Avenger Question

[SaxMan]

Helping out with the Avenger restoration certainly piqued my interest with the TBF/TBM, and I've begun reading a number of books on the aircraft. The one thing I read consistently in most accounts was that it was apparent from the get-go that the plane was underpowered. My question is, if Grumman knew this right off the bat, why didn't they consider modifying the existing airframe (if possible) to accept a more powerful engine, such as the P&W R2800? Or, to design a follow on (TB2F?) that used the more powerful R2800 engine,

I'm pretty sure I know the answer to the question: Grumman was heavily committed to the F6F and the development of the F7F and probably didn't have the resources to devote to major airframe changes to the TBF. I figure there's got to be some folks here on WIX who would have more insight into this.

[mike furline]

R-2800 production was maxed out for the F4U, F6F, F7F, F8F, P-47, P-61, A-26, B-26, C-46, PV-1, PV-2, .... to name a few.

[51fixer]

Allocation of resources also went through the War Production Board which was a gov operation.
It wasn't always as easy as deciding to make a change as it would require permission from the board.
This was one of the reasons GM built aircraft as production of existing successful types could continue while new types were brought into production. This meant you would have numbers, even if not the latest, at least in case the new type didn't succeed.
In some cases the board prevented changes. Lockheed wanted to put the Merlin in the P-38 but the time needed to retool production facilities would have stopped production altogether for a time and that wasn't allowable IIRC.

[John Dupre]

How much difference is there in horsepower between the R-2600 and the R-2800? There is only a couple of hundred cubic inches difference in displacement. At the time of its design engines like the R-3350 were either on the drawing board or in very early development. The only real avenue was to seriously lighten the airframe and remove defensive armament and armor. That would have meant a substantial change in attitude by the Navy and Grumman. As it was the Avenger performed very well.

[warbirddriver]

The R2600-20 puts out 1900hp. How much more do you want? Does just fine for the mission it flew.

[SaxMan]

The R2600-20 puts out 1900hp. How much more do you want? Does just fine for the mission it flew.

Hmmmm. Good point. Like Tim Allen's character in "Home Improvement", the solution to any problem is more power! Why stop at the R-2800? Maybe they should have considered an R-3350 or R-4360 powered Avenger!

Actually, I think they did make a R-3350 powered Avenger...the Douglas Skyraider

[51fixer]

The R2600-20 puts out 1900hp. How much more do you want? Does just fine for the mission it flew.

Hmmmm. Good point. Like Tim Allen's character in "Home Improvement", the solution to any problem is more power! Why stop at the R-2800? Maybe they should have considered an R-3350 or R-4360 powered Avenger!

Actually, I think they did make a R-3350 powered Avenger...the Douglas Skyraider

Grumman did make a R-2800 powered follow up to the Avenger.

[SaxMan]

Grumman did make a R-2800 powered follow up to the Avenger.

The Guardian?