fitting a patrol bomber into a small hangar, can it be done
Tue Jan 01, 2008 11:23 am
Is it possiable to fit a WWII Harpoon patrol bomber into a hangar intented for a single engine spam can ? Well, Pooner seemed to think it could be done, and Myself, Gary Hilton, and several other decieded to help with the madness. Actually, I think we just wanted to see if it was possiable.
The faces of WIX, Pooner is on the left, Gary Hilton is on the right
Do you think it will fit ?
Tail cone off
nose removed, there are 40 bolts holding the nose on, then another 30 that are hidden.
tank removed,
When we removed the tank, we found out the CG shifted forward and the plane started to do a head stand. If it was not for a 4ft fiberglass ladder under the nose, and someone diving into the tail, it would have gone onto the cowls. We filled the tail with prop domes and anything else we could find that was heavy.
I have more to upload, but photobucket is being stupid right now
The faces of WIX, Pooner is on the left, Gary Hilton is on the right
Do you think it will fit ?
Tail cone off
nose removed, there are 40 bolts holding the nose on, then another 30 that are hidden.
tank removed,
When we removed the tank, we found out the CG shifted forward and the plane started to do a head stand. If it was not for a 4ft fiberglass ladder under the nose, and someone diving into the tail, it would have gone onto the cowls. We filled the tail with prop domes and anything else we could find that was heavy.
I have more to upload, but photobucket is being stupid right now
Last edited by Matt Gunsch on Tue Jan 01, 2008 11:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
Tue Jan 01, 2008 11:32 am
Awesome stuff Matt. Thanks for sharing.
How does tail section attach? Just bolts around the perimiter?
Shay
_____________
Semper Fortis
How does tail section attach? Just bolts around the perimiter?
Shay
_____________
Semper Fortis
Tue Jan 01, 2008 11:38 am
That'll certainly open the gawker's eyes when they taxi or drive by your open hangar doors! 
Scott
Scott
Tue Jan 01, 2008 11:38 am
Pooner has a defective tape measure
Pooner and the still defective tape
almost there
a little more to go
we did it
We had to pull the door off the track to get it around the prop shaft, then put it back on the track. The left shaft is against the door and if the tires loose any pressure, Pooner will be fixing the hole from the prop shaft coming thru the door.
Pooner and the still defective tape
almost there
a little more to go
we did it
We had to pull the door off the track to get it around the prop shaft, then put it back on the track. The left shaft is against the door and if the tires loose any pressure, Pooner will be fixing the hole from the prop shaft coming thru the door.
Tue Jan 01, 2008 12:21 pm
Congratulations on a great packing job! If Elly and I ever move we may be giving you folks a call. By the way, that sure is a nice turret sitting next to the aft fuselage in that last photo. MPC?
Scott
Scott
Tue Jan 01, 2008 12:22 pm
I think we're now the resident experts at FFZ with the most amount of airplane in a single confined space. Or better yet, as someone short on words but deep in thought said when he drove by, "That's 12 pounds of crap in a 8 pound sack, guys!"
Pooner's tape died of fright when it saw the project ahead. All went well staging the beast into the hangar bay, and as Matt noted the disassembly of nose cone and tail commenced. Nose is fastened to the fuselage by what appeared to be 1,000 small bolts. Manual hinted at 40 plus; we suspect there's another 20 or so put in for good measure. Maybe Lockheed paid engineers a bonus to incorporate extra hardware into their design drawings?
We were assured by former operators that dropping the tail and pulling the tank would no adversely affect CG to the tail section. Ah, but it does. I think we found another corporate sponsor - Werner - the firm that makes fibreglass ladders. Had it not been for the placement of the four foot ladder toward the nose bulkhead and a crew member jumping into the back of the fuselage, we'd have had 'Poon on the floor and thru the roof. And that would not have been pretty...
We discovered in the middle of the project the Harpoon has tapered hips. For many months the collective thought was the widest length of our beast was measured from spar tip to spar tip, leading edge. Our measurements showed 19' 8" from this area. We knew we had 20' to work with beam to beam in the hangar. Yup, call us overly confident until we discovered the ever so slight taper to the back of the center section - 20' 3 inches.... insert naughty word here times 100....
