Here we go again- Title 10- HR 4310- All in one thread
Thu Apr 19, 2012 10:12 am
April 18, 2012 - EAA and the Warbirds of America are joining with the Commemorative Air Force, Collings Foundation, and other warbird groups in opposition of a proposed amendment to the House National Defense Authorization Act (H.R. 4310) that could have a devastating effect on the fleet of civilian-operated historic military aircraft.
The amendment introduced by Rep. Michael Turner (R-OH) would bar the Department of Defense from loaning or gifting any U.S. military aircraft or parts to any entity except those that would put the aircraft on static display, such as in a museum. The amendment would preclude the aircraft from being loaned to private individuals, associations, or museums where there is any intent of flying the historic vintage warbirds, even at air shows or demonstrations of support for veterans.
Military branches such as the U.S. Air Force often do not donate aircraft to private groups outright; they instead "loan" them under a Defense Department provision called Title 10 to individuals and groups for indefinite periods. These private individuals and groups usually restore and operate the aircraft at their own expense to demonstrate these pieces of flying history to events such as EAA AirVenture Oshkosh.
"The Department of Defense has made numerous attempts through the years to preclude any former military aircraft from being flown in civilian hands," said Doug Macnair, EAA's vice president of government relations. "This view has never been supported by any safety or security imperative and is currently being couched as a move to supposedly 'preserve' rare military aircraft. We can be assured that the U.S. military has neither the funding nor the mandate to preserve these aircraft in flying condition, which would leave the only option for them to be used as static museum displays. That would truly be a tragedy and a loss of our aviation and military heritage."
Rep. Turner's district includes Dayton, Ohio, home of the National Museum of the U.S. Air Force, which has been adamant in its attempts to ground former U.S. military aircraft. Ironically, Dayton is the same site where this week more than 20 B-25 bombers - preserved and flown by private groups and individuals - are gathering in a public spectacle to honor the 70th anniversary of the famed Doolittle Raid on Japan.
EAA and the other warbird groups are working with staff in the House's Armed Services Committee and Transportation and Infrastructure Committee, as well as the House General Aviation Caucus as the Defense Authorization Bill goes into initial committee review next week and to the House floor in early May. Although the exact language of the amendment has not been shared with the aviation community or widely on Capitol Hill, Rep. Turner plans to push the amendment despite initial congressional opposition.
EAA and Warbirds of America recommend that members contact their congressional representatives, urging them to voice their opposition to the Turner amendment and in support of maintaining the private ability to restore and fly these historic aircraft.
From-
http://www.aviationpros.com/press_relea ... B120413002
The amendment introduced by Rep. Michael Turner (R-OH) would bar the Department of Defense from loaning or gifting any U.S. military aircraft or parts to any entity except those that would put the aircraft on static display, such as in a museum. The amendment would preclude the aircraft from being loaned to private individuals, associations, or museums where there is any intent of flying the historic vintage warbirds, even at air shows or demonstrations of support for veterans.
Military branches such as the U.S. Air Force often do not donate aircraft to private groups outright; they instead "loan" them under a Defense Department provision called Title 10 to individuals and groups for indefinite periods. These private individuals and groups usually restore and operate the aircraft at their own expense to demonstrate these pieces of flying history to events such as EAA AirVenture Oshkosh.
"The Department of Defense has made numerous attempts through the years to preclude any former military aircraft from being flown in civilian hands," said Doug Macnair, EAA's vice president of government relations. "This view has never been supported by any safety or security imperative and is currently being couched as a move to supposedly 'preserve' rare military aircraft. We can be assured that the U.S. military has neither the funding nor the mandate to preserve these aircraft in flying condition, which would leave the only option for them to be used as static museum displays. That would truly be a tragedy and a loss of our aviation and military heritage."
Rep. Turner's district includes Dayton, Ohio, home of the National Museum of the U.S. Air Force, which has been adamant in its attempts to ground former U.S. military aircraft. Ironically, Dayton is the same site where this week more than 20 B-25 bombers - preserved and flown by private groups and individuals - are gathering in a public spectacle to honor the 70th anniversary of the famed Doolittle Raid on Japan.
EAA and the other warbird groups are working with staff in the House's Armed Services Committee and Transportation and Infrastructure Committee, as well as the House General Aviation Caucus as the Defense Authorization Bill goes into initial committee review next week and to the House floor in early May. Although the exact language of the amendment has not been shared with the aviation community or widely on Capitol Hill, Rep. Turner plans to push the amendment despite initial congressional opposition.
