an A380 production line tour (if they are still in production by that time).

[Archer]

Munich, the Technik Museum in the center of the city but also the Schleissheim location not too far away. I can also recommend the Dornier museum in Friedrichshafen, with the Zeppelin museum in the same town.

You could also consider the two technical museums at Speyer and Sinsheim, but for me they are not on the A-list.

[old iron]

For whatever this may be worth, I have been to most of the major aviation museums in the world. I have a fairly holistic interest in aviation history, with special interest in the particularly rare and historic. Here are what I think are the four best museums in France/England/Germany, and I will add one more to make a TOP FIVE in Europe. I will give some honorable mentions as well.

France: The Musee de l’Aire et de L’Espace, at Le Bourget. This is simply one of the two best aviation collections in the world, the other being NASM in and near Washington DC. There is no ranking one of these better than the other. Both are simply THE BEST.

UK: The RAF Museum, London area (the only exclusively military museum on this short list). Comparable to the USAFM in Ohio. Collection is dispersed among several locations.

UK: Science Museum in S. Kensington. I may get some arguments on this as the aviation collection is fairly small, but the pound-for-pound historic value is extraordinary, and may be the best in the world.

Germany: The Deutshes Museum in Munich. Another smaller collection but of extraordinary specimens, including the only Wright Model A that survives. As with NASM, there are two major facilities.

Belgium: The other museum in Europe that I would rank with the above is the Belgian Air Museum in Brussels. This is one of the four museums with the best WWI collections (the others being NASM, Musee de l’Aire and National Aeronautical Collection of Canada, Ottawa; the Poland Aviation Museum in Krakow has a strong list, but almost everything is incomplete, and too much is in poor condition).

So above is my Top Five. Honorable mentions:

The Russian Air Force Museum in Monino has many rarities (Sopwith Triplane, Farman, historic WWII aircraft) but very few are indoors, and the museum’s longterm security may be uncertain.

Aeronautica Militaire Italia, in Turin, has many rare birds (this is the only museum in this email that I have not visited).

I am not sure that the Fleet Air Arm Museum, in Yeovilton, quite makes this list. The collection is smaller than the RAF, as NNAM in Pensacola is to the NMUSAF.

The Poland Air Museum in Krakow is in general a lesser museum, except for the circa 20 survivors of the Berlin Air Museum, which until 1943 was the world's best; very few of those survivors are complete.

There are a number of other significant museums in Europe, but all to my eye are smaller, less diverse and with fewer truly rare/historic.

I will be visiting the Sweden Air Force Museum, Linkoping, and the smaller Norsk Teknisk Museum in Oslo this Spring Break. Yehaw!

[bearoutwest]

I guess it depends on what you're looking for in a Museum. As an example, the comment that "...the Fleet Air Arm Museum, in Yeovilton, ..... collection is smaller than the RAF, as NNAM in Pensacola is to the NMUSAF", is perfectly correct. However, Yeovilton is specifically the RN FAA museum and contains specialist types not found elsewhere - Westland Wyvern, Fairey Fulmar and Albacore, captured Argentinian Pucara*, etc. A portion of the main display was (in 2002, so worth confirming) laid out as a walking tour through an aircraft carrier, through multiple decks via bulkhead style doors, stairs, etc. Yeovilton is an active RNAS, so chances of seeing something interesting on the runway is also a possibility - just depends on your luck of the day.

If you're spending time in Italy, the Leonardo DaVinci Science & Technology Museum in Milan is worthwhile, unusual collection inside.

...geoff

*Just a small list of "one of's" from memory, worth checking on-line before deciding, but other "more common" types I saw in 2002 included Concorde, F4U, Hawker Sea Hawk, Sea Harrier (test flight on the airfield), F4F, Sea Fury.

[LysanderUK]

Regarding the Fleet Air Arm museum, for me it's in no way second best to other national museums. The carrier deck experience is still there and well worth a look (highlights include the DH Vampire used by Eric Brown for the first ever deck landing by a jet and a Phantom that has been mounted for a cat-shot : the control surfaces move and the engines "light up", actually very impressive). There's also the "Leading Edge" hangar with some not-so-naval but very significant aircraft, including the prototype UK Concorde which you can walk through and other gems like the BAC.221 and Wyvern.

As mentioned above, there are other unique aircraft like the Fulmar and Albacore in the other areas of the museum.

From an American perspective, it's worth pointing out that they have the "full set" of major US types used by the wartime RN (Wildcat, Hellcat, Avenger, Corsair). The Wildcat is actually a Martlet Mk.1 diverted from a French order and the museum have painstakingly stripped back later paintjobs to reveal and conserve as much of the French-spec camouflage as possible. The Corsair is even more of a time capsule and was the subject of a book on the conservation of the original finish, if any US buffs want to see a Corsair in wartime paint and internal fit etc, this is the place to come.

As already mentioned, Yeovilton is still active today so it's possible to see some flying by both the modern FAA and the Fly Navy Heritage Trust/Navy Wings (what was the Royal Navy Historic Flight until recently). F35's, Hawks or even a Swordfish or SeaFury are a possibility.

[Combatmech]

http://www.midlandairmuseum.co.uk/

Very nice collection. Went through there in 2001.

[bdk]

For whatever this may be worth, I have been to most of the major aviation museums in the world. I have a fairly holistic interest in aviation history, with special interest in the particularly rare and historic. Here are what I think are the four best museums in France/England/Germany, and I will add one more to make a TOP FIVE in Europe. I will give some honorable mentions as well.

Aeronautica Militaire Italia, in Turin, has many rare birds (this is the only museum in this email that I have not visited).

Have you been to this one?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italian_Air_Force_Museum

I was there a few months back and thoroughly enjoyed my visit.

[StangStung]

Great conversation gentlemen.

The Polish museum was on my list, but unfortunately my time constraints do not allow me to go that far east this time around.

I hadn't considered the Belgian museum. That one I may be able to work in.

I have been to the Italian Air Force Museum about 7 years ago. It is tremendous. Coming from an American perspective, there was just so much to see that I could never have seen in North American museums. Apart from the Macchi fighters in the Smithsonian or NMUSAF, there's really not much Italian to be seen. And that museum is just chock full of wondrous Italian aircraft. Not to mention the WWI vets and arguably the first bomber (Bleriot). Truly unique specimens.

Also worthy of note is the Spanish AF Museum at Cuatro Vientos outside of Madrid. I've been to that one twice, but as I said, that's too far afield for this particular trip, even if I wanted to make a third visit.