Not quite easy to jiggle and wiggle 14,500 +/- pounds of plane into a tight spot. Boeing employee Greg Sisson is credited with saving the day with his suggestion to stagger the beast slightly, close a door, remove a door from the bottom track, slide a door, and ultimately, in she went.
This weekend, Pooner crew will drill more than a few rivets and remove a trailing edge wing panel and a rib. Then a little repositioning and she'll slide back another foot or so into the barn and door movement will be back to normal.
Wow! More than a few gray hairs produced over that one. Thanks to the collective efforts of Matt Gunsch, Gary Hilton, Greg Sisson, Larry and Nathan Welty, Stevie Glenba, Merle Shawver, J.W. Moore, Scott Thompson, Dave Klingensmith and countless other who dropped in and out to push, offer words of encouragement and a plate of cookies - we did it!
Now, just what to do with a much modified C-119 fuel cell - appx. 850 gallons or so - that appeared when the Poon pooped her magical egg? We decided against using it as a ferry tank, but other suggestions included a boat, a submarine, survival shelter or gun range target. Still smells of malthion, so if anyone wanted to store sweaters or wool clothing it it I can personally warranty against moth or bug damage for the next 100 years!
Pooner's tape died of fright when it saw the project ahead. All went well staging the beast into the hangar bay, and as Matt noted the disassembly of nose cone and tail commenced. Nose is fastened to the fuselage by what appeared to be 1,000 small bolts. Manual hinted at 40 plus; we suspect there's another 20 or so put in for good measure. Maybe Lockheed paid engineers a bonus to incorporate extra hardware into their design drawings?
We were assured by former operators that dropping the tail and pulling the tank would no adversely affect CG to the tail section. Ah, but it does. I think we found another corporate sponsor - Werner - the firm that makes fibreglass ladders. Had it not been for the placement of the four foot ladder toward the nose bulkhead and a crew member jumping into the back of the fuselage, we'd have had 'Poon on the floor and thru the roof. And that would not have been pretty...
We discovered in the middle of the project the Harpoon has tapered hips. For many months the collective thought was the widest length of our beast was measured from spar tip to spar tip, leading edge. Our measurements showed 19' 8" from this area. We knew we had 20' to work with beam to beam in the hangar. Yup, call us overly confident until we discovered the ever so slight taper to the back of the center section - 20' 3 inches.... insert naughty word here times 100....
Not quite easy to jiggle and wiggle 14,500 +/- pounds of plane into a tight spot. Boeing employee Greg Sisson is credited with saving the day with his suggestion to stagger the beast slightly, close a door, remove a door from the bottom track, slide a door, and ultimately, in she went.
This weekend, Pooner crew will drill more than a few rivets and remove a trailing edge wing panel and a rib. Then a little repositioning and she'll slide back another foot or so into the barn and door movement will be back to normal.
Wow! More than a few gray hairs produced over that one. Thanks to the collective efforts of Matt Gunsch, Gary Hilton, Greg Sisson, Larry and Nathan Welty, Stevie Glenba, Merle Shawver, J.W. Moore, Scott Thompson, Dave Klingensmith and countless other who dropped in and out to push, offer words of encouragement and a plate of cookies - we did it!
Now, just what to do with a much modified C-119 fuel cell - appx. 850 gallons or so - that appeared when the Poon pooped her magical egg? We decided against using it as a ferry tank, but other suggestions included a boat, a submarine, survival shelter or gun range target. Still smells of malthion, so if anyone wanted to store sweaters or wool clothing it it I can personally warranty against moth or bug damage for the next 100 years!
Tue Jan 01, 2008 12:32 pm
Good eyes, my friend! PB4Y-2 tail turret -Southeastern MFG. Co. if memory serves with a lot of MPC parts from a damaged Libby tail turret inside as spares. The piece of orange painted vertical back there is from -4Y as well. We've got some different species back there, all part of our evil genetic experimentation going on down here... 
You can't see it in the photo series just because of the angles (and the obvious - the "Big Gal" in the middle) - but there's a fair amount of hollow spots behind the center section and underneath the beastie. Soon and we get done drilling and repositioning I'll post a shot or two with the doors open. Then it'll be a simple deal to slide in the wings underneath all of this and still a little room to work inside the cockpit and fuselage.