EAA and Warbirds of America recommend that members contact their congressional representatives, urging them to voice their opposition to the Turner amendment and in support of maintaining the private ability to restore and fly these historic aircraft.
From-
http://www.aviationpros.com/press_relea ... B120413002
Last edited by 51fixer on Sat Apr 21, 2012 5:18 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Re: Here we go again
Thu Apr 19, 2012 10:59 am
Ironically, Dayton is the same site where this week more than 20 B-25 bombers - preserved and flown by private groups and individuals - are gathering in a public spectacle to honor the 70th anniversary of the famed Doolittle Raid on Japan.
Irony doesn't even begin to describe this statement.
Re: Here we go again
Thu Apr 19, 2012 11:47 am
quote "Rep. Turner's district includes Dayton, Ohio, home of the National Museum of the U.S. Air Force, which has been adamant in its attempts to ground former U.S. military aircraft."
Wait, if you look really closely you can see the strings!
"Pay no attention to that man [in blue] behind the curtain!!!"
Wait, if you look really closely you can see the strings!
"Pay no attention to that man [in blue] behind the curtain!!!"
Re: Here we go again
Thu Apr 19, 2012 12:13 pm
51fixer wrote:
EAA and Warbirds of America recommend that members contact their congressional representatives, urging them to voice their opposition to the Turner amendment and in support of maintaining the private ability to restore and fly these historic aircraft.
Done.
Mudge the activist
Re: Here we go again
Thu Apr 19, 2012 2:32 pm
I can't find that HR number on the site? maybe missprint?
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/thomas
If someone can find out and let me know i will look it up and find what they up to.
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/thomas
If someone can find out and let me know i will look it up and find what they up to.
Re: Here we go again
Thu Apr 19, 2012 3:11 pm
H.R. 4310 is what I've seen in other internal CAF communications. One comment was that its wording wasn't "widely shared" yet. You can read CAF CEO Steve Brown's comments in his blog here: http://commemorativeairforce.org/?page=cms/index&cms_page=1267
Randy
Randy
Re: Here we go again
Thu Apr 19, 2012 5:55 pm
email sent
This seems to happen every year, I guess may once it might get through if we are not vigilant
This seems to happen every year, I guess may once it might get through if we are not vigilant
Re: Here we go again
Thu Apr 19, 2012 6:22 pm
So let me get this straight... This is legal:
...yet this isn't?...
http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/modern ... -7257.html
This is...
Yet this isn't?
(I know one is wrecked, but its still an airplane that the Koreans could have used in the 60's)
Something tells me that our 2nd Amendment isn't being used right now...
Why can't we buy current military jets? Because our Government doesn't trust us and thinks we will sell them to our enemy's (North Korea...)
Yet they can sell off F-14's to Iran. And let North Korea keep our old Skyraiders.
...yet this isn't?...
http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/modern ... -7257.html
This is...
Yet this isn't?
(I know one is wrecked, but its still an airplane that the Koreans could have used in the 60's)
Something tells me that our 2nd Amendment isn't being used right now...
Why can't we buy current military jets? Because our Government doesn't trust us and thinks we will sell them to our enemy's (North Korea...)
Yet they can sell off F-14's to Iran. And let North Korea keep our old Skyraiders.
Last edited by Wildchild on Thu Apr 19, 2012 6:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Here we go again
Thu Apr 19, 2012 6:24 pm
Dude it's legal to sell F-15's to Israel.
Re: Here we go again
Thu Apr 19, 2012 6:28 pm
PinecastleAAF wrote:Dude it's legal to sell F-15's to Israel.
Yet not to Americans...?
Re: Here we go again
Thu Apr 19, 2012 6:43 pm
I think you misunderstood. That blue 6 pointed star is the Star of David and it's on F-15's.
Re: Here we go again
Thu Apr 19, 2012 6:53 pm
...Whoops...
Re: Here we go again
Thu Apr 19, 2012 8:42 pm
Didn't read the whole Bill, but doesn't it try to make the act retroactive? So bye bye Fifi etc.?
Re: Here we go again
Thu Apr 19, 2012 9:30 pm
I think if I owned a WWII a/c and this bill passed, the day before it was to be "stolen" (isn't that what it's called when someone takes your property by force?) it might just get "accidentally" destroyed in a fire. OOPS! Let 'em haul away the ashes.
Mudge the vindictive
Mudge the vindictive
Re: Here we go again
Fri Apr 20, 2012 7:08 am
Fifi will be fine. Don't burn up your warbirds yet. This comes around almost every year and it always gets worked out. Hey, at least they guy is a Republican, right? 