Corsair Canopy Question

[John Ceglarek]

I was in a discussion at lunch today with a person who stated that "almost all" of the WWII Corsairs had framing in the canopy...I don't mean the -1 birdcage, but the two frames that were in the -1A canopy. My reply was that, based on my reading, most -1Ds and all -4s used the canopy without the framing. Can any of the Corsair experts here shed light on the question?

Thanks,

John

[corsairboss]

The F4U-4 did not use them..not sure about all -1D...now something some of you do not know, is that some of the -4 used early model front windscreen...!!![/b[b]] "Check Out #9"

[Zachary Weibel]

almost positive the FG1D did not, as marines dream is a 1D and i am starring at a pic of her now

[51fixer]

As the technology advanced and proved itself in the plastics industry you had larger canopies as time went on.
IIRC the next step from the birdcage canopy of the earliest Corsairs was the semi bubble canopy with the twin bars. Both F4U and FG featured that canopy early on.
The 1 piece plexiglass style followed.
The earlier twin bar was often replaced by the 1 piece units as they became avail.
The POF Corsair has flown with both.
I believe I have some Goodyear photos of FGs that show both.
Rich

[Jerry O'Neill]

almost positive the FG1D did not, as marines dream is a 1D and i am starring at a pic of her now

Just because a restored aircraft has a particular style doesn't mean that was true back in the day. I'm not arguing with the canopy framing not being on FG's, but just that you need to be careful when using a new restoration as a reference.
Jerry

[corsair166b]

Just in the photo above it looks like to me you can see the two different styles of -4 canopies, the earlier models with the old rounded canopy front piece, while on the Corsair behind it the front piece looks to be a flat front panel, which would be ubiquitous to the Corsairs through the end of the plane's production run. The General rule with Corsairs was: Birdcage canopy=dash 1 Corsair, two support bars= dash 1A Corsair, no support bars= dash 1D Corsair, Flat windscreen up front and no support bars= dash 4 Corsairs. This was, as illustrated above, not an absolute rule however, and there were variations here and there.

Mark

[51fixer]

Goodyear Corsair KD 178 for the Royal Navy-
Photo dated July 8, 1944


Goodyear FG-1 BU 13972 dated March 28, 1944-


A bit non standard-
Goodyear FG-1A BU 14091 dated June 27, 1944 used for development of the bubble canopy for the F2G.


Photo info as printed on the backs of the pics.

Rich

[corsair166b]

Always wondered why they did'nt put the bubble canopied regular R-2800 powered Corsairs (Bottom photo, above) into service...great looking machines with superior all round vision....

Mark

[RMAllnutt]

Always wondered why they did'nt put the bubble canopied regular R-2800 powered Corsairs (Bottom photo, above) into service...great looking machines with superior all round vision....

Mark

That aircraft was a one off, I believe, to prove the concept of the bubble canopy. You are right though... it is a gorgeous looking machine! Putting these into production would have meant a radical change in the production line at a time when the war was winding to a close. I guess it just wasn't deemed necessary.

Cheers,
Richard

[Warbird Kid]

Im kind of curious to this one of kind design. If I was doing a Corsair data plate restoration I'd consider finishing it this way. Heck lets go for the gold and put a full second set of controls in too.

[RMAllnutt]

The F4U-4 did not use them..not sure about all -1D...now something some of you do not know, is that some of the -4 used early model front windscreen...!!![/b[b]] "Check Out #9"

Actually, a few -4 corsairs did use the earlier, re-inforced canopy. Certainly the WWII prototype -4's did, but you are right in that they changed to the fully blown style fairly early on in the -4's life. I do believe the Corsairs which saw active service in WWII only used the birdcage, or the re-inforced canopy. According to my Illustrated Parts Manual, dated 1 December, 1945, the birdcage canopy was replaced by the reinforced, blown canopy from Bu.17647 on upwards (no mention of when this happened on the British Corsairs). Interestingly, there is not one single reference to the fully blown canopy in my manual, so my guess is that they didn't appear on production aircraft until after WWII was over. I can't prove it of course, but the manual, you would expect, would be pretty much up to date. Does anyone have a -4 parts manual to go searching through?

Cheers,
Richard

PS. Mint... the -4's you showed in that gorgeous photo are all post 1947, since they have the bar in the insignia. Not sure this means much, except that it doesn't show WWII-era wartime -4's in service. Lovely photo though... wow! It also shows two styles of -4 canopies and windscreens, so it's really interesting from that perspective too!

[51fixer]

As far as I know this is a Birdcage Canopy-
Goodyear Oct, 1943.


The twin bar canopy is basically the same shape as the full blown canopy on the FG-1 and F4U-1 series.

I believe in the -4 and later versions constantly changed the pilot position to give better visibility. I don't know how much the canopy changed or whether they raised it up higher.

Rich

[RMAllnutt]

The two main F4U-4 canopy versions are clearly demonstrated in Mint's photo. The aircraft in the foreground has pretty much the same windscreen and canopy setup as the late model F4U-1D... notice how the windscreen is a continuous curve, and the canopy is more or less a continuous curve in profile as well. The F4U-4's to its rear though have the late model F4U-4 arrangements with a flat forward windscreen (incorporating the armored glass) and a bowed out, and flatter profiled canopy. It's a really good illustration of both types. As I said earlier though... the very early -4's had the re-inforced canopy like he F4U-1A and early F4U-1D's.

Cheers,
Richard

[whistlingdeath77]

field modifications happened all the time and they used whatever parts were usable to get the corsairs up the next day. We all know about the canopy's of the corsair. It wasn't uncommon to have a f4u-1 or a f4u-1a canopy's changed in the field or stateside. Nobody is wrong in this thread. Everybody touched on the subject pretty good

[RMAllnutt]

field modifications happened all the time and they used whatever parts were usable to get the corsairs up the next day. We all know about the canopy's of the corsair. It wasn't uncommon to have a f4u-1 or a f4u-1a canopy's changed in the field or stateside. Nobody is wrong in this thread. Everybody touched on the subject pretty good

Well, actually, this thread started talking about whether the full blown canopy was used in combat during WWII or not. Judging by the parts manual (dated 1st Dec, 1945) it seems like the full blown canopy was not in the system during WWII, and didn't arrive until after the war was over. I agree that things like canopies could, and did get changed in the field... but if the canopy design or parts were not available this wouldn't have happened in WWII. I doubt if such a significant design change would have eluded the manual if it were available at the time... certainly not so late after the war, but it is always possible I suppose. I guess what we really need to determine whether the fully blown canopy was used in WWII or not is a photograph with a proven date showing the corsair in the combat theatre with said design. Jack? Any help?

Cheers,
Richard

Last edited by RMAllnutt on Sat Jul 17, 2010 6:07 pm, edited 2 times in total.