Falco Finis
Fri Feb 06, 2009 9:24 pm
CR-42 Libya 1942
Sat Feb 07, 2009 6:29 am
some ww 2 vintage italian warbird carcasses were found in iraq within recent years. i've seen the pics.
Sat Feb 07, 2009 8:25 am
Part of the reason Rommel was not allowed to WIN in N Africa.It was considered a backwater and thus never given enough troops, enough Air Cover, and enough supplies. Air superiority, especially over wide open desert environments with long, exposed supply lines is a MAJOR factor. Had the Suez fallen, opening the gates to the oil of the Middle-East to Hitler's war machine, things may have gone very differently, or in the least, much longer.
Biplanes as front-line fighters! Of course, the RAF was still using the Gladiator and "Stringbag"!
Biplanes as front-line fighters! Of course, the RAF was still using the Gladiator and "Stringbag"!
Biplanes as front line fighters
Sat Feb 07, 2009 9:35 am
Faith,Hope and Charity. Just wow.
Biplanes as front line fighters
Sat Feb 07, 2009 9:35 am
Faith,Hope and Charity. Just wow.
Sat Feb 07, 2009 4:40 pm
Hopefully our one will look like that one day..... 
Thanks for that one, Jack!
Thanks for that one, Jack!
Sat Feb 07, 2009 4:45 pm
Indian Head,
What does your "one" look like now??
Inquiring minds want to know...and also want pictures, please & thank-you.
John
What does your "one" look like now??
Inquiring minds want to know...and also want pictures, please & thank-you.
John
Sat Feb 07, 2009 5:21 pm
Did someone say Faith Hope and Charity (names of the three Glads who beat off the Italian AF until releived)
Sat Feb 07, 2009 5:31 pm
Isn't one of them preserved in a musem
Sat Feb 07, 2009 5:32 pm
On the Italian birds
Here is a bit more info on found airframes
article found at
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_q ... _n17174206
Afghanistan is still yielding its aeronautical treasures. The remains of two Meridionali IMAM Ro.37s (which was an Italian jackof-all-trades biplane from the 1930s) have been found on an aeronautical scrap yard on the outskirts of the Afghan capital, Kabul. As can be seen, the remains are incomplete and in poor condition, but are the only known remnants of this aircraft which was widely utilized by the Italians during World War Two in the Mediterranean and African theaters. The aircraft were found during a patrol by the 132nd Armored Artillery Regiment of the Italian Army, part of the Italfor XII contingent deployed in Afghanistan as part of the ISAF security force. The yard is lettered with abandoned military equipment, including remains of some of the dozen Avro Anson Mk. I8s delivered to the Royal Afghan Air Force in 1948. The Ro.37 first flew in 1934, and three years later Afghanistan purchased 16 of the machines. In March, the remains, which retain their Piaggio P.X radial engines, were still in Afghanistan, from where the Italians have already recovered a WWII Italian light tank. Although restoration of the Ro.37s would be an extremely challenging task, the aircraft would fill an important gap in the ranks of surviving Italian WWII military aircraft. The only complete Meridionali aircraft in existence is an Ro.43 seaplane at the Italian Air Force Museum at Vigna di Valle. Also, the GruppoAmtd VelivoliStarici is currently rebuilding an Ro.41 biplane fighter trainer which will also go on exhibit at the museum.
Here is a bit more info on found airframes
article found at
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_q ... _n17174206
Afghanistan is still yielding its aeronautical treasures. The remains of two Meridionali IMAM Ro.37s (which was an Italian jackof-all-trades biplane from the 1930s) have been found on an aeronautical scrap yard on the outskirts of the Afghan capital, Kabul. As can be seen, the remains are incomplete and in poor condition, but are the only known remnants of this aircraft which was widely utilized by the Italians during World War Two in the Mediterranean and African theaters. The aircraft were found during a patrol by the 132nd Armored Artillery Regiment of the Italian Army, part of the Italfor XII contingent deployed in Afghanistan as part of the ISAF security force. The yard is lettered with abandoned military equipment, including remains of some of the dozen Avro Anson Mk. I8s delivered to the Royal Afghan Air Force in 1948. The Ro.37 first flew in 1934, and three years later Afghanistan purchased 16 of the machines. In March, the remains, which retain their Piaggio P.X radial engines, were still in Afghanistan, from where the Italians have already recovered a WWII Italian light tank. Although restoration of the Ro.37s would be an extremely challenging task, the aircraft would fill an important gap in the ranks of surviving Italian WWII military aircraft. The only complete Meridionali aircraft in existence is an Ro.43 seaplane at the Italian Air Force Museum at Vigna di Valle. Also, the GruppoAmtd VelivoliStarici is currently rebuilding an Ro.41 biplane fighter trainer which will also go on exhibit at the museum.