You can't see it in the photo series just because of the angles (and the obvious - the "Big Gal" in the middle) - but there's a fair amount of hollow spots behind the center section and underneath the beastie. Soon and we get done drilling and repositioning I'll post a shot or two with the doors open. Then it'll be a simple deal to slide in the wings underneath all of this and still a little room to work inside the cockpit and fuselage.
Tue Jan 01, 2008 1:21 pm
Hey Pooner....looks like my hangar used to. Two quick hints to make things easier on you.. Fab an "L" shaped support to mate to the aft bulkhead of the main fuselage. Add a set of castering, larger diameter wheels and some rigidly attached bracing. If you design it so the leg of the L is under the fuselage, you have the support you need for it, a platform for ballast and it's movable without a guide person, and it can keep things clear of the bulkhead area. If you do it right, it can be used to level the fuselage at the same time ot make it easier to do internal work without having to work up or down hill
The second, is sorta like I suggested in the other thread, but seeing pics of your place I had a better thought.... Set up a pair of pallet rack uprights centered on the fuselage, but spaced at the back wall of the hangar and about 8 feet out towards the front of the hangar. Put in a set of 12' bars high enough to store one wing nearly at the top of the hangar and space down enough to do the same with the second wing. Might have to jack the wing up into position and then install the bars, but either way, it will get the wings off the floor and help prevent hangar rash.
Going vertical with the tail cone on a wheeled platform would also help and it would be mobile for clearing work space.
BTDTGTTS
The second, is sorta like I suggested in the other thread, but seeing pics of your place I had a better thought.... Set up a pair of pallet rack uprights centered on the fuselage, but spaced at the back wall of the hangar and about 8 feet out towards the front of the hangar. Put in a set of 12' bars high enough to store one wing nearly at the top of the hangar and space down enough to do the same with the second wing. Might have to jack the wing up into position and then install the bars, but either way, it will get the wings off the floor and help prevent hangar rash.
Going vertical with the tail cone on a wheeled platform would also help and it would be mobile for clearing work space.
BTDTGTTS
A few more pictures of hangar stuffing.
Tue Jan 01, 2008 1:33 pm
PV-2 disassembly, or we just got a new/old kit plane to put in the hangar. Where are the instructions 
???
Working on nose removal, just a few more nuts and bolts.
The nose is removed.
Only four nuts and bolts left on the tail removal. Good thing we did not remove the tail section and tank in the dark.
Next step is to pull the tank, and what a beauty it is
.
The four foot ladder that stopped the tilt .
This is what she looks like inside with the tail section and tank removed.
Here is the cockpit.
Just a few more feet back and she will be in her new home.
This is a shot before disassembly.
???
Working on nose removal, just a few more nuts and bolts.
The nose is removed.
Only four nuts and bolts left on the tail removal. Good thing we did not remove the tail section and tank in the dark.
Next step is to pull the tank, and what a beauty it is
.
The four foot ladder that stopped the tilt
.
This is what she looks like inside with the tail section and tank removed.
Here is the cockpit.
Just a few more feet back and she will be in her new home.
This is a shot before disassembly.
Tue Jan 01, 2008 2:10 pm
Great stuff, guys! Keep us up to date with lots of photos and progress reports, "Gary Austin style". The Harpoon has become a rare breed, and it will be great to see this one restored!
Cheers!
Cheers!
Tue Jan 01, 2008 2:19 pm
Hey POONER ! What's that stuff all over your face ? Does the City of Mesa have your picture in the Post office again ? Ya been hiding out in the Superstitions ? I wouldn't have recognized you if Matt hadn't identied you ! The disguise is definitely working, if that's what you're going for.
Harpoon looks great, ya certainly do have a knack for filling up that hangar !
Harpoon looks great, ya certainly do have a knack for filling up that hangar !
Tue Jan 01, 2008 4:31 pm
Great stuff Pooner. Is this the one you got out of Memorial? I guess you just can't stand having an empty hangar. By the way, I guess this qualifies as having an airplane in your hangar so the city can't throw you out. Are you going to try to get any of the Poons flying? See ya around FFZ.
Tue Jan 01, 2008 6:10 pm
you should market the shoe horn you used!!!
Tue Jan 01, 2008 6:11 pm
Hey Rob - You got a receipt for all that stuff?
Tue Jan 01, 2008 7:38 pm
Nathan Welty
A pin in a poke?
N ight time at the oaisis
Pooner, Mat, and Larry (the Poon Guy) Welty