B-29 / B-50 civilian owned and where they are

[wendovertom]

Seeing Fifi and Doc flying and thinking big with the lotto

I know that Aero-trader / Kermit Weeks have 44-70049 and 44-84084 and 45-21787; Planes of Fame has 46-010 (partial?) but is that it? Are there any other possibilities out there??

Tom P.

[Fouga23]

Questmasters has the cockpit of Big Time Operator

[JohnB]

The PoF B-50 only needs an airworthy C-97 to take to the air again...

If you've ever seen it, it's just a fuselage..so you'll need wings, engines, empanage. Easy if you're doing a model kit, full scale I hate to think of the issues. I doubt if even Kermit has that kind if money.

[Matt Gunsch]

The PoF B-50 only needs an airworthy C-97 to take to the air again...

If you've ever seen it, it's just a fuselage..so you'll need wings, engines, empanage. Easy if you're doing a model kit, full scale I hate to think of the issues. I doubt if even Kermit has that kind if money.

They do have the wing, engines and tail from a scrapped C-97

[JohnB]

I would hope so...there have been plenty of 97s/367s scrapped over the years.
Putting them together to make an entire plane would be a huge undertaking....and as a engineering layman, I would guess it will depend on how the B-50s wings were removed, how much damage there is to the center section.

That will determine if it would fly again...plus "little" things like engines, systems and controls ....or simply be a static held together with angle iron and bondo.

The Berlin Airlift group has been working on their C-97 for years and it's not regularly flying yet, Clay Lacey has seemingly given up on his H&P-sourced '97, the CAF has had engine issues, with the comparatively simple 3350s on Fifi, so the engine concerns for a flyer with 4360s shouldn't be underestimated.

[sandiego89]

Does the USF hold the "pink slip" for all the B-29's at museums, as listed here?

http://www.b29-superfortress.com/b29-su ... t-list.htm

I think it would be safe to say that all those as gate guards on bases and official USAF museums are firmly under USAF control, but sometimes ownership can get complicated for some airframes at private museums, were they a gift, does the USAF always hold the title? A few of the display sites seem to have unique parent organizations.

[JohnB]

I'm sure someone will correct this...
I would think the only private B-29s are Fifi and Doc (not to mention Week's ex-NACA, Oakland Museum, not China Lake)...and wonder how they escaped.
I think the fact they're ex-China Lake played a role in that.
They were given to the Navy, so the USAF could wash their hands legally of them.

The others were probably given by the USN to the NMUSAF....they own the few at bases.

[bdk]

The POF B-50 was a USAF traveling exhibit (with the spar carry-through cut out so people could walk from nose to tail). Then I suspect it was scrapped and obtained by POF. With the spar cut it should be effectively demilled as far as the military is concerned.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucky_Lady_II

Last edited by bdk on Mon Aug 07, 2017 3:15 pm, edited 2 times in total.

[OD/NG]

The PoF B-50 only needs an airworthy C-97 to take to the air again...

If you've ever seen it, it's just a fuselage..so you'll need wings, engines, empanage. Easy if you're doing a model kit, full scale I hate to think of the issues. I doubt if even Kermit has that kind if money.

They do have the wing, engines and tail from a scrapped C-97

Yes they do and no the B-50 will never be made airworthy, even with that. With the number of projects that POF has, we will be lucky to see the B-50 complete as a static someday, though I believe that is the eventual goal.

[Blackbirdfan]

One more B29 that could be potentially flown. "Three Feathers" at March Field. Its a former Tallichet bird, that was loaned to March Field. N3299F. I know March Field Air Museum just had someone do a ton of work polishing it out.

Does anyone know how much work it would need to be a flyer? Someone posted a video on FB under a picture of it that appeared to be an engine start of Three Feathers, but I'm pretty sure its Fifi (the video bird has a lower gun turret, Three Feathers does not.)

Will

[wendovertom]

That is interesting - I would think that Tallichet would have to own it to get a N number but on Baughers list it says the USAF loaned it to Tallichet. Probably an interesting history there.

I would love to get a full plane or even a partial airframe for the museum in Wendover. People come and are blown away by the B-29 hangar built for the 393rd BS and invariably ask, "When will you get the Enola Gay back?" LOL - we tell them thats like stealing the crown jewels from the tower of London. I know there are a few out there and we (the Wendover museum) have even talked to Kermit about one of his B-29s but even more than $$ a lot of folks with partial sections seem to just want to "have it", regardless of whether it is on display or not.

Tom P.

[menards]

That is interesting - I would think that Tallichet would have to own it to get a N number but on Baughers list it says the USAF loaned it to Tallichet. Probably an interesting history there.

I would love to get a full plane or even a partial airframe for the museum in Wendover. People come and are blown away by the B-29 hangar built for the 393rd BS and invariably ask, "When will you get the Enola Gay back?" LOL - we tell them thats like stealing the crown jewels from the tower of London. I know there are a few out there and we (the Wendover museum) have even talked to Kermit about one of his B-29s but even more than $$ a lot of folks with partial sections seem to just want to "have it", regardless of whether it is on display or not.

Tom P.

Your best bet is that a base closes and the NMUSAF has to move/find a new home for one of its airframes. I think this happened with T Square 54 in the 90's, that's how it ended up at the Museum of Flight.

[Warbird Kid]

When you go to the March Air Museum website the B-29 says it's on loan from the NMUSAF. Hope they didn't just somehow get imminent domain over the plane or something. The same can be seen under the replica Val's page for the website, which I believe was also on loan from Talichet. Are there any other airframes that were also from Talichet at March?

[menards]

When you go to the March Air Museum website the B-29 says it's on loan from the NMUSAF. Hope they didn't just somehow get imminent domain over the plane or something. The same can be seen under the replica Val's page for the website, which I believe was also on loan from Talichet. Are there any other airframes that were also from Talichet at March?

Talichet never owned the B-29. He only operated it for a brief time in the late 70s. If I recall correctly, the USAF also had a similar arrangement with the CAF and the F-82, also the Memphis Belle and the Mud Island group. There were probably others. Not exactly sure why the CAF and the IWM obtained title to their birds, yet ownership of N3299F went from the Navy to the USAF in '76. Also if I recall correctly, those are the only three birds that were flown out of China Lake (Fifi, N3299F and Its Hawg Wild, in that order) , with Doc being dragged out and flying much later.

[Steve Nelson]

Here are some snapshots I took of the PoF's stash of C-97 bits at their Valle, AZ facility in 2018. The aft fuselage of the B-50 is in a storage compound nearby, and I think the forward section is at Chino.

The C-97 horizontal:



The vertical:



Engines:



And the wing section, behind a rather sad Vampire:





As you can see, the basic pieces are there, but even building up a B-50 for static display would be a massive (and expensive) undertaking.

SN