Sat Feb 07, 2009 6:01 pm
mustangdriver wrote:Isn't one of them preserved in a musem
The fuselage of Faith is at the Malta War Museum I beleive. Don't know much about it's originality though. Maybe someone could elaborate?
Sat Feb 07, 2009 6:43 pm
Where do you want to start?
Faith Hope & Charity? File under 'print the legend'.
Yes, there were just a few (Sea) Gladiators to defend Malta, but not only three, and the first Gladiator kill occurred after the first Hurricanes had arrived. The bravery of the pilots flying the Glads and the Maltese should not be underestimated, but the story's myth.
There is a Gladiator fuselage preserved on Malta, allegedly 'Faith' It may have been the remains of one of the active Sea Gladiators, or more likely one of the cannibalised wrecks.
One of the Ro37s is now in the Italian Air Force Museum.
Don't underestimate the efficiency of the crews using obsolete biplane fighters. See here for the long sga of W.W.II biplane aces.
http://surfcity.kund.dalnet.se/
Your logic's sound, but it's quite possible that the photo pre-dates the Germans arriving in North Africa. The initial combats were between the Italians and the British, and the overstretched British couldn't devote sufficient resources for a decisive victory. Rommell and the Afrika Corps were sent to reinforce the Italians, and did so on two fronts - Greece and N Africa, splitting the already thin British forces in N Africa. Just like the British, the Germans were unable to allocate enough resources from elsewhere. Malta sat right across their supply lines which is why it was so important. (Where would you draw resources from to win in N Africa?)
The Finns did quite well with Glads, too. You use what you've got.
The Fairey Swordfish ('Stringbag') navy torpedo bomber decisively altered the balance of power in the Mediterranean with the attack on Taranto. This was the inspiration for the Japanese for the attack on Pearl Harbor. Swordfish were also crucial on the MAC Ships in the Atlantic and the catching and sinking of the Bismark. While they shouldn't be still in service (the Channel Dash was a disgraceful debacle) don't underestimate the Swordfish.
AFAIK, the Swordfish was the only aircraft to sink THREE ships with ONE torpedo.
Cheers,
Faith Hope & Charity? File under 'print the legend'.
Yes, there were just a few (Sea) Gladiators to defend Malta, but not only three, and the first Gladiator kill occurred after the first Hurricanes had arrived. The bravery of the pilots flying the Glads and the Maltese should not be underestimated, but the story's myth.
There is a Gladiator fuselage preserved on Malta, allegedly 'Faith' It may have been the remains of one of the active Sea Gladiators, or more likely one of the cannibalised wrecks.
One of the Ro37s is now in the Italian Air Force Museum.
Don't underestimate the efficiency of the crews using obsolete biplane fighters. See here for the long sga of W.W.II biplane aces.
http://surfcity.kund.dalnet.se/
Holedigger wrote:Part of the reason Rommel was not allowed to WIN in N Africa....
Your logic's sound, but it's quite possible that the photo pre-dates the Germans arriving in North Africa. The initial combats were between the Italians and the British, and the overstretched British couldn't devote sufficient resources for a decisive victory. Rommell and the Afrika Corps were sent to reinforce the Italians, and did so on two fronts - Greece and N Africa, splitting the already thin British forces in N Africa. Just like the British, the Germans were unable to allocate enough resources from elsewhere. Malta sat right across their supply lines which is why it was so important. (Where would you draw resources from to win in N Africa?)
Holedigger wrote:Biplanes as front-line fighters! Of course, the RAF was still using the Gladiator and "Stringbag"!
The Finns did quite well with Glads, too. You use what you've got.
The Fairey Swordfish ('Stringbag') navy torpedo bomber decisively altered the balance of power in the Mediterranean with the attack on Taranto. This was the inspiration for the Japanese for the attack on Pearl Harbor. Swordfish were also crucial on the MAC Ships in the Atlantic and the catching and sinking of the Bismark. While they shouldn't be still in service (the Channel Dash was a disgraceful debacle) don't underestimate the Swordfish.
AFAIK, the Swordfish was the only aircraft to sink THREE ships with ONE torpedo.
Cheers,
Sat Feb 07, 2009 6:59 pm
The strike at Taranto really needs to be made into a movie.....yet few outside of us historical geeks have even heard of it. Or for that matter, the Italian mini sub attack at Alexandria, the see-saw battle for the Med with Malta at the center. Rommel himself tried to get permission to invade it and take that thorn out of his side and was denied. Don't know what he would have done it with! With both sides stretched so thin at times, an extra division here or there would have made a decisive victory possible.